Given my limited equipment how would you track?

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formerlyfzfile

formerlyfzfile

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I am helping a friend's band record some songs to shop to clubs for gigs.

I have the following.

A Roland VS880vX recorder

A Tascam M30 mixer (decent pres but no phantom)

1 CAD E-200
1 RE-20
1 Rode NT-3
1 SM57
1 ECM8000
1 PV45 (58-ish)
and can use the bands Beta 58 and SM58.

1 Focusrite Penta
1 DBX 286a
1 Audiobuddy

1 RNC
1 Composer Pro

This weekend we plan on tracking drums and bass.
In general, the plan is to record drums, then bass and guitar, then vox.

My main question is how to appraoch the drums.
I can only record 4 tracks at a time on the 880 (hoping to get a DA-38 soon) but was tossed up between using 3 or 4 tracks to get the drums and whether or not to get the bass down simultaneously.

And also what mics you guys might match to which pres for what part of the kit.

Here's what I was thinking.

1 overhead ....the E-200 (as opposed to the NT-3 which is hypercardiod) into the Penta (set to limit only) but where I could add a little tube effect to maybe soften the cymbals if neccessary.

SM57 on snare through the mixer with the RNC inserted.

RE20 on kick through the mixer with the composer inserted to gate/limit.

I could also, alternatively, put the kick through the 286a.

Then for the 4th track I'm tossed up between doing the bass through the other side of the composer or another drum mic (???? what/where).....maybe the NT-3 out front through the mixer (mics battery or phantom powered...although I believe battery power lessens the headroom).

The thing is with the bass....I know I can get a real good sound with the Penta......but it really is my best pre, which I'm thinking that since its so minimalist a set up I would want on the overhead mic because thats where most of the drum sound is comming from.

Any thoughts??

-mike
 
here's what i would do...

When it comes to drums, there is really no substitute for stereo overheads.
If you've got 4 channels at a time to work with, I'd use two for overheads, one for snare and one for kick
you've got 8 channels all together right?
I wouldn't bounce any drum tracks unless you really need to.
Good idea with the RE20 in the kick. Just stay away fromn the beta 58 for the overhead, it's high end is very hyped up.
I'd save you sweetest preamp for the snare.

I really try to record as dry as I can, I would advise compression AFTER you track. If you track with compression and don't like the results, you can't ever go back, and I usually find that setting the right compression ratios, attach time etc. much easier when I can audition the results before making them permanent.
does the 880 have onboard compression?? or at least inserts?

Now this setup will only work if you've got a bass player that is decent at overdubs. if the drummer & bass player are magic together but so-so seperate then just consolidate 2 drum tracks and track the bass player w/ the drummer.

hope that helps or at least gives you some ideas
 
If you can record 4 tracks simultaneously and you want to track the drums and bass together Id' suggest definately have the kick drum on 1 track, snare on 1 track and subgroup the overhead and toms on the other tracks for a total of 3 tracks for drums and one for the bass. I'd gate the snare but record everything else raw. On the mixdown, if needed, I'd use your dynamics processors. The use of EQ's while recording will help add snap and depth to the drums as well as separate the highs of the cymbals. Mic placement will help as well. Tracking drums for the first time can prove to be rather time consuming till you attain the sound you are looking for.
I myself can record 6 track simultaneously giving me 5 tracks of drums and one track for the bass. Track #1 - Kick drum, Track #2 - Snare, Track #3 - Toms, Track #4 - Left overhead & ride cymbal, Track #5 - Right overhead & hi-hat. Of course track 3-5 are subgrouped on a mixer.
Save all processing till you bounce the drum tracks down, if bouncing is the plan in order to record more tracks.
Good luck!
 
I forgot to add one thing..... Try recording your bass direct.
 
Thanks for the replys.

Jimbo, about the compressors.....I was thinking of inserting/engaging them only in a peak limiting capacity as the 880 is a 16 bit recorder and I want to get as much level as possible.

As far as doing a mono overhead, I was thinking that since I dont have a stereo pair (YET!) that it might not be easy to balance the kit with dis-similar mics.

Am I making an incorrect assumption about that issue??

Time (or lack of) as far as setting up and tweaking is definitely going to be a factor also......I am pushing for as much set up time as possible but I know their patience is less than mine.

Truthfully......I'm looking to use this weekend as a practice run for the recording but the faster I can set up (ie the more solid my setup game plan is) the more takes I will be able to get them to rum through while I tweak the mics in between.

The bass will definitely go direct......for the bleed factor.
The bass player has an Ampeg head that has a direct out and sounds pretty good recorded.

-mike
 
mike-
sounds like you are going into this realistically as basically a test run. if you're just using those compressors to limit when the guy does a crazy drum fill or something then that sounds ok to me.
just make sure the things aren't lit up for the whole song!

you've got a point about the mismatched overheads, for some reason i thought you had a pair of sm57s or 58s. but hey, it doesn't mean you can't try it! i guess if time (or patience of the talent) is a factor you might not be all that interested in messing around all day. a gameboy or playstation is a great destraction
but honestly i've never tried a mismatched stereo pair.

if you go with one overhead, i've gotten my best results sticking a mic just over the drummers head, pointed a little over the snare.

have fun, don't stress it, and listen to the results in between takes.
 
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