Cubase or Pro Tools??

[43% burnt]

I'm new to recording, and setting up a home studio...I'm looking at two usb interfaces w/ bundled software. The Tascam US-122 w/ Cubase LE, or Mbox w/ Pro tools LE. I have a g4 running os x (upgrading soon to g5). I think I would eventually want to learn pro-tools, so I figure I might as well start on it.

What are the advantages/disadvantages of cubase vs. protools?

 

[reshp1]

I don't know anything about Cubase LE, but I have been using PT LE for some time. It does everything I need, and does it well. The MBox is slightly underpowered in that it's only 2in/2out with no MIDI, but you can always upgrade to the 002R when you're ready. The pre's in the Mbox are pretty good, they're made by Focusrite, but that doesn't really mean anything. They can be switched to Hi-Z mode for recording instruments direct, which is a nice feature when you're recording yourself.
Protools LE also comes with almost everything you need to get started, software wise. There's a pretty good suite of plugins, not tops, but certainly all usable. Most plugins are available in Protools format too (RTAS) although I would assume that's the case for Cubase too.

Protools LE sessions are compatible with regular/TDM protools, so transfering your work to pro studios is less of a hassle. In the end, it's probably individual preference, but you wouldn't be at a disadvantage going with Protools.

 

[43% burnt]

thats cool...I think I will go with protools. I'm going to guitar center tonight to try both of them out. I think that will be the baest way to figure out what I like.

Any suggestions on decent studio monitors in the $ 300 range?

 

[reshp1]

Take a look in the Computer Forum, there's a thread that says Digidesign is releasing a Protools version that works with M-Audio interfaces.

 

[The Green Hornet]

Yo less than 50% scortched:} {and respondents]

I'd like someone to post the LEARNING CURVE for a Newbie for either Cu-b or Pro Tools.

I like what these system offer. But, since I use a SIAB system, which I'm still learning, as my system is a computer program with a small screen in a metal box.

If I could take a course in my area in either system, I probably would; however, although seminars from the vendors are available, courses are not. But, there might be some with specific gear offered at a Junior College, somewhere.

I don't say that the SIAB is better or, sometimes, easier. I'm just looking for a system learning curve time, especially considering this forum, Newbie.

I know that Chessie will jump right on the Green Hornet.

Green Hornet

 

[Farview]

The main disadvantage that protools has is that it only works with their interfaces, which cost a lot more than most. Also, from what I understand, LE has a track limit.

 

[The Green Hornet]

Yo looking from afar:

As they say on the FAMILY FEUD= good answer.

Kind of reminds me of the Roland syndrom. Their recorders would only burn CDs on a Roland Burner--kind of like shutting the door on the competition....

I don't see any new SIABs on the sheets for 2005; I see only the usual, with some improvements but nothing to make me want to drop a couple of grand on any unit.

We need a unit with voice activation--the technology is there but it seems to be blocked by the engineers who try to write manuals and keep the recording process complicated. Hey, lots of folks out here with the money who would like a REAL EASY TO USE 12/24 track recorder.

Green Hornet

 

[bennychico11]

If I could take a course in my area in either system, I probably would; however, although seminars from the vendors are available, courses are not. But, there might be some with specific gear offered at a Junior College, somewhere.

if you're interested, Digi offers Digi certified courses in a lot of different cities at studios, schools, etc. Here's the list:
http://training.digidesign.com/index.cfm?page=centers/centers

 

[jpfour23]

You can use other interfaces with ProTools! And PT does have a limit of 32 tracks.

I would highly encourage you not to go the PT route though. If you want to take advantage of ProTools.. you need the TDM system... ProTools|HD. And you're not going to get into a system like that for less than $20k.

Cubase SX3 or Sonar 4 are excellent choices for getting into computer based recording. The features available in both these applications are far better than ProTools LE. You might spend a little more depending on what control surface you want to use... but then again, you might not even want one?

Download the "Demo" version of sonar and play around with it. It's not very easy to learn for a newbie... but you'll get the hang of it.

 

[jpfour23]

Green Hornet-

By the way, you can use other CDRW's for the Roland stuff. Roland just doesn't tell you this. I used a Plextor CD Writer for years on my VS-2480.

 

[reshp1]

Cubase SX3 or Sonar 4 are excellent choices for getting into computer based recording. The features available in both these applications are far better than ProTools LE.

What are you basing this on?

 

[reshp1]

You can use other interfaces with ProTools! And PT does have a limit of 32 tracks.

No you can't. Yesterday Digidesign anounced that they were releasing a new version of PT for M-Audio interfaces (which they now own). So you still need digidesign hardware for Protools. And PT LE is NOT compatible with anything other than 001,002,002R and mBox.

 

[bennychico11]

And you're not going to get into a system like that for less than $20k.

change that number to $10K and you'll be a little closer

 

[43% burnt]

Thanks so much for the info guys. I heard about the new protools thats compatable with m-audio interfaces. It sounds interesting. It does provide a little more flexability. The only thing that worries me is customer service. dealing w/ two different companies. I figure it would be easier to diagnose/deal with problems if I use digidesign.

As far as cubase, sonar, etc...I have a good fried who tried avoiding PT by using cubase. He recorded my band with cubase (not sure what interface-just a live demo recording) and it sounded ok, but had very poor bass/low mid range. He tried different mic setups, positioning, etc and still got the same effect. He upgraded to protools and recorded us the same way, and the sound was noticeably better. Cleaner, clearer with a better range of frequencies.

