Budget Les Pauls

Jeff_D

Jeff_D

New member
I'm looking at picking up a decent, lower end Les Paul; I've been looking at Epiphones on CL for $300~$400. I also have a good friend (and former bandmate) that has a Tradition S20 that he'll give up for $300. actually, that guitar has been sitting here at my house since our last band split, so I've been using it lately to practice. The Tradition is made in Indonesia, but its a solid wood body and it plays ok. I still need to go and actually play an Epiphone. I haven't done that yet.

No matter what I end up with, my plan is to replace the pickups. Right now I have a Strat that I modified to have a pair of bumbuckers and a 3way switch; its got a Seymour Duncan Screamin Demon in the bridge position and a Pearly Gates at the neck. So, I'm gonna take those and put them in the Les Paul. Then, I have a set of EMGs (an 81 and 85 IIRC) that I picked up used that I'll put in the Strat so the Strat will be my "backup".

So what are your thoughts on Tradition? It seems to play fine and it looks good. It just sounds a little muddy, but I think the pickup swap will take care of that. Any thoughts on how it would stack up against an Epiphone? What other knock off brands should I be looking at? Oh yeah, I play mostly fast punk rock.
 
Buy the Guitar You Want

Don't screw around with how much. Save for what you want. Play the guitar if it sounds how you want it buy it.

If you don't you will never be satisfied and spend as much money swapping guitars or changing pick-ups or what not when you could have just bought what you wanted.

I know for experience.
 
ocnor said:
You also might want to check out an Agile AL-2000.
http://www.rondomusic.com/electricguitar-ss7.html
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Thanks Ocnor. Those remind me of the Xavier stuff from GuitarFetish.

Sky Blue Lou said:
There is only one Les Paul. It is made by Gibson. It is not a budget guitar.


lou
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I know I'm not getting a real Les Paul. I'm getting a guitar thats shaped like a Les Paul and I'm fine with that. The Gibson model is not in the budget for the foreseeable future. Although, I have been gradually collecting instruments that I intend to keep and pass down to the kiddos. Right now, I'd say budget is $500 to $600 tops.

Fistful of Dave said:
Don't screw around with how much. Save for what you want. Play the guitar if it sounds how you want it buy it.

If you don't you will never be satisfied and spend as much money swapping guitars or changing pick-ups or what not when you could have just bought what you wanted.

I know for experience.
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To be honest, I'm fine with the chevy instead of the cadilac for now. At this point, I'm pretty confident that I could be satisfied with a Epiphone or knock off. The Tradition has actually been sitting here for about the last three years. I've been playing it through a little practice amp in my den when I don't feel like going downstairs and playing through me 'real' amp. I think it feels ok, but I haven't played a bunch of other LP's to really compare. I've been playing my strat for the last 6 or 7 years now. I DO need to get the local Guitar Satan and play some different guitars.

The pickup swap wont cost me anything other than a couple hours. I already have the pair of Semour Duncans from the strat and the EMGs are in another guitar that will probably get kicked down to the kids for a toy, lol.


Really, I'm just curious if anyone has an opinion on how the Tradition or any of the other knock offs (Xaivier, Agile, etc) stack up against the Epiphone model (I know it won't really stack up against the Gibson model). I believe the Epiphones are made in china now, which made me think there might be other less popular made-over-seas names that would get me better bang for the buck. Someday, I'll have a couple g's to drop on my dream guitar, but it isn't happenin anytime in the near future... :D
 
Sky Blue Lou said:
There is only one Les Paul. It is made by Gibson. It is not a budget guitar.


lou
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Although I understand the sentiment, your statement is not strictly true. Heck, it's not true at all.

Gibson wholy owns Epiphone. Also the right to call a guitar a "Les Paul." Gibson can, and does, license the name "Les Paul" to it's subsidiary, Epiphone.

Gibson, and Epiphone, each have made several models of "Les Pauls." Additionally, thousands of each model have been produced, over the years.

When speaking of guitars, there are thousands, perhaps tens of thousands, of "Les Pauls."

Now, if we are talking about the man, 'tis true, there is only one "Les Paul." Well, actually, there are something over 100, according to whitepages.com.

QED, mother fucker!
 
Ain't you special. It figures that you own an Epiphone. My statement stands. If it doesn't say Gibson on the headstock it's not a Les Paul no matter what the manufacturer or owner chooses to call it. You are only fooling yourself.


lou
 
Sky Blue Lou said:
Ain't you special. It figures that you own an Epiphone. My statement stands. If it doesn't say Gibson on the headstock it's not a Les Paul no matter what the manufacturer or owner chooses to call it. You are only fooling yourself.


lou
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Chill, Lou. There are indeed many guitars which have "Les Paul" engraved, printed, or decaled on the headstock. Some are more pricey than others. I bought my black Custom for $350 in 1978; it would be a bit more pricey now.
 
