Can't Get Guitar to sound right when recording

[Simplex09]

Simplex, do you really think what you are recording is anywhere close the the real thing?

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Play that, then play your recordings and tell us what YOU think the differences are.

Well if I was to describe the differences I would say his tone is very thick sounding and more depth than my tone. Plus the clarity of his guitar sounds much better and by that I mean it dosent sound like a distortion mess. And the volume sounds bad in my clip like I feel like I have to crack the volume to hear it. Better in these clips than pages back but not there. But even if i record them on my phone and listen back at a later time on my phone im cracking the volume on max. Of course I don't use my phone speaker for recording/editing.

I always read online that his tone had a bunch of highend and mids, so I see a bunch of covers of trebble 10 mids 10 and bass quite low like 3. Now from my understanding and what has been talked about on the couple of pages back mostly guitar amplifier sound difference pre room setup if that makes sense. Like getting a good tone in a home studio dosent mean that you can go to a professional studio and get the same sounding tone with the same settings.
Long story short.. just because it works for someone else dosent mean the same settings works for another person.

So I'm still a beginner of course, what would you suggest to fix it keep the mids / trebble quite far down like 5-6 but keep it bassy? Would there be a chance its a volume problem like the amp should be louder? Or another question I have is is cracking the gain on the audio interface ideal? Like I have the sm57 about 12 oclock (top) is it better to record it quiter and add the volume through normalize/gain in the daw?

Thanks for your help! I do watch a lot of YouTube videos on this subject but sometimes you can't watch/learn everything from videos.

 

[60's guy]

The first three didn't sound bad until the 0:20 mark when the "effect (???) kicked in. The guitar sounded passable. Not my taste, but it had some bottom.

Be careful what you wish for, man.
This thread should have ended forever ago. Yet, here we are. We're either suckers for a sham, really trying to help this person, or masochists. OR all three.
Personally, I'm waiting on a pizza. Before the pizza comes, I'm just gonna unfollow this charade.

I love pizza.

 

[Simplex09]

Do you really think that he's gonna listen to that? FFS, we haven't even heard him sing yet. It's the same originally recorded lithium riff repeated over and over and over again with different amp dial positioning and STOMP pedal mashing.

IMO, this thread is an insult to every well intentioned new member and HR.

It's a good thing that I'm not a mod.

I'm about to start a singing thread ?lol I'm joking

 

[60's guy]

I'm about to start a singing thread ?lol I'm joking

Spare us.

 

[Simplex09]

Spare us.

Anyways I'm done joking around about singing not even myself I want to hear myself sing lolol, I'm sorry for any troubles I know I'm a bit of a pain asking so many questions but I do appreciate you + everyone elses help.

 

[TalismanRich]

I would say stop asking people where the knobs should be, how much treble to use, etc. You have ears. Start with the plain guitar. If yours is too bright and thin, start turning knobs until it gets close. Stop with the two microphones and concentrate on one, probably the SM57. A hundred thousand guitars have been recorded with that mic. Put the AT in the box for now.

ONLY when you get a straight guitar close to your target (swap between the two to confirm) THEN start working on the distortion. Then turn those knobs.

It's impossible for anyone who isn't there to say what knobs to turn and where to place the mic and what pickup to use with any certainty. Your amp and guitar are different from Cobain's. You don't know what the soundman who was catching the mic feed did to the settings, or what the mix engineer did the the settings when they did the video. All you can do is try to mimic the sound you hear. Your ears are most important tool you have.

 

[60's guy]

Thread is like watching a cat or dog running in circles to catch it's own tail.

 

[rob aylestone]

Our friend displays certain characteristics that make me pretty sure he might (and I apologise if wrong, sincerely) be on the spectrum, based on how he seeks information, rejects most and persists. The requirement he has for precision and detail suggests that his learning process is a bit different to the others in this topic.

A few of us decided early on to continue to help. If anyone doesn't wish to take part, there is no requirement to read this topic any longer. If my suspicion is correct, then some comments are lacking a little empathy, and need to stop. No rules have been broken, so pleas to lock the topic are not based on any substance. I repeat - don't read the topic, and move on.

