For those of you who rail incessantly on Behringer...

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ironklad Audio
  • Start date Start date
And what's this obsession with convictions? Do things have to be proven in a court of law for you to believe them?
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totally!

OJ didn't kill his wife

michael jackson didn't diddle that kid

and behringer never ripped anybody off

and the whole guitar shape argument doesn't hold any weight, because there are these things called PATENTS, which expire after a specific number of years. that's why it's legal to make strat/tele/les paul copies today, but wasn't throughout the 50's and 60's.
 
Good post by Ironklad Audio.

I have come to the conclusion that EDAN can't really be serious, he must be a troll, just baiting us to get a reaction. It just doesn't seem possible that anyone could truly believe what he is saying.
 
EDAN said:
I've heard such things via the web. Mostly from Behringer bashers. Behringer from my research has never lost a lawsuit and have never been convicted of a crime. I can't go by hearsay and speculation.
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Edan, may I refer you to your own words just a few posts up the page? Now when it is pointed out to you that one of the main cruxes of your argument turns out to be false, it would be the courteous course of action to concede that perhaps you were wrong. But I see you don't have that kind of grace.

Sonic is right. It is pretty clear at this point that you simply love the thrill of stirring the pot, and seeing how many people you can upset (and how many red boxes you can accumulate). It's kind of a juvenile game to play, although there always seems to be at least one like you on every board. As a matter of fact, it is highly likely that "EDAN" is only one of many identities you have adopted over time from forum to forum.

I, for one, have no interest in enabling your addiction to conflict. Many thanks to SonicAlbert, mshilarious, Ironklad and others for helping me to understand that it wasn't just my inept communication skills that was steering this thread into madness. Clearly, EDAN, whoever you really are, you have a hidden agenda in these discussions, or at least it was hidden until you were so baldly exposed.

As I said, I am done with enabling your game.If you do have any sincere wish for further communication, you are welcome to Private Message me, where at least I'll know that any points you wish to make are not part of an overall public posturing.

By the way, Sonic, your website/music looks intriguing. When I get a little time, I'd like to check into it further.

I'm out of this thread, unless it takes a turn back to reasoned discussion.
 
EDAN said:
I've heard such things via the web. Mostly from Behringer bashers. Behringer from my research has never lost a lawsuit and have never been convicted of a crime. I can't go by hearsay and speculation.

For about the fourth or fifth time, why do you hold Behringer accountable but make no mention of the fact I brought up, the fact that just about every guitar maker makes look-a-like and sound-a-like strats teles, Jumbos, dreadnots and the like? What's the difference in making a cable tester that works and looks "almost" exactly like another brand and dozens of guitars makers making guitars that work and look "almost" exactly like the Fenders and Gibsons and so fourth? I don't see a difference, there is no difference. Most all electric guitars work the same way, there are copycat pickups, tuners, bridges etc that look and work "almost" exactly like all the famous ones they copied. Why do you only have a problem with Berhinger? Plus, you yourself said you own some Behringer gear, that doesn't do much for your position on the matter.
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I think your argument falls a little flat. The cost involved in setting up a production line of guitars on par with U.S.A Fenders or Gibsons would simply undercut Berries bottom-line. Don't you think the cat would be out of the bag if there was a guitar for $300 that sounded like $1000. Wouldn't everyone want the big red rack-mounted D.W. Fearn knockoff for 200 bucks if it performed as well.

Behringer is blatently ripping off the small guy whose market is the home-recordist that doesn't know of class A or discrete. Then they sell this product as their own for a much lower price, and in turn hurt the sales of the small guy who put the sweat time in.

They can't do this with Fender or Gibson because they are not small guys in the industry. I'm sure they would have by now if it was even possible and it made them a buck.

I wonder what the person looks like who would buy a Behringer guitar> probably pretty homely.
 
SonicAlbert said:
Good post by Ironklad Audio.

