Lt. Bob
Spread the Daf!
Don't blame you.
TheRealWaldo
New member
Okay, now obviously I'm passionate about this, because, well, I love music. Now, let's put it on the line with a Q & A.
Q: Do you want us to use NWR exclusively, and support it exclusively.
A: NO! I want you to do what you do, and support MUSIC as a whole. Do what you can, and what you want. Go where you want. I'm not going to stop if you don't support NWR.
Q: Should I blast every other site, and tell people I won't listen unless they are on NWR?
A: NO! I've said this before! It would not be fair to anyone!
Q: Will NWR disapear if I don't do something?
A: NO! I'll find a way, no matter what, to keep it going. Short of me dying, or losing absolutely everything, nothing will stop me from doing this!
Q: Will NWR improve?
A: Hell yes! I'm constantly wheeling and dealing. I've scooped a great deal on new servers and lines, and I'm trying to raise enough cash to pay for them. It WILL happen, and some of the options I've posted will just help speed up the process. I've applied for jobs working in kitchens and crap I hate doing, to come up with the cash, and even if no-one pitches in, I'll foot the bill.
Q: Can I volunteer?
A: You can volunteer anything you want. I've had three volunteers over the past 5 years. 1 helped out with coding on NWR3 (Thanks JZela!), 1 volunteered to help out with design on NWR4, even though we haven't got to that point yet (Thanks SonicGirl!), and 1 is currently volunteering to help out with the NWR P2P design, in fact, took on the whole project, saving me dozens of hours that I could put into other things (Thanks Chad!). The rest of you, a fair portion of you, don't have the time, and donated cash, I thank you very much!
Q: Why are you so bitchy Waldo?
A: Well hell, sorry if it comes across that way. But, look at your own posts sometimes, regarding what you are passionate about... I'm passionate about the independent movement, and music. It's my dream to make a dent in the current system. I believe it is a quagmire of marketing and structured BS to make money. And I believe that ALL musicians and their music should be treated fairly and given a chance to be heard....
Anyways, if you have more questions for me, ASK! Let's clear up issues NOW. I want to work WITH YOU, more than 'for you'.
W.
Q: Do you want us to use NWR exclusively, and support it exclusively.
A: NO! I want you to do what you do, and support MUSIC as a whole. Do what you can, and what you want. Go where you want. I'm not going to stop if you don't support NWR.
Q: Should I blast every other site, and tell people I won't listen unless they are on NWR?
A: NO! I've said this before! It would not be fair to anyone!
Q: Will NWR disapear if I don't do something?
A: NO! I'll find a way, no matter what, to keep it going. Short of me dying, or losing absolutely everything, nothing will stop me from doing this!
Q: Will NWR improve?
A: Hell yes! I'm constantly wheeling and dealing. I've scooped a great deal on new servers and lines, and I'm trying to raise enough cash to pay for them. It WILL happen, and some of the options I've posted will just help speed up the process. I've applied for jobs working in kitchens and crap I hate doing, to come up with the cash, and even if no-one pitches in, I'll foot the bill.
Q: Can I volunteer?
A: You can volunteer anything you want. I've had three volunteers over the past 5 years. 1 helped out with coding on NWR3 (Thanks JZela!), 1 volunteered to help out with design on NWR4, even though we haven't got to that point yet (Thanks SonicGirl!), and 1 is currently volunteering to help out with the NWR P2P design, in fact, took on the whole project, saving me dozens of hours that I could put into other things (Thanks Chad!). The rest of you, a fair portion of you, don't have the time, and donated cash, I thank you very much!
Q: Why are you so bitchy Waldo?
A: Well hell, sorry if it comes across that way. But, look at your own posts sometimes, regarding what you are passionate about... I'm passionate about the independent movement, and music. It's my dream to make a dent in the current system. I believe it is a quagmire of marketing and structured BS to make money. And I believe that ALL musicians and their music should be treated fairly and given a chance to be heard....
Anyways, if you have more questions for me, ASK! Let's clear up issues NOW. I want to work WITH YOU, more than 'for you'.
W.
TheRealWaldo
New member
Guernica> Sorry for not answering quicker. Still need about 10 more orders of the color shirts paid for before I can put down the deposit. Quite a few have said they are 'mailing' the payments, so lets hope the post is quick, or more folks w/ paypal get into it.
