Enhancer reccomendations

[chessrock]

Industrial,


You make a good point. My only problem with what you're saying is this:

Gates, if used properly, can help and can greatly benefit your tracks and mixes. It's a good, useful tool. Compressors are an art in and of themselves, and have become almost a necessity for certain types of music.

Same with de-essers, if used properly/sparingly.

Same with most anything else, in fact.

The problem with enhancers / exciters, unfortunately, is that the vast majority of the time they just sound like ass. They're too easy to mis-use, and as MrQ pointed out . . . they're too enticing and addictive of a solution that too often are used to cover up for poor tracking technique.

And did I mention they usually just sound like ass?

I did, didn't I?

 

[Industrial]

Chess> And did I mention they usually just sound like ass?
----------------------

yes they can....

but.... if anyone wants to try running Phill Collins, "In the Air Tonight" through one...... oooohh.. If that low end-eeriness doesn't raise a few goosebumps... then I'll admit I'm wrong and stop using them Although the song sounds just fine without it being enhanced...a song which is a shining example of great mixing and mastering work which is hard to improve upon [in my humble opinion].

 

[MISTERQCUE]

Chess> And did I mention they usually just sound like ass?
----------------------

yes they can....

but.... if anyone wants to try running Phill Collins, "In the Air Tonight" through one...... oooohh.. If that low end-eeriness doesn't raise a few goosebumps... then I'll admit I'm wrong and stop using them Although the song sounds just fine without it being enhanced...a song which is a shining example of great mixing and mastering work which is hard to improve upon [in my humble opinion].

Industrial, do you work in the city?
What part of Strong Island do you reside in?

 

[chessrock]

but.... if anyone wants to try running Phill Collins, "In the Air Tonight" through one...... oooohh..

Well, I suppose we could start bringing back gated reverbs and slap-back delay, too, while we're at it.

Obviously, you're point is well-taken . . . never say never. But then I suppose explosives can be used for positive things, also: demolition, mining, etc. But would you recommend everyone to go out and start using explosives on things?

My point being things like explosives and aural exciters are best left to trained personel who know how to handle them safely.

 

[MISTERQCUE]

Yo' chessy-baby, you're good!! REAL GOOD!!!

 

[acorec]

Industrial,


You make a good point. My only problem with what you're saying is this:

Gates, if used properly, can help and can greatly benefit your tracks and mixes. It's a good, useful tool. Compressors are an art in and of themselves, and have become almost a necessity for certain types of music.

Same with de-essers, if used properly/sparingly.

Same with most anything else, in fact.

The problem with enhancers / exciters, unfortunately, is that the vast majority of the time they just sound like ass. They're too easy to mis-use, and as MrQ pointed out . . . they're too enticing and addictive of a solution that too often are used to cover up for poor tracking technique.

And did I mention they usually just sound like ass?

I did, didn't I?

Wow, can't the same thing be said about reverb, echo, noise gates, compressors, eq's, pre-amps, uh..........everything can be *misused*. The point is that if an enhancer is used correctly, it is a beneficial device indeed.

 

[MISTERQCUE]

Wow, can't the same thing be said about reverb, echo, noise gates, compressors, eq's, pre-amps, uh..........everything can be *misused*.

True.
I am living proof of that, however comps/eq's( signal leveling and freq'y adjmts), Efx-DSP's(compensation for lack of proper room acoustics, applications of delays,chorusing, flange etc), preamps (line level,db padding, impedance matching,etc.>>>how does one *misuse* a preamp??? <<< ...are widely considered as essential tools in recording.
One may apply too much 'Verb on a track, boost/cut a signal's freq'y more than neccessary, or even squash the dynamics of a signal via incorrect use of a comp,( this is where having a gooood set of monitors come into effect) but eventually that individual learns and realizes that these units are just as important as the instruments being tracked.

The point is that if an enhancer is used correctly, it is a beneficial device indeed.

I don't doubt that, but reflect for a moment.......

Why would an individual need an enhancer if he/she utilized the most basics of tracking techniques such as proper amp-mic'ing,peak-levelling,freq'y control etc, etc, etc.. If the track was NOT captured adequately, slapping in an enhancer is similar to putting on body deodorant without 1st washing up your smelly @ss with soap and water!!
There mite be an occasion or 2 when this unit serves a purpose
in certain situations, but as whole, IMHO, it shld-nt-be hi on any-1's priority list.

Peace
Q.rM

 

[chessrock]

At least to me, there is one major difference.

I'll explain it to you like this:

Over-use or improper use of compression can make something sound kinda' bad.

Not offensive or anything, mind you. Just kinda' bad to the point that I'll probably say to myself: "that person used too much compression . . . " but I'll eventually get over it and if it's a good song, I can still enjoy it.

Too much reverb can sound kinda' silly. To the point where you might elicit anything from an under-the-breath chuckle to an all-out belly laugh from me.