I have come to the conclusion that EDAN can't really be serious, he must be a troll, just baiting us to get a reaction. It just doesn't seem possible that anyone could truly believe what he is saying.
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Seriously, you guys just twigging on to this no??? :D

Consider:
Troll said:
Your spewing nonsense and spin. The Behringer cable tester is NOT, I repeat NOT exactly the same. Compare the two pics side by side and you'll pick out a few key differences, plus it clearly says in bold print BEHRINGER across the front, no one with half a brain will confuse it with any other brand.
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I mean, seriously, this is a perfect example - as if someone who stole a design would put the name of the competitor they stole from on the product. I mean come on.......

Yup. he's a troll. :rolleyes:
 
fraserhutch said:
Nah, Walters was at least interesting and made you think a bit.
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Yeah... made me think, what the hell am I doing wasting my time on this forum? :D

Anyway, about this Behringer thing.

I’ve seen the similarities between Behringer and some models from other companies, like Mackie. Similarities is an understatement, but I always attributed it to the practice of outsourcing to Chinese manufacturers that brand products for various companies. Behringer isn’t really even on my radar though, so I haven’t followed the infringement cases.

When many companies began outsourcing to China QC was deplorable. Behringer started outsourcing years before other well-known companies and gained a bad rep for this early on. That’s the main reason I never looked at modern Behringer stuff. IMO, they started a trend that lowered the bar. This trend put a few companies out of business and changed others for the worse.

I still don’t look seriously at budget gear if it’s made in China. I know that’s getting to be a difficult (impossible) position to hold these days, since everyone is outsourcing. I feel so strongly about it I mostly buy vintage gear.

All my Kurzweil, Alesis and Lexicon stuff, except for my Q2 is made in USA. My Yamaha, Roland and Tascam stuff is made in Japan… well, you get the Idea. It’s a general rule that’s worked pretty well.

Equipment today is made so cheaply that in many cases one would do well to buy higher-grade used gear.

I have Tascam mixers from the ‘80s that run circles around new Behringer. I don’t care if something is 20 years old… I just care that it works. Sure, there are caveats with buying used gear, which we all know, but Behringer QC has been so inconsistent it’s a lot like buying used gear anyway. You’re rolling the same dice. To be fair, I’m handy with the soldering iron, and much of my gear has been modified in some way, so it’s easy for me to say.

Still, I just can’t fathom why anyone would pay more for Behringer than for a vintage Tascam or Studiomaster board.

I know my approach doesn’t make music store salespeople happy or sell magazines, but it’s just the way it is.

~Tim
:)
 
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Luckily, Behringer equipment will never become vintage. First off, there is not much they make that will probably last 20 years. Secondly, vintage gear is stuff that has lasted because it is desirable, tried, and true. That does not sound like Behringer to me. However, there is always the chance though that leaving a brand new piece of Behringer in a hot stuffy attic for 20 years and letting it accumulate a lot of oxidation may actually help the sonic quality. It will never be clean and beautiful, but maybe a combination of spider nests, mothballs, moisture and rust will change it in such a way that will give it some new sound that might be something someone somewhere wants. This may hold true, which means that in 20 years there will be5 pieces of Behringer equipment left that are desired by only 5 different people. Since that would typically make an item to be considered "rare" there cost may actually double. What a deal that would be. A 4 channel vintage "toooob" preamp for only $450.
 
Ironklad Audio said:
totally!