The b&w shirts should start shipping on Monday (next), as I'm supposed to recieve them on Friday.
Toki987> Sign shirt? Huh?
W.
The b&w shirts should start shipping on Monday (next), as I'm supposed to recieve them on Friday.
Toki987> Sign shirt? Huh?
W.
Toki987
Rock Steady
TheRealWaldo said:
hehehe, sure why not. jus put a lil W in a corner somewhere. I`ll tell them your famous.
Well, aren`t you?
TheRealWaldo
New member
I'm nobody! And to prove it, I'm gonna post one of my wack ass 'remixes'!
W.
W.
Toki987
Rock Steady
TheRealWaldo said:
Your such a bundle of energy today!! thats a cool thing
Guernica
Active member
....again, this is meant w/ a ....and totally constructive:
Re: contributions.... Ive been a paying member here for the past year or so, and offer to do things like buy $40 t-shirts because I enjoy what youve done and want to do whatever i can to help you and your "business" continue to thrive. I dont however consider it my responsiblity to help keep your business afloat... ...and to be honest, It seems a little unfair to ask for that. ...again, mho. I dont want to volunteer, and I dont want to just contribute money. I would just like to pay for a service that i want. ...I dont think thats unreasonable.
I know you do the best you can Waldo. ...and i hope you dont take any of this personally, because it definitely is not meant that way. Youre a great guy, and Nowhereradio is a great product... ...but the solicitation makes me a little uncomfortable.
very sincerely, g
....and totally constructive:I totally respect your willingness to do this because you want to and because you are passionate about it. But, If I submitted a price for a project to be done, and couldnt come through... for whatever reason..... .....you can bet that i would catch hell for it. ....and IMO, understandably. Providing a service and being paid for it is what a service-oriented business is about. That was probably a bad comparison to bring up on my part, because you are considered a peer here, and i understand that you do it because you enjoy it as well. But, from a business standpoint... and from the standpoint of a business seeking to make a profit..... ...Im sure you can understand why some folks here (myself included) are concerned.
Re: contributions.... Ive been a paying member here for the past year or so, and offer to do things like buy $40 t-shirts because I enjoy what youve done and want to do whatever i can to help you and your "business" continue to thrive. I dont however consider it my responsiblity to help keep your business afloat... ...and to be honest, It seems a little unfair to ask for that. ...again, mho. I dont want to volunteer, and I dont want to just contribute money. I would just like to pay for a service that i want. ...I dont think thats unreasonable.
I know you do the best you can Waldo. ...and i hope you dont take any of this personally, because it definitely is not meant that way. Youre a great guy, and Nowhereradio is a great product... ...but the solicitation makes me a little uncomfortable.
very sincerely, g
TheRealWaldo
New member
Once again G, It's NOT "MY" BUSINESS, in fact, I don't look at it as business at all! Like I said, if I did, I CERTAINLY wouldn't be doing it for free!
Read carefully, it's ALL OF US, working TOGETHER! That's supposed to be the point! If I wanted to make money, things would be MUCH different!
I don't want to turn this into a 'pay or get nothing' system, it counteracts so many of the things we're trying to do!
p.s., when have I solicited anything? I don't advertise or post ANYWHERE, unless questions are posed!
W.
Read carefully, it's ALL OF US, working TOGETHER! That's supposed to be the point! If I wanted to make money, things would be MUCH different!
I don't want to turn this into a 'pay or get nothing' system, it counteracts so many of the things we're trying to do!
p.s., when have I solicited anything? I don't advertise or post ANYWHERE, unless questions are posed!
W.
B.SABBATH
New member
O.K.
I notice the tone of your response was much different than mine.. I tried to word it gently.. I will try to be more blunt like you.. (no offense please)
you said - In nearly 5 years, NoWhere has been down a total of 37 hours. 8,760 hours in a year, meaning 43,800 hours in 5 years. Do the math. 'Down more than any other site?' Please!