On the other hand, over-use of an exciter or enhancer can actually sound offensive to a listener. It brings about actual physical pain and discomfort to my ears. Prolonged listening could possibly have a detrimental effect to my mental health and sanity . . . to the point where I may become tense, irritable, and even violent.

That's kinda' what makes it different.

 

[acorec]

True.
I am living proof of that, however comps/eq's( signal leveling and freq'y adjmts), Efx-DSP's(compensation for lack of proper room acoustics, applications of delays,chorusing, flange etc), preamps (line level,db padding, impedance matching,etc.>>>how does one *misuse* a preamp??? <<< ...are widely considered as essential tools in recording.
One may apply too much 'Verb on a track, boost/cut a signal's freq'y more than neccessary, or even squash the dynamics of a signal via incorrect use of a comp,( this is where having a gooood set of monitors come into effect) but eventually that individual learns and realizes that these units are just as important as the instruments being tracked.





I don't doubt that, but reflect for a moment.......

Why would an individual need an enhancer if he/she utilized the most basics of tracking techniques such as proper amp-mic'ing,peak-levelling,freq'y control etc, etc, etc.. If the track was NOT captured adequately, slapping in an enhancer is similar to putting on body deodorant without 1st washing up your smelly @ss with soap and water!!
There mite be an occasion or 2 when this unit serves a purpose
in certain situations, but as whole, IMHO, it shld-nt-be hi on any-1's priority list.

Peace
Q.rM

Ah............Because the *enhancer* in the form of the BBS is SO misnamed. The BBS is really a time align device (for those who are old enough, you might remember the Urie Time Align Studio Monitors of the late 70s). The BBS is very similar to the Uries. The first frequencies to hit your ears are the fastest, lowest energy ones. The high freq hit the speakers followed by the lower freqs, then lowest freqs. What happens is that the high freq (lowest energiy) sounds get clobberred by the incoming lower freq (much higher energies) sounds. This leads to "mud" as described by most home recordists. To some extent, a well treated acoustical room can compensate for this. However, the freq *times* really must be properly aligned to fix the problem.

The BBS actually corrects the real problem being the physical aspects of the speaker.

If you ever see a set of Urie Time Align Monitors, the owner will NEVER part with them as they were unreal sounding speakers.


And, yes, if improperly used, the BBS does defeat the purpose of properly recorded tracks. The freq time alignment issue is true of all speakers and the problem has existed since the dawn of time (get it?)

 

[MISTERQCUE]

Ah............Because the *enhancer* in the form of the BBS is SO misnamed. The BBS is really a time align device (for those who are old enough, you might remember the Urie Time Align Studio Monitors of the late 70s). The BBS is very similar to the Uries. The first frequencies to hit your ears are the fastest, lowest energy ones. The high freq hit the speakers followed by the lower freqs, then lowest freqs. What happens is that the high freq (lowest energiy) sounds get clobberred by the incoming lower freq (much higher energies) sounds. This leads to "mud" as described by most home recordists. To some extent, a well treated acoustical room can compensate for this. However, the freq *times* really must be properly aligned to fix the problem.

The BBS actually corrects the real problem being the physical aspects of the speaker.

If you ever see a set of Urie Time Align Monitors, the owner will NEVER part with them as they were unreal sounding speakers.


And, yes, if improperly used, the BBS does defeat the purpose of properly recorded tracks. The freq time alignment issue is true of all speakers and the problem has existed since the dawn of time (get it?)

Thankyou my good man!

 

[chessrock]

Ah............Because the *enhancer* in the form of the BBS is SO misnamed. The BBS is really a time align device (for those who are old enough, you might remember the Urie Time Align Studio Monitors of the late 70s). The BBS is very similar to the Uries. The first frequencies to hit your ears are the fastest, lowest energy ones. The high freq hit the speakers followed by the lower freqs, then lowest freqs. What happens is that the high freq (lowest energiy) sounds get clobberred by the incoming lower freq (much higher energies) sounds. This leads to "mud" as described by most home recordists. To some extent, a well treated acoustical room can compensate for this. However, the freq *times* really must be properly aligned to fix the problem.

The BBS actually corrects the real problem being the physical aspects of the speaker.

If you ever see a set of Urie Time Align Monitors, the owner will NEVER part with them as they were unreal sounding speakers.


And, yes, if improperly used, the BBS does defeat the purpose of properly recorded tracks. The freq time alignment issue is true of all speakers and the problem has existed since the dawn of time (get it?)

I've read all about that, too. And you know what? That has to be one of the biggest heaps of marketing bullshit I've ever read.

Granted, it's probably not as good as Temporal Harmonic Alignment , but it is a pretty impressive load of crap, nonetheless.

BBE sonic maximizers sound like ass. And they hurt my ears. I want to go out and destroy every one ever made. Then I want to shove one up the wazoo of whomever it was that wrote all that crap about time alignment. After I shove the BBE up the marketing guys' A-hole . . . what frequencies from his screams of pain (or delight, depending on his preference I guess) are going to hit my ear first?