OJ didn't kill his wife

michael jackson didn't diddle that kid

and behringer never ripped anybody off

and the whole guitar shape argument doesn't hold any weight, because there are these things called PATENTS, which expire after a specific number of years. that's why it's legal to make strat/tele/les paul copies today, but wasn't throughout the 50's and 60's.
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Wrong, there's a lot more to it than that. That's why Gibson is still sueing other makers over guitar shapes. They sued PRS Guitars recently for this very thing.
 
superbeatballer said:
I think your argument falls a little flat. The cost involved in setting up a production line of guitars on par with U.S.A Fenders or Gibsons would simply undercut Berries bottom-line. Don't you think the cat would be out of the bag if there was a guitar for $300 that sounded like $1000. Wouldn't everyone want the big red rack-mounted D.W. Fearn knockoff for 200 bucks if it performed as well.
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There are plenty of $300 dollar guitars that are built as good (or better in some peoples opinions .. read this, it's interesting Why Japenese guitars are better than USA Gibson and Fender Eddie Van Halens guitar used on VH's first album was a cheap strat rip off and many people think he had one of the best guitar sounds ever. My brother has owed many USA strats and SG's over the years, yet his fav is his $350 De Armond, he feels it's the best build and playing guitar regardless of price. I'm not going to argue with him, he's been playing for thirty years and is worlds beyond me as a guitarist. You people are so caught up in price and hype. Sure there is a lot of junk out there. but there are cheap pieces of gear that do a great job and get pro results, The RNC and RNP, the ST-B1 and C1 are a few of the better known. A great peice of gear does not have to cost an arm and a leg, don't believe the hype all the time.
 
littledog said:
Edan, may I refer you to your own words just a few posts up the page? Now when it is pointed out to you that one of the main cruxes of your argument turns out to be false, it would be the courteous course of action to concede that perhaps you were wrong. But I see you don't have that kind of grace.

Sonic is right. It is pretty clear at this point that you simply love the thrill of stirring the pot, and seeing how many people you can upset (and how many red boxes you can accumulate). It's kind of a juvenile game to play, although there always seems to be at least one like you on every board. As a matter of fact, it is highly likely that "EDAN" is only one of many identities you have adopted over time from forum to forum.

I, for one, have no interest in enabling your addiction to conflict. Many thanks to SonicAlbert, mshilarious, Ironklad and others for helping me to understand that it wasn't just my inept communication skills that was steering this thread into madness. Clearly, EDAN, whoever you really are, you have a hidden agenda in these discussions, or at least it was hidden until you were so baldly exposed.

As I said, I am done with enabling your game.If you do have any sincere wish for further communication, you are welcome to Private Message me, where at least I'll know that any points you wish to make are not part of an overall public posturing.

By the way, Sonic, your website/music looks intriguing. When I get a little time, I'd like to check into it further.

I'm out of this thread, unless it takes a turn back to reasoned discussion.
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Nothing I've said turned out to be false. Why on earth would I concede I was wrong, wrong about what? That some pros use Behringer? Nope, not wrong about that. That most guitar makers rip off the tele, SG and Strat style, nope not wrong about that. You show me something I'm wrong about I'll be happy to admit to it, I have no problem with that, I'm not God, been wrong before. Show me what I'm wrong about.
 
EDAN said:
You show me something I'm wrong about I'll be happy to admit to it, I have no problem with that, I'm not God, been wrong before. Show me what I'm wrong about.
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Just re-read this thread and it should become apparent to you. Sheesh, you've gotten shot down right and left and you don't even seem to realize it.
 
SonicAlbert said:
Just re-read this thread and it should become apparent to you. Sheesh, you've gotten shot down right and left and you don't even seem to realize it.
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That's what I thought, keep up the spin and avoid the real issues Mr. I buy Behringer gear but complain they are stealing from others, or we'll just call you Hypocrite for short. :rolleyes: Still waiting for anyone to take me to task, what am I wrong about?

The facts are as such;

1 You can get pro results with some Behringer gear.
2. Some pros use Behringer gear.
3. Big companies "borrow" ideas from each other all the time.
4. Some people play motifs and think they are musicians.
 
EDAN said:
The facts are as such;

1 You can get pro results with some Behringer gear.
2. Some pros use Behringer gear.
3. Big companies "borrow" ideas from each other all the time.
4. Some people play motifs and think they are musicians.
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This is the first thing you have had said in all of your posts that I can finally agree with. It's the first time that your statements have allowed some room for reason.