Do you think I'm making this up? The fuckin site is down more than any other site I visit.. Whatever the numbers are, it's down more than any other site I visit.. I've checked Nowhere every single day since I got a computer and joined this site.. It's been down at least 37 hours since I joined a little over a year ago.. I do not believe it is up 99% of the time.. Even if it was, what do you count as being up? I would say more than half the people I have sent there could not hear my music.. These are normal non BBS people who don't know shit about Winamp or anything like it.. I believe it has been down way more than 37 hours in 5 years..
Samij, look back in the past. NEVER did I start ANY Of these threads. OTHERS did, and I've had to step in and defend. YOU GUYS are the ones who keep bringing up that NWR is 'critical', AND I have to come in to explain what's up, which again gets taken out of context!
Of course you didn't start any of these threads.. They are started to try and find a solution to a repeating problem..
HOW MANY TIMES HAVE I TOLD PEOPLE NOT TO START THREADS LIKE THIS HERE?
When I first started coming to this site, I felt like if my music wasn't on Nowhereradio, people wouldn't listen to it.. Where did I get that idea? From people saying "people would listen if you were on Nowhere." You didn't have a problem with those posts.. I didn't really have a problem with that until Nowhere started going down all the time.. Look at that other fuckin thread I started.. Someone recommended another option and everyone flipped out.. That's bullshit!! The more options the better.. With each of these threads comes more knowledge..
You said - Waldo appears and states that the server may be permanently dead. (Yep, server would be permanently dead, HOWEVER that would mean the database would move over to the second media server, and NWR would go ON, but would be offline for as long as a week while changes were made, ALOT of you missed that)
Untrue. I started that thread and you did not mention it being temporary until the worried posts started coming in.. If you had, I would not have started that thread.. I even supplied a link to your original post when you said "it might be permanent." *period* There was no silver lining in your original post, and I mad sure of that *before* I started the 'what do we do now' thread.
I undestand what your trying to do, and I hope you don't hate me because I do appreciate what you do..
However, your not the only one who loves music and is passionate about it.. I am so passionate about it that I get pissed off whenever Nowhere is down..
I paid for my second year of infinite Nowhere space even though I knew I would be starting my own website soon.. It is my way of showing appreciation for what you've already done.. I stopped referring people to Nowhere because 'shit ain't right yet.' You have to admit it man.. Let's keep it real brother..
I hope my account doesn't get deleted because I have a new song that's almost done..
I notice the tone of your response was much different than mine.. I tried to word it gently.. I will try to be more blunt like you.. (no offense please)
you said - In nearly 5 years, NoWhere has been down a total of 37 hours. 8,760 hours in a year, meaning 43,800 hours in 5 years. Do the math. 'Down more than any other site?' Please!
Do you think I'm making this up? The fuckin site is down more than any other site I visit.. Whatever the numbers are, it's down more than any other site I visit.. I've checked Nowhere every single day since I got a computer and joined this site.. It's been down at least 37 hours since I joined a little over a year ago.. I do not believe it is up 99% of the time.. Even if it was, what do you count as being up? I would say more than half the people I have sent there could not hear my music.. These are normal non BBS people who don't know shit about Winamp or anything like it.. I believe it has been down way more than 37 hours in 5 years..
Samij, look back in the past. NEVER did I start ANY Of these threads. OTHERS did, and I've had to step in and defend. YOU GUYS are the ones who keep bringing up that NWR is 'critical', AND I have to come in to explain what's up, which again gets taken out of context!
Of course you didn't start any of these threads.. They are started to try and find a solution to a repeating problem..
HOW MANY TIMES HAVE I TOLD PEOPLE NOT TO START THREADS LIKE THIS HERE?
When I first started coming to this site, I felt like if my music wasn't on Nowhereradio, people wouldn't listen to it.. Where did I get that idea? From people saying "people would listen if you were on Nowhere." You didn't have a problem with those posts.. I didn't really have a problem with that until Nowhere started going down all the time.. Look at that other fuckin thread I started.. Someone recommended another option and everyone flipped out.. That's bullshit!! The more options the better.. With each of these threads comes more knowledge..
You said - Waldo appears and states that the server may be permanently dead. (Yep, server would be permanently dead, HOWEVER that would mean the database would move over to the second media server, and NWR would go ON, but would be offline for as long as a week while changes were made, ALOT of you missed that)
Untrue. I started that thread and you did not mention it being temporary until the worried posts started coming in.. If you had, I would not have started that thread.. I even supplied a link to your original post when you said "it might be permanent." *period* There was no silver lining in your original post, and I mad sure of that *before* I started the 'what do we do now' thread.