 

[Kevin Deschwazi]

Any of you fella's remember when you weren't any good?

If you were anything like I am now then you understood the importance of learning to do things right but at the same time you wanted your recordings to sound as good as you could possibly get them to sound with the knowledge and level of experience you had reached at that time.

Obviously a good engineer tracking and mixing everything well using good kit probably won't get much use out of any aural exciter/enhancer/sonic maximiser but if you're like me then you need all the help I can get.

I use an SPL vitalizer (sparingly), and on occasions it has added 'a little something extra' to a couple of my mixes, so newbie to newbie I'd give it the thumbs up.

As has already been said though there's no substitute for good recording technique, skill, experience and knowledge.

Also, less is more. Think of it as salt.

 

[acorec]

I've read all about that, too. And you know what? That has to be one of the biggest heaps of marketing bullshit I've ever read.

Granted, it's probably not as good as Temporal Harmonic Alignment , but it is a pretty impressive load of crap, nonetheless.

BBE sonic maximizers sound like ass. And they hurt my ears. I want to go out and destroy every one ever made. Then I want to shove one up the wazoo of whomever it was that wrote all that crap about time alignment. After I shove the BBE up the marketing guys' A-hole . . . what frequencies from his screams of pain (or delight, depending on his preference I guess) are going to hit my ear first?

Then if you want to kill the guys who came up with this "time alignment" issue, start with all physicists, burn all the physics books, kill all the electrical and acoustic designers and start with a fresh new world.

The time alignment issue is inherint to all speakers/copper cabling and cannot be undone unless you use a component to delay the upper frequencies.

Lastly, I cannot tell you what does-or does not- sound good. I can only explain the thory of how it works and the BBS is born of very sound theory (get it? sound theory? another funny)

 

[acorec]

Any of you fella's remember when you weren't any good?

If you were anything like I am now then you understood the importance of learning to do things right but at the same time you wanted your recordings to sound as good as you could possibly get them to sound with the knowledge and level of experience you had reached at that time.

Obviously a good engineer tracking and mixing everything well using good kit probably won't get much use out of any aural exciter/enhancer/sonic maximiser but if you're like me then you need all the help I can get.

I use an SPL vitalizer (sparingly), and on occasions it has added 'a little something extra' to a couple of my mixes, so newbie to newbie I'd give it the thumbs up.

As has already been said though there's no substitute for good recording technique, skill, experience and knowledge.

Also, less is more. Think of it as salt.

Uh.......most pro-mixes do use aural exciters somewhere. Aphex is a very popular one.

 

[acorec]

I also notice that Abby Road has many BBS units as well as many Behringer de-noiser units on board.



Pros do use these units, that is a fact.

 

[Kevin Deschwazi]

The use of Uh.... is condiscending in case you didn't realise, or maybe you did and you're just an arsehole.

Anyway....

https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?s=&threadid=48731&highlight=vitalizer

This thread has a fair few knowledgeable people saying they wouldn't use them or would only use them to rescue something that had been tracked and or mixed poorly elsewhere.

Maybe that's the problem with listening to people on BBS's

Are the people on that thread full of shit or are you full of shit?

Fuck me I'm having a bad day.

 

[acorec]

The use of Uh.... is condiscending in case you didn't realise, or maybe you did and you're just an arsehole.

Anyway....

https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?s=&threadid=48731&highlight=vitalizer

This thread has a fair few knowledgeable people saying they wouldn't use them or would only use them to rescue something that had been tracked and or mixed poorly elsewhere.

Maybe that's the problem with listening to people on BBS's

Are the people on that thread full of shit or are you full of shit?

Fuck me I'm having a bad day.

Uh.........Maybe you did not read chessrocks reply..........talk about condiscending..........Why in the hell would a place like Abbey Road even HAVE sonic maximizers if they were of no use?

I guess engineers at Abbey Road are not "fairly knowledgable" or read posts at the elite "home recording" BBS. The arguments on this BBS go from stupid to stupider with "experts" chiming in on what is good and what is shit, based on their limited knowledge.

 

[Kevin Deschwazi]

You said it

 

[acorec]

"........Maybe that's the problem with listening to people on BBS's

Are the people on that thread full of shit or are you full of shit?"

Fuck me I'm having a bad day. [/B][/QUOTE]



Go to Abbey Road's webpage and you tell me if I am "full of shit"

Then you can go fuck yourself and listen to whomever you want to dorkshot.



I can bet you the people on "that thread" are a bunch of wannabes who can type more that they can record.

 

[Kevin Deschwazi]

I don't know anyone on this board but I've learnt a lot and I suspect there are a lot of people who work in the industry and know their stuff. Some of these people don't like enhancers you (and some people at Abbey Road) do.

So what? Burn some josticks or something.