How does diaphragm size/polar pattern relate to mic applications?

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The only thing that saddens me about this thread is that the Behringer thread that I started (about cheap $35 mics) has had almost as many views and posts as this thread, which represents years of experiment and experience. There is stuff in this thread that I've never seen anywhere else, in print, or on the net.

This thread developed over months of trying to cover as many aspects of microphone design and technique as humanly possible, while the other thread was "hey, I just noticed this and it might be a pretty good deal".

A little disappointing to me.
 
veiws of this post are greater than you think

Don't forget that many people downloaded the .doc version of this thread for repeated readings. I for one printed out the whole damned thing and have re-read it more than once. Also, no one would have bothered reading the other post if you hadn't achieved guru status in this thread.

I for one bought the mics you mentioned in the other thread because I trust your opinion thanks to this one. It's all good.
 
Psychiatrist in need!!!

The saddest part for me Harvey is I've read both threads from the beginning and have re-visited them several times and I still have not bought a pair of ecm's yet.I came close once, I went to 8th street.com clicked on the buy it ordered two of them got my total then "what the hell am I doing" corner of my cranium took over.These mics are like $80.00/pair so certainly affordable but when does my gear addiction end!! I wake up to see recording magazines strewn across my bedroom floor.I take a shit there's my latest mix magazine on the back of the toilet,everytime I get on line my hand clicks on home recording bbs. without thinking about it, my wife sees me at 3:00 am after I've posted my last thread, wake up and do it all over again.I'm tellin ya I can't afford drugs, I even quit drinking 6 months ago, my second biggest addiction (cigarettes) I'm gonna have to give up because the biggest addiction in my life GEAR is consuming everything. Next on my list is trying to get my room acoustics in check!!Never ends!!!


Well, anyway's I've gotta go and buy a pair of ecm's talk to later.

:D
 
Wow, once again, hats off to Harvey.
Harvey has been a mentor and friend of mine for the past four years, and the more I learn, the more I find out he knows.
Plus, he's one helluva nice guy.
But, at the tail end of this thread, you guys already know this.
 
For the record:

I don't read this thread if I want any of the gold it contains- I read the downloaded doc. Much more convenient.

And I read it often.
 
Do I hear violins?

/q/the other thread was "hey, I just noticed this and it might be a pretty good deal".

A little disappointing to me./q/

Oh, puleaze. These are not competing concepts. It's ONE group of people reading the whole forum.

What these guys say is right. The other thread represents an inspired action related to this thread. A lot of the info you've shared involves these mics. We're homerecordists (mostly)...a $35 dollar investment for us to experiment hands-on with your suggestions sounds about right. Most good books on the subject cost at least that, and as you said, you've covered new ground and filled in some areas.

The glass is full.
 
and when I say "about right", I'm being sarcastic.

Let's just say I feel like I walked out of the store with a '64 Jaguar, but only paid for a Squire Affinity.
 
You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink.

Unfortunately Harvey, a lot of people want the information "NOW", not in a couple of hours time when they would have finished reading this thread. Many seem to find it easier to ask a question which has been asked and answered countless times before rather than use the search function..........(e.g; "Which are the best near-fields").

The wisdom and knowledge you have shared here is priceless.

BTW, off topic but I believe you were "involved" with Acoustic amps at one time...........true or false?

Regards,

ChrisO :cool:
 
Guilty as charged. I designed the 260, 360, 150, 140, and 130 series (although there were several other people there that made it a reality), and the 270/370 stuff, etc. I was the Vice President of Acoustic for a few years out of my life. I watched it grow from just myself and Steve Marks to about 300 people at its peak.
 
Wow! I vividly remember when I was a lad of 15 and happened to cross paths with Shel Horlick who was, at that time [1970] a sales rep for Acoustic and ARP [not to mention a few other things that were new and hip] in Northern California. I wonder what Shel is doing now? The last time I saw him was in the early eighties at his house in the Hollywood Hills. He was with Schecter Guitar Research if I recall correctly. Harvey, did you have anything to do with those Delta amps that David Pack used [in the early days of Ambrosia]? This brings back a TON of Los Angeles memories for me... Man, what a long strange trip it's been! :D
 
PinkStrat wrote:
Wow! I vividly remember when I was a lad of 15 and happened to cross paths with Shel Horlick who was, at that time [1970] a sales rep for Acoustic and ARP [not to mention a few other things that were new and hip] in Northern California. I wonder what Shel is doing now? The last time I saw him was in the early eighties at his house in the Hollywood Hills. He was with Schecter Guitar Research if I recall correctly. Harvey, did you have anything to do with those Delta amps that David Pack used [in the early days of Ambrosia]? This brings back a TON of Los Angeles memories for me... Man, what a long strange trip it's been!