There are lots of great guitars out there. I have learned from experience that the name on the headstock doesn't always insure a quality instrument. I have many guitars and they all are unique. I have an '82 Hagstrom Swede with original humbuckers on it and it sounds great. It has a beautiful neck and mahogany construction, neck and body. I have never felt the need to suppliment my collection with a Les Paul because of it. As much as I would like to own one, I have played many and found my Hagstrom to be as nice if not superior to many of them. Epiphone makes some nice instruments and like any guitar, each is different and you need to find the one that appeals to you. When you find a guitar that fits your style, it won't matter much what the brand is. A great guitar is a great guitar, regardless of brand. For what it's worth, that's my experience and my opinion. I bought a Fender Squier CV series telecaster that is beautiful. Incredible. I have friends who went and bought the same after they played mine. I bought a Hondo Strat copy at Goodwill for $20.00 and this is a really nice guitar. I was elated and pleasantly surprised to find how nice it is to play. I know...Hondo? Really? Yeah! It could use better pickups, but the body is ash ( I think, not plywood) and the neck maple with rosewood and it is really, really nice. So.... what's in a name? I have a '73 Strat and it's marvelous, but every guitar I own is nice and has a personality worthy of praise.
Play on!
 
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I think Lou's point is that "lower end Les Paul" is not a description you would/should apply to a Les Paul copy (Tradition) or an Epiphone Les Paul, which are not actually real Les Pauls.

If you say the phrase "Les Paul" it universally means Gibson.

This is not to deny that those of you playing either Les Paul copies or Epi Les Pauls are not playing fine instruments that you're quite happy with, and that all (real) Les Pauls are fantastic.

If Gibson choose to chase a different market by licencing the design to Ephiphone, who they own, then fine, but it's a form of brand diulution, and annoys the owners of Gibson Les Pauls (including me)....
 
Another LP-style guitar without the bloated Gibson price is the Hagstrom Swede.

They are solid mahogany bodies/necks. The Select versions come with maple caps and real maple binding (very sweet).
They sound really nice and play faster than any LP...IMHO...thanks to the Hagstrom neck & H-truss rod design.

I have several of the reissues...Standard, Select and Super...including 3 original/vintage Swedes. You can find some very good/low prices for the reissues if you are willing to shop eBay...but they are actually very well-built guitars.
The stock pickups on the reissues sound quite good.
 
ggunn said:
Chill, Lou. There are indeed many guitars which have "Les Paul" engraved, printed, or decaled on the headstock. Some are more pricey than others. I bought my black Custom for $350 in 1978; it would be a bit more pricey now.
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I'm cool. I'm not making a value judgment on Epis or copies. There are some nice ones out there. Probably the most famous copies are Slash's Appetite for Destruction guitars. Even Gibson mentions them with respect. The thing is that, as Armistice mentioned, the model name "Les Paul" means one thing and one thing only to guitarists and collectors. It is not acceptable to call an Epi or Orville a Les Paul without the qualifier. Any other builder's piece would be called a Les Paul copy.

Just keeping it straight. The OP knows what I'm talking about - no slam intended.


lou
 
I don't own any, but I've played, and been impressed by LP copies branded 'Vintage' in the same kind of price range as the Epiphone Models.

A former bandmate used to play a 1980s Aria Paul-copy which had a magnificent tone.
 
Jeff_D said:
Thanks Ocnor. Those remind me of the Xavier stuff from GuitarFetish.
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The Agiles actually aren't bad for the price - a bunch of guys at the site I run own some of their guitars and love them, and the ones I've played have all been solid. And Kurt, the guy who owns Rondo, posts occasionally and has really done a tremendous job with customer service. Every once in a while a problem with one of his guitars will pop up, and he's gone up to bat every time I'm aware to make it right. If you're looking for a cheap LP clone, they're not a bad place to start.

Also worth a look - it's not really a "les paul" style guitar, but I've been absolutely blown away by the PRS SE Singlecut I picked up not long ago - for the price, it just rules.
 
Sky Blue Lou said:
I bought a 20th Anniversary Black Beauty Custom for the same in the same year. Sold it for $600 ten years later. DOH!!!

I'm still kicking myself for that one. I've paid $1000 - $2400 for the three I own now.


lou
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Was that the one with three 'buckers? I always wanted one of those after I saw the one with the Bixby on it that Niel Young played.
 
ggunn said:
Was that the one with three 'buckers? I always wanted one of those after I saw the one with the Bixby on it that Niel Young played.
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Mine was 2 pup. The "Black Beauty" moniker may have originally meant the 3 pup (I'm not sure) but I see it used for the 2 pup all the time. Black LP Custom - usually aka "fretless wonder". They are starting to fetch some big bucks.


lou
 
Sky Blue Lou said:
Mine was 2 pup. The "Black Beauty" moniker may have originally meant the 3 pup (I'm not sure) but I see it used for the 2 pup all the time. Black LP Custom - usually aka "fretless wonder". They are starting to fetch some big bucks.


lou
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My black LP Custom was a fretless wonder when I bought it, but I couldn't play it with those tiny frets. I had it refretted with jumbos pretty soon after. I guess I ruined its collectability when I did that, but that is a non-issue for me since it will never be for sale.

It was the 3 'bucker version that I always heard referred to as a Black Beauty back in the day, but more recently I've heard the term more generally applied.
 
I played an Epi LP with a 60's neck at Long and McQuade last year and was very surprised at how nice the neck felt. I have smallish hands so the thinner neck was cool. Try one out if you have the chance. I can't remember the price....

I've heard many people change the pickups. And sometimes many other parts. I guess it would depend on how much you wanna spend. You'd still be below a Gibson though, price wise.
 
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