How to proceed / M-Audio ProjectMix

[peritus]

Okay...

Disclaimer: I wasn't around when the go ahead was made to purchase the following. Also, the list in not yet complete. I will be posting a more complete equipment inventory of the studio, ASAP.....

As it stands today, here is the list of equipment at our studio (not my personal studio). I will have to fill in some of the blanks later.

P4 Windows XP PC

Korg Triton Studio

Korg D1600mkII

Cheap Keyboard with MIDI

CAD condenser microphone

ElectroVoice condenser microphone

"Club" PA system (I dunno anything about PA's but I can tell this thing costed big cash)

Behringer Truth Monitors

Cakewalk Project 5

-------------

Here's my deal with the list above...

1. We're doing urban music (aka Hip Hop, R&B, etc). For the most part, I see no use, in our studio even having the D1600mkII around. As a start-up firm, very little of our client base will require "live" recording, to THAT degree. I say that this piece of equipment should either be in "Studio A" (since "B" will be the small room ) , contracted for gigs (with me engineering, of course), or be traded/sold. I realize that it is capable of USB transfer (blah, blah, slow!), but it doesn't seem pratical or efficient, in this arena (keep reading, for more reasons why).

2. The quality level of each piece of equipment is like a seismic needle. I would like to spread the quality, evenly. Ya know: Signal chain mentality.... Don't get me wrong. I want the highest quality stuff we can afford, but Korg Triton Studio + Beri Truth's (AS THE MAIN MONITORING PAIR) = studio no-no, to me.

I have requested that the purchasing be halted, for a couple of days. It seems to me, that we need to take stock of what we have, how to use it efficiently, and how to set it up correctly.

I'd like to shift the studio into ProTools territory. No questions asked. For Hip Hop "reasons", ProTools will be the main DAW.

I am one of many faiths. So, I would like to keep a door open, to other DAW's, from a "we should have that ability, should we need it" perspective.

Does anyone else think we should sell/trade the D1600mkII, Beri Truths, and PA toward:

M-Audio ProjectMix / ProTools M-Powered 7.1
Event Precision 8 Monitors (maybe, hehe)

OR

Digidesign Digi 002 w/ Factory Bundle /Pro Tools LE
Some better-than-beri monitors

?????

Your thoughts on this?????

Thanks for taking the time to read my post!!!
Joshua

 

[Bulls Hit]

Definitely sell the gear. If it was me, I'd be leaning toward the Project Mix, it looks like a nice unit for the money. My experience with M-Audio gear was all positive. Is that the full version of Live in that bundle? That's a great program and will suit your urban beats to a T. Although I've just noticed you already have Project 5. I don't think you'd be losing much in quality compared to the 002 and you've nearly a grand left over for some worthy monitors

 

[peritus]

Definitely sell the gear. If it was me, I'd be leaning toward the Project Mix, it looks like a nice unit for the money. My experience with M-Audio gear was all positive. Is that the full version of Live in that bundle? That's a great program and will suit your urban beats to a T. Although I've just noticed you already have Project 5. I don't think you'd be losing much in quality compared to the 002 and you've nearly a grand left over for some worthy monitors

Thanks for the quick reply

Having a full version of Live would be sweet... I'm very happy with my M-Audio gear, except for lack of chaining capability and headphone preamps (Firewire 410).... Yeah.. Great monitors are VERY important to me..Hmm..

I've also reconsidered selling the Beri monitors.. My plan is to use them for reference... NOT as the main pair... Always good to have another set around...

Which brings me to a new point.. The Project Mix is limited in output... I'm going to look into the Mackie control.. I'm not sure if that would solve the problem, or not..

Still in decision mode...

Thanks again!

 

[Bulls Hit]

Yeah the "14" outputs. I don't know who would use 8 adat outs, or spdif. They'd be no good to me. They're also on the Tascam FW1884 if you want more outputs and more midi. Don't think it works with M Powered though, so you don't get the credibility by association with protools

 

[peritus]

Yeah the "14" outputs. I don't know who would use 8 adat outs, or spdif. They'd be no good to me. They're also on the Tascam FW1884 if you want more outputs and more midi. Don't think it works with M Powered though, so you don't get the credibility by association with protools

I feel ya.. I'm hoping that whatever the I/O, it will be enough to keep up with what appears to be a healthy spending habit..lol...

