Casual Listening As flat as possible?

[Johnboy Walton]

My thoughts

Short answer to question above:

You don't.


Long answer:

"Flat" is a subjective quantity. It varies with listening position and listening level (among other things). And besides, "flat" usually refers to the frequency domain. So you could theoretically set a sound system to reproduce individual sine waves of equal amplitude perfectly from 5Hz to 50kHz, and call that flat. But what about transients? What about Inter-Modulation Distortion (sum and differences when you feed two or more sine waves at once)? This theoretical sound system won't necessarily do well in either of these tests.

And what about psychoacoustics? Is YOUR flat response the same as MY flat response? Blue Bear loves the KRK V8's. Other pros find them harsh. Who's right? Both, if they both turn out consistently good mixes.

As for compensating, it's an old trusim of signal processing that you can never get more information from a signal by processing. In other words, any change you make to a signal is by definition a degradation. That doesn't mean you're not getting rid of things you don't want or need. But is does mean that you cannot remove coloration in one processor that's been added earlier.

One other thing, regarding room tuning with an RTA and EQ. This will guarantee that flat system I mentioned above, but it also will not fix either transient response or IMD problems. You're better off using room treatment to kill room modes. This is one area in which I can tell my current setup is lacking. I just moved, and I know my room needs help to be able to mix well.

Oh, and to respond to the original topic, I LOVE listening to well-recorded material thru my monitors with everything as flat as it goes! And I really can't stand the less-well-mixed stuff. My two favorite in-car albums that I can't stand in the monitors are Offspring's "Conspiracy of One" and Rush's new one "Vapor Trails." "Conspiracy of One" is way over-compressed (but a lot of fun to listen to) and "Vapor Trails" has some annoying distortion on the vocals. But I still love the albums, just not at home!

 

[regebro]

Here's a question though : how does one go about getting a "flat" sound? Sure, you can reset your EQ from a smiley face to a straight line, but that isn't necissarily a flat sound if your speakers are bottom heavy (mor mid heavy, or high heavy, etc) to begin with. So what does one have to do in order to get a "true" flat EQ setting that compensates for everything in the signal chain and whatever colouring it may add?

Well, either you use your ears, or you run pink noise through it and look at the spectra while you tweak.

 

[Alchemist3k]

That's because "flat" on one of those type systems is just a mark on the knob. Just because a knob has a center detent marked "flat" doesn't mean it is. If you check out high-end audiophile systems (and I'm talking about stuff a lot better and more expensive than Denon) you'll find that quite a few doen't even have tone controls.

Well, yes I have. Quite likely the world's best stereo systems are made only a short distance from where I live.

 

[alonso]

John Boy, now that you mention it, i can´t stand listening to the new Rush single in my car, the only thing I hear is distortion and high frequencies, I know that my car system is the biggest piece of crap out there but everything else is heard fine on the radio, only when that song gets played I have to change station because it sounds so squashed, and distorted that I can´t listen to what´s going on.

 

[scottr]

In my opinion, it doesn't make sense to leave your EQs flat. After all, are you listening to music through your monitors? Probably not. So chances are your speakers probably drop off pretty badly on both ends.. Use your EQ to fix it a little bit.

Scott

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

I use EQ in the car, but have never ever needed it on my home stereo system...... the speakers there are definitely NOT "missing anything"!

 

[regebro]

Listening flat means listening with as a flat frequency response as possible. Not listening with the knobs in the center.

An chances are that even with the knobs at the center your home stereo system will *not* drop at the high and low ends. Instead many hifi speakers are today made with a built in "loudness" curve, to sound "better" in the shop.