How to input guitar?

[GuitarGrater]

Hi. I have a Scarlett solo 3rd gen, and an Ibanez gio guitar. At the moment I'm playing directly into the Scarlett to record in Reaper. It sounds a bit thin and digitized.

I want to have the best sound possible with the gear I have. So what is generally the best option:

Play direct into the AI and use Reaper vst to get better sound?

Mic up my Marshall combo and get the cleanest sound I can?

Buy a preamp and/or amp modeller?

I am trying to shape the sound using VSTs but there are so many and it's all a bit overwhelming. I will also probably have the same question for recording Bass, when I eventually buy one

 

[TalismanRich]

Well, it is "digitized" because that's exactly what an interface does! .

I'm sure it sounds thin when you compare to an amp, especially if you are using headphones because A) you have no tone controls to adjust the sound, and B) you haven't got a speaker blasting into a room.

That's exactly what modeling software plugins and hardware devices do. They simulate what your amp would do. The problem is that there are a gazillion amps out there, and they all have different sound profiles. So it's up to you to choose whether a plugin is the way to go, or something like a POD, Iridium, Helix or Fractal would do better for you. They will come with starting points... if you want a Plexi, then dial up the Plexi model.

In Reaper you have a built in Amp/Speaker Convolution modeller with pre programmed amps. That can give you a JCM800 or Dumble or Bassman starting points. You can then use an EQ plugin to adjust to tone. Remember, guitar speakers generally poop out by 8kHz so you don't really need 20-20K bandwidth. The response is down about 30dB somewhere around 70Hz and 8kHz for most speakers like a Vintage 30 or Jensen C12N.

One issue is that you could experience latency (a delay) if you are monitoring through the computer. You also don't have the "feel" that you get from sound in a room, especially if you like to play at volume. On the other hand, an amp which is mic'd up most likely won't sound the same as you hear it in the room, unless you typically listen with your ear 6 inches from the speaker!

Take some time, play with the modellers and try playing with a mic'd combo amp. See which way works for you. There may be times with the model works the best, especially if you want to record without disturbing others.

Also, don't go running down the road trying to find that mic preamp that thickens the sound and turns everything into magic! They don't exist. The differences in mic preamps are very VERY subtle compared to the differences in guitar amps.

 

[ecc83]

Listen to Rich GG. You have discovered why guitarists use "guitar" amplifiers! Because amps have internal "voicing" circuits to shape the tone but most of all, guitar speakers have a natural roll off at about 8kHz and a bit of a low mid "bump" at 80 to 120Hz. The filters in DAWs such as Reaper are "emulators" designed to mimic this tonal shaping. It can also be done with a totally analogue circuit and some pedals have such "EM" capabilities. Two I know well are the Blackstar HT-Dual and the later LT-Dual but no doubt there are many more now.

You COULD try miccing up your amp but that is quite skill to learn as well...we see a LOT of posts such as " why does my amp sound **** when I record it?"

Bass is, IMHO no where near such a problem, just plug it into the F'rite.

Dave.

 

[Eric Malone]

I don't agree that 'micing up an amp is quite a skill to learn'. I wouldn't discourage OP from doing it either. Everything about recording is a learning curve, you just have to try things, and hopefully gain some knowledge along the way.

Learning guitar and playing guitar *well* certainly is a skill to learn. Micing a guitar amp will take as much trial and error as using any emulator, which will sound equally as crappy if not used properly.

I've got my best guitar sounds using amps. Emulators are.. convenient, and I've also gotten good sound out of them as well.

You can always try micing up your Marshall, who knows it might be just the sound you were looking for.

EL

 

[GuitarGrater]

Thank you. I will try recording the same section a few times on different tracks and see what sounds best. It sounds like from these comments I have all the gear I need to get a decent sound so I'll just have to practice!

 

[rob aylestone]

All these things are fun to experiment with. I can't remember the last time I miked up a guitar cab anywhere other than on stage - and being very honest, slapping a 57 on a guitar cab is the easiest way to do it - and then depending if you want Brian May or Hank Marvin, it's down to EQ to replicate what your ears hear standing next to it. Guitarists and bass players run the range from no in-line gizmos at all and a non-tube amp to a collection of stomp boxes and amps turned up to 11. Direct Injection - sniffing what goes down the guitar cable - always sounds thin and a bit weedy, because it is!

 

[ecc83]

I don't agree that 'micing up an amp is quite a skill to learn'. I wouldn't discourage OP from doing it either. Everything about recording is a learning curve, you just have to try things, and hopefully gain some knowledge along the way.

Learning guitar and playing guitar *well* certainly is a skill to learn. Micing a guitar amp will take as much trial and error as using any emulator, which will sound equally as crappy if not used properly.

I've got my best guitar sounds using amps. Emulators are.. convenient, and I've also gotten good sound out of them as well.

You can always try micing up your Marshall, who knows it might be just the sound you were looking for.

EL

Well maybe "skill" was not quite the word to use but judging by the 100s of posts I have read in forums about recording amps, peeps find it a trial to get the sound they want sometimes Eric.

But OP can try both ways at once with one of these. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Cobra-ADP-...eywords=di+box+passive&qid=1739523291&sr=8-17

The XLR goes to the mic input on the AI and the jack output to the amp...two different tonal qualities to mix, match,EQ and generally fork about with.

Dave.

 

[BTStudio]

Well maybe "skill" was not quite the word to use but judging by the 100s of posts I have read in forums about recording amps, peeps find it a trial to get the sound they want sometimes Eric.

But OP can try both ways at once with one of these. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Cobra-ADP-...eywords=di+box+passive&qid=1739523291&sr=8-17

The XLR goes to the mic input on the AI and the jack output to the amp...two different tonal qualities to mix, match,EQ and generally fork about with.

Dave.

This is exactly how I am going to record my next elect guitar part. I’ve been struggling for a decent sound also and thought I could blend the Mike with the di plus vst tones to taste. Time will tell. Next project coming up in a couple months

 

[Papanate]

Hi. I have a Scarlett solo 3rd gen, and an Ibanez gio guitar. At the moment I'm playing directly into the Scarlett to record in Reaper. It sounds a bit thin and digitized.

That’s because it is - no EQ or Amp Model or IR’s will do that.

Play direct into the AI and use Reaper vst to get better sound?

That’s what you are doing - won’t work for most things.

Mic up my Marshall combo and get the cleanest sound I can?

Can you turn it up? Then yes you will get a sound - but you have to experiment with Microphone Placement - Amp Position - and Sound Dampening - It’s a lot of work - but will come with high Reward - one Caveat though - you have to be a good player to get good results -

Buy a preamp and/or amp modeller?

Reaper has Amps,Cabs and Effects - you can Also use Tonocracy which is Free Amps Modeler - or try Guitar Rig 7 by Native Instruments also free.

I am trying to shape the sound using VSTs but there are so many and it's all a bit overwhelming. I will also probably have the same question for recording Bass, when I eventually buy one

The thing with the VSTs and Guitar Amp Modelers is you start simple - as simple as you can - and as you get to understanding the Modeler you expand your uses - Operational/Option Paralysis is very real - you rid yourself of it by going slowly and using as simple a models as you can.