Chipped My Nut!

[Dr.Bootleg]

I came home from work the other day and my wife tells me our ten month old baby knocked my electric guitar over. I don't have a real case for it yet so it's still being stored in the box it came in (bad move I know). I opened it up and looked at it real quick but everything seemed fine. Today I sit down to play and hmmm...the low e string won't stay in tune and...holy crap there's a huge chip missing from the nut! The whole chunk where the low e sits is gone so basically only the tension is keeping the string from slipping off the fretboard. Do I need to replace the whole nut? I would assume so since I don't think glue will do the trick. Any idea how much it might cost? It's an Epiphone SG and the nut is plastic.

That lil' stinker.

 

[Light]

Yes, you will need a new nut. In my shop, it would cost around $90-125. But you'll get a much better (bone) nut out of it, so its worth it.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[slowmotion]

^^ what he said. Get a bone nut, your guitar will sound far better for it. The price is fair, shop around, but the ballpark is right.

Don't try and glue it, it'll only make the guitar tech's job harder when they have to remove it.

Try not to see this as a pain in the ass, but see it as an opportunity to really improve your guitar. A plastic nut is a real weak point in a guitar. Not only because they break (hehe) but because plastic doesn't transfer vibrations very well at all. You'll notice the difference and it WILL be better.

 

[Dani Pace]

As already said, don't bother trying to glue it and unless you have had quite a bit of experience with guitar repair don't try it yourself. The nut is a very simple part but unless it is cut, slotted and seated properly it can cause other problems. Plastic replacement nuts are cheaper than bone, but if one broke with a little bump it stands to reason that another will break just as easily, bone is far more durable, looks and sound better too in my oppinion. Prices for this repair can vary a bit but don't expect to get it done for less than $75 even in a cheap shop.

 

[Slowrider]

I've made several brass nuts for guitars and basses. Go with brass, more sustain.

 

[Milnoque]

No disrespect to Slowrider but,

+1 on bone

 

[muttley600]

Go with bone unless you have a specific reason not to.

You will not hear any appreciable difference between materials except maybe on the open strings. It is far more important to have the nut cut and slotted correctly to help tuning stability and intonation than to use different materials.

The cost involved in fitting a new nut is pretty much all labour so don't be fobbed off with one of the cheaper plastic ones. I charge around £50 for a standard nut fit, shape and slot..

 

[Zaphod B]

....and get a proper case for that guitar. You got lucky this time; you could have come home to a broken neck.

 

[Mr. C]

Chipped you nut??? Sounds painful...take two aspirin and call the doctor in the morning...or if it can't wait visit your local emergency room.

 

[Armistice]

I hope you're seriously considering selling the child... he/she's off to a bad start... best to bite the bullet now and limit future damage!

 

[Dr.Bootleg]

Thanks for all the advice guys. Using bone sounds like the way to go. Looks like I'm finally gonna have to find a good repair shop around here. I have an acoustic with terrible action as well that could use some professional adjusting. Unfortunately I'm piss broke right now and with Christmas and my kid's birthday coming up...crap.

Looks like I'll have to whip out my old Yamaha keyboard to keep me occupied. Yay.

 

[slowmotion]

If you're a bit hard up for cash, do some googling on basic setups. There's a lot you can do yourself with common tools to improve what you've already got. Go slow, think about what you're doing and you'd be surprised what you can achieve.

 

[Roguetitan]

another vote for bone, deer antler is also good for making nuts.
I charge $65.00 flat rate for installing a bone nut.

 

[ggunn]

If you're a bit hard up for cash, do some googling on basic setups. There's a lot you can do yourself with common tools to improve what you've already got. Go slow, think about what you're doing and you'd be surprised what you can achieve.

For adjusting action on adjustable bridges, truss rod, intonation, etc., sure; why not. If you go slow, don't force anything, and don't do anything irreversible, it's hard to screw up and you'll learn a lot. Replacing a nut, however, is a job for a tech, IMO.

 

[Roguetitan]

For adjusting action on adjustable bridges, truss rod, intonation, etc., sure; why not. If you go slow, don't force anything, and don't do anything irreversible, it's hard to screw up and you'll learn a lot. Replacing a nut, however, is a job for a tech, IMO.

besides the nut files alone will cost in the neighborhood of $125.00 and you cannot make a nut without them so you are better off taking the guitar to an experienced tech who has the tools to do the job right.

 

[slowmotion]

For adjusting action on adjustable bridges, truss rod, intonation, etc., sure; why not. If you go slow, don't force anything, and don't do anything irreversible, it's hard to screw up and you'll learn a lot. Replacing a nut, however, is a job for a tech, IMO.

Of course, sorry if that was unclear. Cutting nuts is a bit trickier. Plus, cutting bone STINKS haha you don't want to do that in your house, even if you've got all the required tools.

