Are they any factories in the USA making recording tape anymore??

[briank]

Because their target market was high-end professional machines which can handle a very high operating level (ATR tape was originally specced as +11 tape IIRC), e.g. Studer, Ampex and Otari multitracks or stereo mastering decks.
Not all machines can actually bias up that high and the TASCAM machines like the TSR and MSR series were intended to run +6 tape (456, SM911 or other equivalents). Maybe the MSR-24 can run at nearly double its factory specified operating level, maybe not. You'd likely get a lot more crosstalk if you did.

Alternatively, you could just leave the machine set to +6 and see what happens if it's fed ATR tape. It might work quite nicely, but I don't think that's how the tape is designed to be used

Nonsense, ATR works fine at +6, though you get a little higher noise floor of course. ATR runs quiet in my experience and you can get away with +6. It's not like the analog world will end if you run a tape a few dB below what it's optimized for. ATR also claims a broad bias tolerance as well. I like to hit it at +9 (I'm using a pro wide track MCI machine) and on my machine at 15ips +9 I like about 3.5db overbias. They claim +10.5 capability but I wouldn't necessarily suggest going that high with a loud percussive source or if there's any risk of your levels getting away from you due to the risk of print through even if the stuff is meant to allow good headroom, may as well go +9 and not have to nanny the levels quite so much. Actually, ATR claims to work well at a variety of levels, that's one nice thing about it. If you're wanting a tape you can smash and get all compressy then ATR probably isn't your top dog anyway, it's pretty clear, spit-shined sounding stuff. Bottom line is if TASCAM MAN is calibrating and biasing for 499 with no prob on his machine then ATR shouldn't be an issue as far as operating level or biasing is concerned.

It's the excessive oxide schmear that you have to worry over. YMMV on that but it's been a problem for me, way too much "hang on guys, the high freqs are getting dull, I have to clean the tape path...again..." I shall be having another word with His Spitzness before I endeavor to roll any more ATR on my machines, what a shame, very nice guy and his tape really does sound superb when the path is clean. Maybe he ought to call it +9 tape and ease up on the freakin' oxide slatherfest, I dunno lol!


But yeah, if you want to run +6 on a tape that's intended for no more than +6 on a +6 machine then SM911 would be the currently produced tape for that.

 

[TASCAM MAN]

Well ....would one of you please tell me more about what/who/where is SM911 ?!?!?!?

 

[jpmorris]

Actually, ATR claims to work well at a variety of levels, that's one nice thing about it. If you're wanting a tape you can smash and get all compressy then ATR probably isn't your top dog anyway, it's pretty clear, spit-shined sounding stuff. Bottom line is if TASCAM MAN is calibrating and biasing for 499 with no prob on his machine then ATR shouldn't be an issue as far as operating level or biasing is concerned.

Fine. If the machine is set up for 499, it should be able to run ATR nicely. I'll have to take your word for it on ATR running okay at +6, though.

Well ....would one of you please tell me more about what/who/where is SM911 ?!?!?!?

Well, I thought we'd been through this already, but to be clear - RMGI are one of three firms currently making open reel tape. The others are ATR and Zonal, but Zonal only make 1/4" tape and are almost impossible to obtain outside the UK.

RMGI currently manufacture SM468, SM911 and SM900. SM911 is equivalent to Ampex 456, and SM900 is equivalent to Ampex 499. All these tapes are the old BASF formulations, that were made by BASF and later EMTEC until 2002 or so. RMGI bought the rights to these formulations and reissued them in 2007. They were made in the Netherlands until recently when production was transferred to Pyral in France earlier this year.

I'm not sure what the prices are like in the US, but in the UK ATR tape costs double or more the price of RMGI tape.

You might find this handy: RMGI Americas - Distributors of Analog Recording Tape
Also: RMG International: The Masters of Tape - Recordable Media Group

 

[TASCAM MAN]

Fine. If the machine is set up for 499, it should be able to run ATR nicely. I'll have to take your word for it on ATR running okay at +6, though.



Well, I thought we'd been through this already, but to be clear - RMGI are one of three firms currently making open reel tape. The others are ATR and Zonal, but Zonal only make 1/4" tape and are almost impossible to obtain outside the UK.

RMGI currently manufacture SM468, SM911 and SM900. SM911 is equivalent to Ampex 456, and SM900 is equivalent to Ampex 499. All these tapes are the old BASF formulations, that were made by BASF and later EMTEC until 2002 or so. RMGI bought the rights to these formulations and reissued them in 2007. They were made in the Netherlands until recently when production was transferred to Pyral in France earlier this year.

I'm not sure what the prices are like in the US, but in the UK ATR tape costs double or more the price of RMGI tape.

You might find this handy: RMGI Americas - Distributors of Analog Recording Tape
Also: RMG International: The Masters of Tape - Recordable Media Group

OK JP thanks for clearing that up for me YES YES YES !! I think I'll look into the RMGI tape real soon cause Im getting the itch to start "rolling some tape" !!!

 

[jpmorris]

OK JP thanks for clearing that up for me YES YES YES !! I think I'll look into the RMGI tape real soon cause Im getting the itch to start "rolling some tape" !!!