There is, of course, a possibility there are other reasons for the topic being a difficult one, but I feel no need to make assumptions.

 

[Old Music Guy]

If my suspicion is correct, then some comments are lacking a little empathy, and need to stop.

I'm sorry you feel that way, Rob. I believe that I, and I speak only for myself, have tried to be helpful with advice.
I think it's a little bit of a stretch with your "spectrum" remark. I'm not a medical professional, and I would never make an assumption like that anytime, anywhere, anyhow even if I was. If anything, a remark like that is presumptuous and demeaning.
It may be of more value to have a little empathy for those of us that have offered advice, only to end up going down a rabbit hole.

 

[DM60]

I'm sorry you feel that way, Rob. I believe that I, and I speak only for myself, have tried to be helpful with advice.
I think it's a little bit of a stretch with your "spectrum" remark. I'm not a medical professional, and I would never make an assumption like that anytime, anywhere, anyhow even if I was. If anything, a remark like that is presumptuous and demeaning.
It may be of more value to have a little empathy for those of us that have offered advice, only to end up going down a rabbit hole.

The only reason for this site is for rabbit holes. Otherwise, what is there to discuss except the value of an amp going to 11 verses 10?

 

[Simplex09]

I would say stop asking people where the knobs should be, how much treble to use, etc. You have ears. Start with the plain guitar. If yours is too bright and thin, start turning knobs until it gets close. Stop with the two microphones and concentrate on one, probably the SM57. A hundred thousand guitars have been recorded with that mic. Put the AT in the box for now.

ONLY when you get a straight guitar close to your target (swap between the two to confirm) THEN start working on the distortion. Then turn those knobs.

It's impossible for anyone who isn't there to say what knobs to turn and where to place the mic and what pickup to use with any certainty. Your amp and guitar are different from Cobain's. You don't know what the soundman who was catching the mic feed did to the settings, or what the mix engineer did the the settings when they did the video. All you can do is try to mimic the sound you hear. Your ears are most important tool you have.

I do agree with your point now! It seems like there is no cheat sheets to where the knobs should be to get a better tone. So I have this weekend off I want to try and get something better sounding then what I have posted before. Over the last few days I wanted to make some changes how I have been recording in the past to see if it will help improve the tone of things. One of the speakers I was recording the other night it has revered phase of it I noticed that in the DAW because the phase was reserved. I also did what you suggested and worked on the clean sound then move on to the ds1

So I have two audio files that I recorded just tonight I'm not 100% happy myself with them yet I'm going to do some more messing around with them tomorrow but I wanted to upload the results here. After listening to the recording I think the DIS knob on the DS1 needs to be rolled back a little bit more but there is a bit more clarity there then before. If I go back and listen to the audio from even a few days ago in my opinion the tone has more depth to it, So I would say that its getting a bit better. I also aimed for about -17ish db when setting the gain and just normalized it in DAW see if it was to much gain in the past from my understanding it gives you a bit more headroom especially when x2 or more mics. I was trying to aim for about >12db before so I wanted to try that and see if that makes a difference.

I have uploaded some pictures of my settings to this post;

 

[rob aylestone]

One guitar. One mic. Advanced techniques get applied later IF, and only IF, it will make an improvement. You seem to have one area where improvement is needed, and its not technical. You need to be able to listen to a sound and compare it with another. Too bassy? Too trebbly? A really good thing to do is visit a busy guitar shop where people grab a guitar off the hangers, plug them in and play them through whatever amp is available, with no pedals. See if anyone even fiddles with the amp settings, or uses the one everybody uses to compare tone.

The record process is really simple and does not involve aiming for ANY dB value. Plug it in, twang it the loudest you will play, and set the input gain so it does not distort at that loudest level. Then press record and play the song. The level will be quite a bit lower than maximum, but with modern gear and digits, adding gain later isnt a problem.

You mentioned you used two mics and didn't notice one was reversed. Reversed or not reversed is a question for your ears. I have never needed two mics on a guitar cab, and am not a fan of two on a snare drum to be honest. I certainly understand why some people do it, but I am not one of them.