I should also add: ALWAYS use the right size allen keys and screwdrivers, and don't use pliers on things that requires a wrench (etc etc). Especially on the truss rod nuts!!

 

[Light]

besides the nut files alone will cost in the neighborhood of $125.00 and you cannot make a nut without them

WEEEEELLLLLLLL...I wouldn't want to do it without a set of nut files now days, but once upon a time they didn't exist, and had to make do with other tools. Well, more to the point, no one had noticed Grobet files (I'm not sure if that is the style of file, or a brand name, but whatever) were perfect for making nuts.

Rat tail needle files, Exacto saw blades, and a lot of rocking side to side. Nut files are MUCH better, and WAY easier. I don't think I've made a nut that way in over 20 years, though. I'm not even sure I could do a good one that way anymore - not without 2-3 practice runs.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[Dr.Bootleg]

Of course, sorry if that was unclear. Cutting nuts is a bit trickier. Plus, cutting bone STINKS haha you don't want to do that in your house, even if you've got all the required tools.

I don't think I want to know how you know that. *gulps* Do you think Leatherface makes nuts?

Why are some made out of bone anyway? This thread is the first I've heard of this. Wouldn't wood suffice? And what kind of bone is it?

 

[slowmotion]

I don't think I want to know how you know that. *gulps* Do you think Leatherface makes nuts?

Why are some made out of bone anyway? This thread is the first I've heard of this. Wouldn't wood suffice? And what kind of bone is it?

Haha. I'm not a serial killer, it's okay.

Using a grinder makes the rough cutting process (ie from larger blanks) much faster but boy does it smell bad (like burning hair). I think I'm using camel bone currently. I think it's about 40 years old. I don't harvest it myself hehe!

What you really want is hardness. As your strings rest on the nut, it plays an integral part in transferring vibrations from your strings to the body/neck. ANY material would work really, but the harder the material is, the better it will transfer vibration (and therefore tone). Or, rather, and perhaps more accurately, the harder the nut - the less dampening of vibrations takes place. So a nut made of rubber or soft wood would fulfil the most basic function of a nut (holding the strings in place), but it would sound awful and absorb all the vibration.

So, taken to the opposite extreme, brass or metal nuts are quite good for tone (but making them is hard on tools) - and can sound a bit harsh/bright on some guitars.

Bone is a nice middle ground, not to bright sounding, not soft, plus it's a natural product and well, kinda cool imo!

I hope that makes sense. I am prone to rambling.

 

[muttley600]

Haha. I'm not a serial killer, it's okay.

Using a grinder makes the rough cutting process (ie from larger blanks) much faster but boy does it smell bad (like burning hair). I think I'm using camel bone currently. I think it's about 40 years old. I don't harvest it myself hehe!

A grinder? Bit of a sledgehammer to crack a nut (pun included no charge). I use a 14tpi bandsaw. Clean cut, less waste. My mantra here is "fast" does not always mean "good" but a bandsaw is plenty fast enough for me.

What you really want is hardness. As your strings rest on the nut, it plays an integral part in transferring vibrations from your strings to the body/neck. ANY material would work really, but the harder the material is, the better it will transfer vibration (and therefore tone). Or, rather, and perhaps more accurately,

Yes, hardness is the prime property for a nut and that is because it has to to resist abrasion and subsequent wear. However the nut plays a very limited role in transferring string energy to the guitar and effects tone less than people may imagine. The greatest proportion of the string energy is lost to the bridge and directly to the air. Some is also lost to internal friction or damping. Also energy is only lost via the nut on open strings. Once the string is stopped at a fret it is pretty much out of the equation.

the harder the nut - the less dampening of vibrations takes place. So a nut made of rubber or soft wood would fulfil the most basic function of a nut (holding the strings in place), but it would sound awful and absorb all the vibration.

This isn't necessarily the case from a materials science perspective. Hardness is defined in three distinct ways. Scratch hardness, rebound hardness and indent hardness. They are all measures of hardness but are not co-dependant. In various materials the value for one or any of the above can be high or low. It would almost certainly have to be high in one of them to be considered "hard". Hardness is related but distinct to toughness which defines an objects ability to absorb energy and the amount of energy before it fractures. Again this will be unique for most materials and is not a measure of hardness. There are some rubber compounds that are exceptionally hard and tough..

The real deal is that you want the nut material to be "hard" (scratch hardness). "Tough" in that it will reflect not absorb energy and "durable" in that it is not prone to decay or structural failure in use.

In the grand scheme of things if those three criteria are met the nut will perform perfectly adequately and you will be hard pushed to hear a difference between materials except possibly on the open strings. Even then that can only be considered an objective judgement.