Oh, in the interests of full disclosure, there was a problem with RMGI tape when it was first reissued, it wasn't being cured properly and it would shed a lot on certain transports. This seems to have been largely worked out by now, and I've not had any problems with it on the MSR-24 and Studer A807.
My TSR-8 has seen shedding on a handful of tapes but I think it's an issue with the guides on that particular machine since as I say, the other two machines are fine with it.

 

[briank]

I'm not sure what the prices are like in the US, but in the UK ATR tape costs double or more the price of RMGI tape.

Seriously? Ouch! In the US, the price difference is nominal. ATR costs maybe 10% more than RMGI here, not a big difference.

Anyway, in summary,
If you want the modern equivalent to 499 which is a super high output tape tape, look at ATR Magnetics or RMGI SM900 which are modern super high output tapes.
If you want the modern equivalent to 456, which is a high output tape, look at RMGI SM911 which is a modern high output tape.

Caveats: RMGI just changed their manufacturing operations as stated and I haven't heard any reports about the new French made stuff, though if you're getting the Dutch made stuff made in recent years, I haven't heard any horror stories and that's probably what's still in stock everywhere, and ATR may or may not shed excess oxide on your machine. Neither are going to be sonic twins to 499 or 456, they are not direct copies, but are respective equivalents to your Quantegy tapes in terms of operating level and rough overbias requirements.

For dealers, look at US Recording Media which handles ATR and RMGI, Full Compass which sells RMGI, Vintage King sells ATR, and ATR also sells direct. Just google any of them for pricing and whatnot, pricing should be similar everywhere. There are other dealers too, but I know the ones I mentioned to be respectable.

 

[TASCAM MAN]

Seriously? Ouch! In the US, the price difference is nominal. ATR costs maybe 10% more than RMGI here, not a big difference.

Anyway, in summary,
If you want the modern equivalent to 499 which is a super high output tape tape, look at ATR Magnetics or RMGI SM900 which are modern super high output tapes.
If you want the modern equivalent to 456, which is a high output tape, look at RMGI SM911 which is a modern high output tape.

Caveats: RMGI just changed their manufacturing operations as stated and I haven't heard any reports about the new French made stuff, though if you're getting the Dutch made stuff made in recent years, I haven't heard any horror stories and that's probably what's still in stock everywhere, and ATR may or may not shed excess oxide on your machine. Neither are going to be sonic twins to 499 or 456, they are not direct copies, but are respective equivalents to your Quantegy tapes in terms of operating level and rough overbias requirements.

For dealers, look at US Recording Media which handles ATR and RMGI, Full Compass which sells RMGI, Vintage King sells ATR, and ATR also sells direct. Just google any of them for pricing and whatnot, pricing should be similar everywhere. There are other dealers too, but I know the ones I mentioned to be respectable.

Thanks man , very informative info !!!

 

[jpmorris]

Seriously? Ouch! In the US, the price difference is nominal. ATR costs maybe 10% more than RMGI here, not a big difference.

I wish I was exaggerating. It looks like Stanleys' have some kind of exclusivity deal or something - it would probably be cheaper to import it myself.

I'll have to double-check whether Stanley's include tax, because that would make it a bit more sensible, but I highly doubt it as they're very much a pro-oriented seller (they sell filmstock too) and most of their customers will be able to claim the tax as expenses, hence the prices are usually listed without.

The firm I usually buy tape from sells 1/2" SM911 at about £41 each and SM900 at about £38. Stanley's don't sell it, but a 1/2" roll of ATR is £95. By comparison, a roll of 1" SM911 is about £71, and SM900 is £84.

 

[TASCAM MAN]

I wish I was exaggerating. It looks like Stanleys' have some kind of exclusivity deal or something - it would probably be cheaper to import it myself.

I'll have to double-check whether Stanley's include tax, because that would make it a bit more sensible, but I highly doubt it as they're very much a pro-oriented seller (they sell filmstock too) and most of their customers will be able to claim the tax as expenses, hence the prices are usually listed without.

The firm I usually buy tape from sells 1/2" SM911 at about £41 each and SM900 at about £38. Stanley's don't sell it, but a 1/2" roll of ATR is £95. By comparison, a roll of 1" SM911 is about £71, and SM900 is £84.

Could you please translate this in American dollars!!???!!!

 

[jpmorris]

Could you please translate this in American dollars!!???!!!

It looks like it's $1.6 to the pound at the moment. A good rule of thumb is to multiply by 1.5 since it's usually about that.

IOW:
1/2" SM911 is $66 ($79 with taxes), 1/2" SM900 is $63 ($75 with taxes), this from Studiospares. They also sell 1" SM911 for about $115 ($138 with taxes).

1/2" ATR is $153 ($183 with taxes), and a 1" roll would be $259, or with sales tax, $310.

Incidentally you can make google do this, by searching for something like "150 gbp in usd" or similar - it will calculate it from the current interest rates.

 

[TASCAM MAN]

It looks like it's $1.6 to the pound at the moment. A good rule of thumb is to multiply by 1.5 since it's usually about that.

IOW:
1/2" SM911 is $66 ($79 with taxes), 1/2" SM900 is $63 ($75 with taxes), this from Studiospares. They also sell 1" SM911 for about $115 ($138 with taxes).

1/2" ATR is $153 ($183 with taxes), and a 1" roll would be $259, or with sales tax, $310.

Incidentally you can make google do this, by searching for something like "150 gbp in usd" or similar - it will calculate it from the current interest rates.

Thank you my friend