On a more serious note, I'd like to pack as much I/O as possible for any outboard mixing/processing that might be done...

Thank you, once again

P.S. What it really comes down to, on the PT tip, is that

1. I'm already familiar with it..
2. It's a good place to learn the ropes (for what I hope is a long career)
3. My home setup is PT based, so I can tweak at hizzome.. lol
4. The Hip Hop thing
5. It just works...

In all realness, I'm sure we could produce some great tracks with anything.. If I wasn't hell-bent on making money, for the firm, I'd familiarize myself with Linux DAWs.. Since they will soon be a force to reckon with..

Here's why... PARALLEL PROCESSING... WOOHOO!! I'm talking tens/hundreds/thousands of CPUs doing my plug-ins.. Yeeah Baby! Yeah

 

[charger]

Yep, my buddy just got one of those Project Mix boxes, and though I haven't had a chance to give it a spin yet, I think it's a fantastic deal and a great concept.

 

[bennychico11]

P.S. What it really comes down to, on the PT tip, is that

4. The Hip Hop thing

you know what I always thought was funny, is that people complain so much about PT's MIDI capabilities (and it has been behind the leading sequencers out there)...but a lot of people doing rap or hiphop, which is heavily MIDI based, still prefer to use Pro Tools.


Just curious as to why the huge attraction from a specific genre of music. Is it all those rap videos that have Pro Tools running in the background?

 

[peritus]

uhhh.. You must watch more rap videos than I.... I personally think it's a mass appeal thing... Like a Phillips Head Screwdriver!!! It's that the dude down the block wants to learn how the "pros" do it.. That is a mistake... Yet I still think we should use it.

I could easily compare ProTools and Windows as equals in the matter.... People know what Windows is... Windows is common... Most people learn Windows.... It's a cyclical effect.. "We didn't start the fire...."

Edit: When I say "how the pro's do it", I'm complaining about people who assume that it's the only way to go, based on the title of the DAW... On the MIDI thing.. Yeah.. I can't stand PT midi... Not real sure how to surmount that though.. Other than just get used to it... Your thoughts?

 

[peritus]

Yep, my buddy just got one of those Project Mix boxes, and though I haven't had a chance to give it a spin yet, I think it's a fantastic deal and a great concept.

Thanks Charger.. You gotta lure him away for a day or so.. lol.. And report back..

 

[bennychico11]

uhhh.. You must watch more rap videos than I.... I personally think it's a mass appeal thing... Like a Phillips Head Screwdriver!!! It's that the dude down the block wants to learn how the "pros" do it.. That is a mistake... Yet I still think we should use it.

I could easily compare ProTools and Windows as equals in the matter.... People know what Windows is... Windows is common... Most people learn Windows.... It's a cyclical effect.. "We didn't start the fire...."

Edit: When I say "how the pro's do it", I'm complaining about people who assume that it's the only way to go, based on the title of the DAW... On the MIDI thing.. Yeah.. I can't stand PT midi... Not real sure how to surmount that though.. Other than just get used to it... Your thoughts?

Well, the only reason I mentioned the rap videos is because I've seen several that seem to have been shot in a studio and there is always some perverbial shot of Pro Tools or the Control 24/Pro Control running. Then I came across some small, independent rap artists who do the same thing with their PTLE running off the Mbox. I just find it humorous. But of course, this relates to the "see what the pros do, then I should do it too" mentality that you mentioned. So I agree.
It's just ironic that they are the same ones later who complain about MIDI in PT when their idol's are the ones who turned them onto the software in the first place.