1. Yes, you can get pro results with SOME Behringer gear. I never said you could not. I still believe though that in nearly every case you would have better results with something better. But, the possibility certainly exists and it has been done.

2. Some pro's do use Behringer gear. Of course they do, but most don't. That does not mean that someone should or should not. Everyone has different preferences and tastes. In general thouh, mnost pros do not use much if any Behringer equipment. Usually this would be because they have tons of other stuff that works and sounds much better.

3. Big companies do "borrow" ideas from each other frequently. Sure they do, yet no one seems to have gone so far as Behringer in this practice. In my opinion they have seriously crossed that line between borrowing an idea to further and imporve a product and flat out stealing a design to hoodwink consumers.

4. Some people do play Motif's and do think they are a musician. Sad, but true. Actually not even that sad. Making music is making music. Half of music is the idea behind it and not just the expression of it. Following previous logic though form other posts in this and other threads, we HAVA to consider thos Motif playin fools musicians since we still call some of the people who use Behringer gear Pro's.
 
A little smug in here.

I just bought a behringer EMC8000,in may 2006 RECORDING mag they rated it
as one of the better mics under 100. I cant say enough about this mic and
am going to get another. shure its no earth works, but added a tottaly new
world to my drums.
as an art form thier is no right way or sound
but their is shit that doesnt work
 
big country said:
I cant say enough about this mic and
am going to get another. shure its no earth works, but added a tottaly new
world to my drums.
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That my friend was a bad spelling pun or an ironic twist of the keys. My 2200 fried slightly a couple of months after warranty. Until then, it worked ok but now it's junk. Pretty much as I bought it. I have a B1 that has done the job but I'm sure it'll crap out soon enough. I'm finished on these Behringer crap threads. It's way too old and no longer productive.

"The Pinto Wagon was great til the seat fell through the floorboards at 55mph"

And that's the truth. "Just Listen"
 
xstatic said:
This is the first thing you have had said in all of your posts that I can finally agree with. It's the first time that your statements have allowed some room for reason.

1. Yes, you can get pro results with SOME Behringer gear. I never said you could not. I still believe though that in nearly every case you would have better results with something better. But, the possibility certainly exists and it has been done.

2. Some pro's do use Behringer gear. Of course they do, but most don't. That does not mean that someone should or should not. Everyone has different preferences and tastes. In general thouh, mnost pros do not use much if any Behringer equipment. Usually this would be because they have tons of other stuff that works and sounds much better.

3. Big companies do "borrow" ideas from each other frequently. Sure they do, yet no one seems to have gone so far as Behringer in this practice. In my opinion they have seriously crossed that line between borrowing an idea to further and imporve a product and flat out stealing a design to hoodwink consumers.

4. Some people do play Motif's and do think they are a musician. Sad, but true. Actually not even that sad. Making music is making music. Half of music is the idea behind it and not just the expression of it. Following previous logic though form other posts in this and other threads, we HAVA to consider thos Motif playin fools musicians since we still call some of the people who use Behringer gear Pro's.
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I never said all Behringer gear was great. None of us out here have used their whole line of gear. Every piece I've owned over the years have proved very workable and none of it has ever failed me, crashed or broken. I had an RNC, I got rid of it because I like my 10 year old Behringer compressor better.

I still can't fathom the thinking behind a comment like "Big companies do "borrow" ideas from each other frequently. Sure they do, yet no one seems to have gone so far as Behringer in this practice" When I pointed out several times now that countless guitar makers have in fact gone as far and have been ripping off the "tele" as well as other classic guitars for years and years and many of them look and work EXACTLY like the originals. So your comment above just doesn't wash. If you have a problem with it I do unserstand (really), but saying that Behringer have taken it too far is to totally ignore all the guitar copies and companies who make them.
 
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