I undestand what your trying to do, and I hope you don't hate me because I do appreciate what you do..
However, your not the only one who loves music and is passionate about it.. I am so passionate about it that I get pissed off whenever Nowhere is down..
I paid for my second year of infinite Nowhere space even though I knew I would be starting my own website soon.. It is my way of showing appreciation for what you've already done.. I stopped referring people to Nowhere because 'shit ain't right yet.' You have to admit it man.. Let's keep it real brother..
I hope my account doesn't get deleted because I have a new song that's almost done..
TheRealWaldo
New member
In parts of the post above I mentioned how EXTERNAL things can cause some people not to be able to access a website. i.e., any server in your routing path (or other peoples) might go down, those which I do not have control over. I cannot count that, simply because at any given moment, ANYWHERE in the world, on ANY site, people will not be able to access it. This is a problem with the Internet as it functions now.
What I can count as downtime, is where NOBODY can access the site, meaning the servers, or the lines connected directly to them are down.
As far as people who cannot access because they don't know software, well I try to make things simple for them (hence the FAQ's and such), but I can't make everyone happy. Hell, my MOTHER, who just got her first computer last year, and had never surfed the internet, e-mailed me to tell me she found this cool site that was easy to use, and had some cool music on it... She didn't even know that I ran NWR!
Yet, even I hate the way I put together NWR3... That's why I'm hoping that NWR4 will address MANY issues.
And I have addressed the solution many, many times, repetatively. It gets annoying when I have to say it over and over 'It's being worked on' waisting valuable time where I could be working on it!
In fact, right now, as I am typing this, I should be on the phone making the final negotiations with the new co-loc facility to get everything ready for the END OF THIS MONTH!
Do you remember the post that mixmkr (i think) posted, regarding 'lets boycot every other site but NWR' and I posted saying NO!!! Can't say I don't have a problem with them. I certainly can't catch every single one though! I even just posted that again in the QA session I started!
I didn't flip, I did post that the timing was pretty bad. And you even see me defending the guy after. As far as others reactions? I can't control you, nor anyone else.
You started ANOTHER thread. The original thread was removed by administration, or by the poster (I don't know who) which is where I posted that. I gave a notice that 'Worst case scenario, NWR will be offline for a week or two until I can come up with the cash for a new one, of find another way'
In your thread, I told people to go to the NWR forums where I posted about the situation, what the solutions were, etc. etc. and if you went there, you would have read exactly what I stated. Here's a link again to where it all started: http://media.nowhereradio.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=news;action=display;num=1041231300
I'm not going to hate you for speaking what's on your mind. And I'm not going to do something as childish as removing your account for it!
WE are all in this together. I'm not the one who benefits the most, if at all from this. It's the GROUP of us.
As far as 'keeping it real', trust me bud, it's more real for me than most can imagine!
W.
Pedullist
Stop it, I can't breathe
Lt. Bob said:
See all the smiley faces?! ......
EDIT: This thread is a very interesting example of how a thread can start on one subject and morph into an entirely different discussion.
It was the morphing that confused me! It made my brain feel like yoghurt.
Thanks for this post, Lt. Bob...I now finally understand the whole deal about wildcards. And I agree with you too! Seems very logical, your story. Thanks
(of course, I admit: I agree with anyone who uses the name 'Zappa' more than once in his posts
)
DavidK
New member
It is Cyan's version of a song that has that " Special Something". Almost intangible, but you know ( or think you know) it is there.Pedullist said:
Nowhere works pretty well for me, I usually download.
Cyan, your a bright young man, but are a bit confused about the music biz, especially now with Clear Channel. A bunch of crap is out there selling well, it has nothing to do with "good or bad". Do you actually think they are playing the new Lisa Marie Presley tune because it is good? No, it's a business thing. Music on the radio is a business deal, case closed.
Pedullist
Stop it, I can't breathe
There was an article in Rolling Stone magazine....perhaps I misread it but they (record companies) sometimes pay $300.000,- to get airplay... 
DavidK
New member
Yup, it's called Payola, or these days, Pay2play.Pedullist said:There was an article in Rolling Stone magazine....perhaps I misread it but they (record companies) sometimes pay $300.000,- to get airplay...