-B

 

[peritus]

Well, the only reason I mentioned the rap videos is because I've seen several that seem to have been shot in a studio and there is always some perverbial shot of Pro Tools or the Control 24/Pro Control running. Then I came across some small, independent rap artists who do the same thing with their PTLE running off the Mbox. I just find it humorous. But of course, this relates to the "see what the pros do, then I should do it too" mentality that you mentioned. So I agree.
It's just ironic that they are the same ones later who complain about MIDI in PT when their idol's are the ones who turned them onto the software in the first place.

-B

Agree! ... And a side question... I think it's possible to arrange MIDI from our Triton Studio end... Would that be better, just in your opinion?

BTW, it's too bad that there aren't dedicated MIDI sequencer plug-ins for PT... Maybe there is? I'm not sure if Rewire would work that way.. Hmmm....

 

[bennychico11]

Agree! ... And a side question... I think it's possible to arrange MIDI from our Triton Studio end... Would that be better, just in your opinion?

BTW, it's too bad that there aren't dedicated MIDI sequencer plug-ins for PT... Maybe there is? I'm not sure if Rewire would work that way.. Hmmm....

in the keyboard itself? eh, it all depends on which has more features for what you want. I personally like editing in computers if I'm doing digital, there's just more control that way, IMO. I don't do a ton of MIDI though, so I can't comment too much on which MIDI sequencers I like.

And are you talking about software synths for PT? There are lots out there...of course not as many as VST ones though. Although I'm sure the wrapper might work well in a lot of those situations. And yes, Rewire works for several different program...for example Reason Adapted that comes with LE.

 

[peritus]

in the keyboard itself? eh, it all depends on which has more features for what you want. I personally like editing in computers if I'm doing digital, there's just more control that way, IMO. I don't do a ton of MIDI though, so I can't comment too much on which MIDI sequencers I like.

Yeah, inside... Right on..

And are you talking about software synths for PT? There are lots out there...of course not as many as VST ones though. Although I'm sure the wrapper might work well in a lot of those situations. And yes, Rewire works for several different program...for example Reason Adapted that comes with LE.

Not really synths... I know how to use those pretty well.. Since I've had PT, I've done most of my MIDI and instrumentation from the Reason side.

I guess what I'd like to do, for example, is use the midi sequencer in Reason, to control Project 5 synths.....

Phat chance.. It would be SWEET for noobs though...

 

[peritus]

New question!!!

Okay...prices are Sweetwater catalog/website

Digi 002 Factory Bundle $2,195.97


OR

Digi 002 Rack Factory Bundle $1,549.97
Tascam US-2400 $799.97
= $2,349.94


Difference in price: $153.97

I know the Digi 002 has 8 faders.. Tascam has 25.. Anyone think it makes sense to go Tascam?

Edit: Plus, I'd be happier with my plug-ins being in a rack off to my side than on top of the desk.. Wires everywhere...

Edit 2: Dangit... No track names on the faders PLUS... It appears to be discontinued.. BLAH...

 

[peritus]

in the keyboard itself? eh, it all depends on which has more features for what you want. I personally like editing in computers if I'm doing digital, there's just more control that way, IMO. I don't do a ton of MIDI though, so I can't comment too much on which MIDI sequencers I like.

And are you talking about software synths for PT? There are lots out there...of course not as many as VST ones though. Although I'm sure the wrapper might work well in a lot of those situations. And yes, Rewire works for several different program...for example Reason Adapted that comes with LE.

Do you know if the bolded portion is still true?

"In addition to the 32 audio tracks (plus unlimited “takes”), the Pro Tools LE Version 5.2.2 included with the 002 features 128 MIDI tracks that run side-by-side with the audio. Subjectively, Pro Tools is an outstanding production program and, for those of us using MIDI, a passable composition program—unless you don’t rely on quick and extensive editing or integrated notation and other now-standard MIDI sequencer features. Pro Tools does do a very good job with MIDI timing, though, and many users import MIDI files into Pro Tools at the last stage to use the program for its audio production features.

For those people, there’s a Windows 002 ASIO driver so that you can use the unit as an audio interface (but not a control surface) for the software of your choice. Digidesign says that it’s working on a CoreAudio OS X driver for Mac, but there’s no OS 9 ASIO or Direct I/O driver."