Red lights and distortion are bad. Hiss from too low a gain setting are bad, but it leaves you a huge area in the middle where gain simply means tweaking a knob with no ill effects.

As a side comment on amp eq, i am trying to sort out my store. Bursting at the seams and a real mess. I found 4 different amps. Two combos, and two heads and cabs. All just put away after a session or live event. Totally random tone control settings. Each one must have sounded ok when used. No idea what was plugged into them.

Well, the recordings do reflect the amp settings. Treble 10, mid similar, bass lower. Sounds exactly like that. It sounds like early punk rock tone just wants somebody yelling over the top. It is not remotely similar to the band who created that song.

In the first clip, the tuning is very, very obvious. The concern is that you cannot hear it. We know your playing is still a work in progress, but all the suggestions we make are because your current state of aural acuity is quite low. You are reading about techniques that your ears cannot evaluate. We dont mind listening to your stuff, but you need to also be listening yourself. Go back through the comments in this topic, and ask yourself if you can hear what we comment on?

You are on a train journey, avidly looking at trip advisor telling you about the wonderful places on the route, but you've not even noticed you got on the wrong train.

You need to train your ears to appreciate tone and tuning. You need to compare your sound with professional recordings. Until you can do this, do not even get a microphone out!

 

[Papanate]

You are on a train journey, avidly looking at trip advisor telling you about the wonderful places on the route, but you've not even noticed you got on the wrong train.
You need to train your ears to appreciate tone and tuning. You need to compare your sound with professional recordings. Until you can do this, do not even get a microphone out!

This has got to be a prank.

 

[Old Music Guy]

I ... am not a fan of two on a snare drum to be honest.

As a drummer, I would always use two mics on a snare: one batter, one resonator. What is absolutely imperative though is to remember that the mics be 180o out of phase.
I use 57s. If you think in terms of the diaphragm, the batter head is going to receive sound as a "reflection" of a stick hit. The resonator is going to receive sound "directly" from the batter head.
That is, the batter head mic diaphragm will move in the opposite direction of the resonant head mic diaphragm.
The reasoning for this is that you can "filter out" (i.e. gate) the hi hat out of the batter head mic, while still retaining the resonance of the snares.
Not necessary live, but recording is different.
That is why mic phasing is so important. Two out of phase mics are going to sound very thin and shrill with no body whatever. Same for guitar mics.

 

[bouldersoundguy]

I use two mics on a snare and I never worry about polarity because the sound of the bottom has almost no resonant elements. It's pretty much just the white-ish noise of the wires. And I high-pass it so what little it has in common with the top is further reduced.

On a guitar cab, I definitely check polarity and time alignment of two mics, tweaking by ear as needed.

 

[Old Music Guy]

I high-pass it so what little it has in common with the top is further reduced.

My kit is a 1999 DW Collector Series. The snare is a 10 ply/10 lug maple PDP, 5 1/2 x 14 with maple hoops top and bottom. I like my batter tight, but there's no warmth to it unlike the DW shells. I could get the warmth I want from the snare with some compression and a high end roll off (300 - 400Hz). Having the reso head micd let me add a little high end. It's a PITA, but, it got me there.
Now I use an eKit and Cubase. Way easier at my age

 

[Old Music Guy]

On a guitar cab, I definitely check polarity and time alignment of two mics, tweaking by ear as needed.

Do you use 2 mics on a speaker cabinet with one speaker?

 

[RFR]

For me, the only time I’ll use two mics is when I want to capture the room sound.

A 57 on the speaker and a condenser a few feet away….blend to taste

 

[bouldersoundguy]

Do you use 2 mics on a speaker cabinet with one speaker?

I have done that, usually at different distances, hence time alignment.

 

[60's guy]

For me, the only time I’ll use two mics is when I want to capture the room sound.

A 57 on the speaker and a condenser a few feet away….blend to taste

Yup. Placing another mic 6' from the sound source yields a 5 millisecond delay..... a Poor Man Delay minus the pedal. ?