I have a friend who is a DJ for a Clearchannel station. I went down and did an interview for TSO last year, and I really learned a lot about how it works.
You can thank Colin Powell's son for this. He is the top dog at the FCC, and catering to big business means we are going to be listening to eighteen-year olds with a supercharged autotune and some lame-ass dance steps for a long time
fprod south
Member
I think NWR feels like it's down a lot because we mixing clinic people use it so much. Add to that, everytime it's down someone points it out in a post. So everytime it goes down we hear about it.
chrisharris
King of Bling
I just d/l'd 8 tunes...no problems. Yup; works like a champ...except whenever JamesArgo posts something...for some reason, his posts break NWR.
Look, I know Waldo doesn't have the pipes to steam 200Kbps for 10 people at a time. I could pay $98 per annum for that somewhere else, or (much easier) just put my tunes up on the band's server, but what fucking fun is that? At the risk of sounding like a human being, I totally love and appreciate what NWR stands for. Despite the dressing, it's NOT a business (at least not one that anyone other than a tax dodger would keep running to offset huge profits elsewhere, lol) - so I don't expect it to run like a well-tuned Ford Factory 24/7.
Waldo's one of the few in "the business" that's not a hypocrite. He has a vision, he has things that he hates, and he's trying to do something different. He may not be able to keep it going for 2 more months, or he may keep the site running into 2055. At least I feel comfortable knowing that as long as NWR IS still running, it'll operate under a set of principles that won't change for the worse.
I feel bad that Waldo has been relegated to a not-for-profit server administrator, b/c I think his vision for NWR is uniquely UNRELATED to being an IT whipping boy... I mean, the site isn't called "nowheremp3.com," it's called nowhereRADIO; Imagine internet radio worldwide AND POPULAR, that anyone could have a shot at tapping into. You wouldn't need $5,000 for a one shot during drivetime, you wouldn't need a quarter of a million for nationwide maximum rotation; you wouldn't even need a freakin' STUDIO!! All you'd need is an mp3.
I've done next to nothing to help this utopian idea work; I pay a paltry subscription fee to host some mp3's there; I still owe Waldo a mic that I haven't shipped to Canada yet, so I guess I'm slacking, but one thing I'm NOT gonna' do is bitch about NWR's technical issues. You CAN'T compare it to SoundClick or MP3.com unless you want it to start BEING one of those sites. Yes, they run like clockwork (if you can get past the signups and the spam and the popups), but that's what they're designed to do...solely. I'll take Waldo raging against the machine any day.
So all I'm saying is, whether NWR is around for another 2 months or another 2 decades, the least we can do is stop beating up on the guy that's paying more than any of us to make it work.
**end of soapbox portion of post**
Rage on, Waldo...I appreciate what you're trying to do, and I know I can always take my "business" elsewhere.
Look, I know Waldo doesn't have the pipes to steam 200Kbps for 10 people at a time. I could pay $98 per annum for that somewhere else, or (much easier) just put my tunes up on the band's server, but what fucking fun is that? At the risk of sounding like a human being, I totally love and appreciate what NWR stands for. Despite the dressing, it's NOT a business (at least not one that anyone other than a tax dodger would keep running to offset huge profits elsewhere, lol) - so I don't expect it to run like a well-tuned Ford Factory 24/7.
Waldo's one of the few in "the business" that's not a hypocrite. He has a vision, he has things that he hates, and he's trying to do something different. He may not be able to keep it going for 2 more months, or he may keep the site running into 2055. At least I feel comfortable knowing that as long as NWR IS still running, it'll operate under a set of principles that won't change for the worse.
I feel bad that Waldo has been relegated to a not-for-profit server administrator, b/c I think his vision for NWR is uniquely UNRELATED to being an IT whipping boy... I mean, the site isn't called "nowheremp3.com," it's called nowhereRADIO; Imagine internet radio worldwide AND POPULAR, that anyone could have a shot at tapping into. You wouldn't need $5,000 for a one shot during drivetime, you wouldn't need a quarter of a million for nationwide maximum rotation; you wouldn't even need a freakin' STUDIO!! All you'd need is an mp3.