So, I don't know if its a cubase issue or not, but due to his experiences. The fact that I figure I will want to learn protools eventually. Plus if i want to bring my works in progress to another studio chances are more than likely they will be using PT as well. I am leaning towards the protools route.

So should I start with the mbox?? or should i jump in with both feet and get the 002?

 

[Farview]

As far as your friend with Cubase goes, it must have been the interfaces. I go back and forth between Nuendo (it has the same audio engine as Cubase) and pro tools. The only difference in sound quality is the interfaces. If I record something in Nuendo and transfer it to Protools, It will sound the same as if I did the whole thing in Nuendo, If I record something in Protools and transfer to Nuendo, it will sound like a Protools session. (all this depends on the plugins I decide to use) The Digidesign interfaces do have a 'sound' to them as does every other interface. The Digidesign stuff is all uniform, so you end up with a 'Protools sound'. Cubase will let you use any old pile of crap interface, so the result could be all over the place.

 

[reshp1]

Yeah, the differences (if any) in the way programs handle the audio after it's been digitized are VERY subtle. If you can tell the difference between a 32bit fixed point summing bus and a 32 bit floating point buss from 2 blind sound clips then you have better ears than mine, much better. Chances are the difference was in the AD conversion process between the cubase interface and protools interface.

 

[jpfour23]

change that number to $10K and you'll be a little closer

Doubt it! You setup a PT|HD system for $10k and you've wasted your money. The whole point of using a PT system is taking advantage of it's expandability & plugs... If you aren't investing at least $10k in plugs, you're better off going native and using free plugs or the plugs that come with the software. Go Cubase/Sonar for $10k and get the UAD-1 or Waves power pack, and you're talking about a sweet system.

What are you basing this on?

PT LE does not come near the power of Sonar/Cubase. For starters, the CPU usage on PT LE is through the roof... LE is also limited to 32 tracks... and at that, my friend constantly complains of issues when using a couple of plugs while tracking 12-14 tracks at once. Of course it does depend on the computer you use... being that LE uses the computers processing power completely, unlike TDM. But his computer is solid and tweaked for audio. And if you're doing a lot of editing with PT LE you can forget about it... doesn't matter how powerful your computer is...

Fact is.. it isn't really fair to compare the two. They aren't really on the same level. PT LE is an entry level system. I'm not saying you can't get great sounds from it... it's just "entry" level... whereas PT|HD is "pro" level. IMO, Digi doesn't have a "mid-level" system... whereas IMO, cubase/sonar is "mid to pro level".

No you can't. Yesterday Digidesign anounced that they were releasing a new version of PT for M-Audio interfaces (which they now own). So you still need digidesign hardware for Protools. And PT LE is NOT compatible with anything other than 001,002,002R and mBox.

See the Mackie Control Universal... I suppose it depends on what level of control you want. No, it won't work like a control 24, but its certain cheaper... and it works! I have a friend using it now.

 

[The Green Hornet]

YO JP 4 plus more:

I was referring to the CD burner device; you mentioned CDRW [ CDs that can be recorded on more than one time.?] For a long time the Roland digital SIABs would only record CDs [either one, one time or more than one time] on a Roland CD burner.

But, all the responses here were great. However, nobody has given a point of time. If a newbie buys Pro Tools or any other system, how long does it take to learn the box? Or, the PC program and ALL of its intricacies?

A long time methinks.

Newbie=someone just beginning--no experience with digital recording AT all.

So, I still think I might start another thread and ask: "What would a person who wants to record like to see in a SIAB or a PC program for recording?

Here is something I might like: Turn on the system, screen says, "What would you like to do." I say, "record on tracks 2 and 6." Screen says, "would like to hear reverb on either track and what type?" I respond. Screen says, "All right, I understand." Push record when you are ready."

It will get there someday; perhaps not tomorrow but an EASIER system will make LOTS OF MONEY FOR WHOEVER PUTS IT ON THE MARKET.

Green Hornet

 

[jpfour23]

Sorry.. CDR or CDRW... What Roland does not tell you, is that inside of their nicely dressed roland burner is a plexwriter from plextor! Sooo.. you don't have to use the "roland" burner... but get a plexwriter. Much cheaper!

 

[reshp1]

PT LE does not come near the power of Sonar/Cubase. For starters, the CPU usage on PT LE is through the roof... LE is also limited to 32 tracks... and at that, my friend constantly complains of issues when using a couple of plugs while tracking 12-14 tracks at once. Of course it does depend on the computer you use... being that LE uses the computers processing power completely, unlike TDM. But his computer is solid and tweaked for audio. And if you're doing a lot of editing with PT LE you can forget about it... doesn't matter how powerful your computer is...

So what you're saying is, you're basing this off of "Your friend"
PT is no more CPU intensive as any other CPU host based DAW program. Some plugs are hogs, but so are the VST versions. I have no problems tracking all 32 tracks + 25 aux tracks, with a EQ, comp, and 3 separate delays on each. Neither do hundreds of others, see for yourself.

http://duc.digidesign.com/showflat....page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=7&fpart=1#360675


BTW, you can use UAD-1 and PowerCore with PTLE too for a "sweet system"

See the Mackie Control Universal... I suppose it depends on what level of control you want. No, it won't work like a control 24, but its certain cheaper... and it works! I have a friend using it now.

Mackie Control is a control surface, not an interface. No audio goes in, no audio goes out. You need to get you're facts straight before posting dude.