Again, guilty as charged - I was President of Delta Products and those were my amp design. I found out Shel Horlick died a few years ago. His house was near mine (I lived near the top of Laurel Canyon on the Hollywood side, and Shel lived on the Studio City side).

Jeff Baxter brought in Dave Schecter and for a while. we loaned Dave some space at Delta to work on his pickup designs.
 
Ah, that sucks about Shel, Harvey...Shel was one of the true originals in the 60-70s AND he was never afraid to get involved with new products. That's an all too common trait that both of you guys obviously shared [as I am finding out about your illustrious history in Los Angeles]. BTW, Happy New Year, Harvey & thanks for the update on my old friend Shel.... May he Rest in Peace.
 
rescue mission

Ok, all this talk of Acoustic Amps made me feel guilty so I dug my Acoustic G60-112 out of the coal bin [that's just where we store stuff, there isn't any coal in there anymore] and it has rejoined the mess that is my basement studio.
 
EV 676

Add me to the long list of people who are deeply grateful for this thread.

Harvey, do you know anything about the Electro-Voice 676? A relative gave me one he bought in the early 60s. It has a damaged cord and I'm wondering if it's worth fixing.

If the sciatica (sp?) acts up again, you might try acupuncture. It cured me of chronic back pain. Worth a shot.
 
Behringer ECM8000 in X/Y

Harvey, would a pair of Behringer ECM8000s be good for X/Y recording an acoustic guitar that has a lot of bass response? Or would Marshall MXL 603s be better? Any other budget suggestions? The guitar is a wonderful Gibson from the 40's and I'm doing a terrible job with a Rode NT1 and an A-T MB4000C. Thanks, you are truly the man.
 
Re: Behringer ECM8000 in X/Y

Al Sim said:
Harvey, would a pair of Behringer ECM8000s be good for X/Y recording an acoustic guitar that has a lot of bass response? Or would Marshall MXL 603s be better? Any other budget suggestions? The guitar is a wonderful Gibson from the 40's and I'm doing a terrible job with a Rode NT1 and an A-T MB4000C. Thanks, you are truly the man.
Click to expand...
I don't think you'll get enough stereo separation with two ECM8000s in X/Y, but hey, try it. Try NOS or one of the other near coincidenct spacings to see if that gives you a better image.

The use of omnis will certainly help tame the bottom end on an old Gibson (is it an old Gibson J45?). You might also try playing around with different string gauges on the low E and A strings to control levels.
 
The Old Gibson

Yes, I believe it is a J45. I know it's a something-45. I assume you've dealt with this instrument before. Man, you are good.

The guitar belongs to the singer-songwriter I work with. I don't think I'll have much luck asking him to change string guages, so that'll have to be a last resort. It's a truly great-sounding guitar. I haven't bought the ECM8000s yet. I'm trying to figure out what to get on a budget of $200 for recording this particular instrument. A pair of MXL603s and an ECM8000? Any other mics you'd suggest?

Have you ever encountered an EV 676 and is it good for anything?

Thanks and thanks again. You are a godsend.
 
The J-45 can be a very difficult instrument to record. What the audience hears is NOT what the player hears. They can sound downright "tubby" from out in front of the guitar. I'd probably try the ECM8000s first, doing the "over the shoulder" routine, and then dink around with the placement from there.

This is the one guitar where you might need to add some eq, if nothing else works (some "bass" to "low mid" cut, anywhere from 80Hz to 250 Hz,depending on the guitar and the song).

For the right song, there's nothing that comes close to a J-45, but they can be a flat out bitch to record. It's also a lot easier to record a strummed J-45 than it is to record a fingerpicked J-45.

I've had pretty good luck using a Shure SM-81, but that puts it out of your price range.

I'm not familiar with the EV, but most EVs always have "some" use in a studio. Does EV have a historical database on line? You might start there, or ask them via email if they have any information about the 676
 
Harvey, thanks some more.

I will order an ECM8000 for over-the-shoulder. There are songs that I would like to try X/Y on, if not on the J45, then on one of our other guitars. Would a pair of MXL603s be good for that, or is the another mic in that price range that you would recommend? And do I have any hope of getting good results doing X/Y on the J45, or should I not waste time trying? That should be it for questions from me, at least until the mics arrive. Meanwhile, I'm off to the EV website to see what I can learn about the 676.

You are a great teacher. Your explanations are very clear and to the point. Please consider writing that book! I write for a living and I know a natural when I read one.

Thanks yet again.
 
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