I've done next to nothing to help this utopian idea work; I pay a paltry subscription fee to host some mp3's there; I still owe Waldo a mic that I haven't shipped to Canada yet, so I guess I'm slacking, but one thing I'm NOT gonna' do is bitch about NWR's technical issues. You CAN'T compare it to SoundClick or MP3.com unless you want it to start BEING one of those sites. Yes, they run like clockwork (if you can get past the signups and the spam and the popups), but that's what they're designed to do...solely. I'll take Waldo raging against the machine any day.
So all I'm saying is, whether NWR is around for another 2 months or another 2 decades, the least we can do is stop beating up on the guy that's paying more than any of us to make it work.
**end of soapbox portion of post**
Rage on, Waldo...I appreciate what you're trying to do, and I know I can always take my "business" elsewhere.
TheRealWaldo
New member
P.S. Chris, the new lines that I just put the deposit on today should be able to handle around 500 people listening synchronously to a 128kbps stream... Unfortuneatly, that comes at a price, but the plans to overcome this are all there! I'm crossing my fingers that they work.
The downside? Free users will be on the same old (slow) line. I couldn't afford two new servers on the lines for them.
W.
The downside? Free users will be on the same old (slow) line. I couldn't afford two new servers on the lines for them.
W.
Guernica
Active member
Point taken Chris,
Im having a problem w/ the "not a business" aspect of this though. So Nowhere is a hobby? There is no intention of future growth for profit? If so, he deserves an award.... not so much for good sense.... ..but certainly for dedication to his hobbies. Waldo said that he turned down "millions" of dollars so that he could push Nowhere to be all it could be and not sell-out to corp. music. I read that to mean "Ive got something good here, and I can make it work on my own". I admire that, but nobody turns down dollars like that cause they like fucking w/ computers. It "is" a business, and he wants to see growth in his creation.....both creatively and financially. ...and there certainly isnt anything wrong w/ that!! Thats the american way, and I both admire and respect it. .....so enough with the "public radio" stuff. Radio stations make their dough from sponsors and advertisement. They "are" businesses intended to make a profit. I know that Nowhere is growing, and Im sure its hard to get good advertisement and sponsors for a young company. I am sympathetic to this..... and fully supportive, hence my willingness to contribute (membership, T-shirts, etc.). .....but it seems every time i read a Nowhere post in here, someones asking for money, free services, etc. Im not an investor, nor do i want to be. I just want a good product for a fair price.
My complaints are meant to be constructive. Successful businesses evolve from professional business practices. .....and nobody would like to see million dollar success for Nowhere radio like I would .........except maybe waldo.
Im having a problem w/ the "not a business" aspect of this though. So Nowhere is a hobby? There is no intention of future growth for profit? If so, he deserves an award.... not so much for good sense.... ..but certainly for dedication to his hobbies. Waldo said that he turned down "millions" of dollars so that he could push Nowhere to be all it could be and not sell-out to corp. music. I read that to mean "Ive got something good here, and I can make it work on my own". I admire that, but nobody turns down dollars like that cause they like fucking w/ computers. It "is" a business, and he wants to see growth in his creation.....both creatively and financially. ...and there certainly isnt anything wrong w/ that!! Thats the american way, and I both admire and respect it. .....so enough with the "public radio" stuff. Radio stations make their dough from sponsors and advertisement. They "are" businesses intended to make a profit. I know that Nowhere is growing, and Im sure its hard to get good advertisement and sponsors for a young company. I am sympathetic to this..... and fully supportive, hence my willingness to contribute (membership, T-shirts, etc.). .....but it seems every time i read a Nowhere post in here, someones asking for money, free services, etc. Im not an investor, nor do i want to be. I just want a good product for a fair price.
My complaints are meant to be constructive. Successful businesses evolve from professional business practices. .....and nobody would like to see million dollar success for Nowhere radio like I would .........except maybe waldo.
TheRealWaldo
New member
I turned down the money because they wanted to turn it into a commercial crap house, completely opposite of why I started it!
If I wanted to make money off of this, I would have taken that offer and ran! I will NEVER EVER see that kind of money out of NWR.
W.
If I wanted to make money off of this, I would have taken that offer and ran! I will NEVER EVER see that kind of money out of NWR.
W.