another in need of preamp suggestions

[pandamonk]

You know as much as I do about the RNP cos I've never used one.

The rep is very good as you've probably found yourself.

I've not really found a great deal, but pohaku said it was one of the good ones in the bunch i listed earlier. I've read a little, and everything sounds good to me(pun intended).

 

[Kevin Deschwazi]

Yeah I've only heard praise for the rnp.

The M Audio stuff is really very good for the money, I used the Delta 1010LT for a few years and was very happy with it.

I can't comment on the ESI stuff, it uses WDM drivers though which aren't as good (in terms of latency) as the newer ASIO drivers which the Delta uses.

 

[pandamonk]

Yeah I've only heard praise for the rnp.

The M Audio stuff is really very good for the money, I used the Delta 1010LT for a few years and was very happy with it.

I can't comment on the ESI stuff, it uses WDM drivers though which aren't as good (in terms of latency) as the newer ASIO drivers which the Delta uses.

Everything seems better with the M-audio, cept the price. But it isn't hugely more, so i think i'll get that.

Cheers Kevin

 

[pohaku]

The RNP is a very good all around useful preamp. I have one and use it quite a bit, even though I also have preamps that would be considered "better" in some respects (Millennia, API, Pendulum, A-Designs). For @$500 you get 2 channels, separate channel ramping 48v phantom power and polarity reverse, DI, and channel inserts. Plenty of gain (66db) for all the usual mics, including ribbons (at least in my experience with an AEA R84 and the usual Beyer ribbon mics). Although it doesn't have as low a noise floor as some preamps, in actual use, I haven't found this to be a problem -- even with ribbons.

It has a bit of character -- it isn't as transparent and clean as my Millennias, for example, but not so much character that it can't be used and work very well for most applications. We aren't talking about a Germanium pre here. You can use the inserts to couple it with the RNC and/or RNLA compressor/limiter and get finer gain control as well as balancing the RNC or RNLA. Voila, instant channel strip and a very nice high quality entry level set-up for not a lot of money (at least in terms of pro audio). Used RNPs go for about $425 or so around here and are reasonably plentiful. Check out the Gearslutz classifieds as they sometimes come up there. I purchased mine used. Bought one RNC new and one used to go with it.

 

[bubbagump]

I guess maybe be should re-ask the question. What do you want? I thought you were after 8 channels under $1000. If you want a single or dual channel pre just as a gold channel, that is a whole other mess.

 

[pandamonk]

I guess maybe be should re-ask the question. What do you want? I thought you were after 8 channels under $1000. If you want a single or dual channel pre just as a gold channel, that is a whole other mess.

Well i'd like 8 channels, consisting of 4 different dual preamps, so i have a bit of variety. Atm I'm considering the goldmike, and the rnp, as both seem to be pretty good. Any more suggestions? Also i said £1000, but this is just an estimate. I wouldn't really wanna spend too much more, but will spend a bit if needed. I haven't got any money atm, so will have to save hard!

 

[bubbagump]

Then I have to agree witht he gang. A bunch of 2 channels all for under $1000 isn't worth it.

 

[pohaku]

Actually the amount available is 1,000 GBP which is about $1,874 USD. Kind of puts the OP on the edge where he could get some decent stuff for that amount, but 8 channels with variety and quality is pushing it. Basically, IMHO, the decent solid state stuff you can get at that price point will also be pretty similar in sound and performance (Sytek, RNP). The DAV BG1 would be an exception in that it runs more to the clean and transparent sound where comparable units would include Millennia and Grace which are more expensive.

There isn't too much available in the way of good tube gear at that price point. Peavey VMP-2 (used only as they are discontinued), Groove Tubes (GC was blowing out the Brick here over the holiday weekend for $200 or so) and perhaps the Goldmike pre. Sebatron is probably the next tier up and could be affordable if used. Groove Tubes did make the MP-1 which was a single channel half rack tube mic pre. They can sometimes be found used for @$250 or so. I have a couple of them and they are nice. It is more on the clean hifi sound type of tube gear though. I can certainly understand wanting to get a variety of pres to expand the palette, but at the current price point, there are limited quality options available.

I guess my bias here is to get a couple channels of pretty good preamps to go with the firepod and acquire others as money permits, rather than to get 8 channels of so-so preamps that you will want to replace in a year or two and which will have then declined significantly in value. Even at the @$250 a channel price point, however, your options for quality pres that will truly sound different will be somewhat limited. Keep in mind that the difference in sound between different pres, even really expensive ones, is a lot less distinctive than the difference in sound between mics. Nuanced is probably a more appropriate descriptor. Whether you are able to hear some of those differences will depend on the rest of your recording chain (especially your monitors) and your room. You might want to take this a bit more slowly and listen to what you are actually getting for your money as you go along, rather than jumping in with both feet (and 8 channels of additional pres) all at once.

 

[pandamonk]

Actually the amount available is 1,000 GBP which is about $1,874 USD. Kind of puts the OP on the edge where he could get some decent stuff for that amount, but 8 channels with variety and quality is pushing it. Basically, IMHO, the decent solid state stuff you can get at that price point will also be pretty similar in sound and performance (Sytek, RNP). The DAV BG1 would be an exception in that it runs more to the clean and transparent sound where comparable units would include Millennia and Grace which are more expensive.

There isn't too much available in the way of good tube gear at that price point. Peavey VMP-2 (used only as they are discontinued), Groove Tubes (GC was blowing out the Brick here over the holiday weekend for $200 or so) and perhaps the Goldmike pre. Sebatron is probably the next tier up and could be affordable if used. Groove Tubes did make the MP-1 which was a single channel half rack tube mic pre. They can sometimes be found used for @$250 or so. I have a couple of them and they are nice. It is more on the clean hifi sound type of tube gear though. I can certainly understand wanting to get a variety of pres to expand the palette, but at the current price point, there are limited quality options available.

I guess my bias here is to get a couple channels of pretty good preamps to go with the firepod and acquire others as money permits, rather than to get 8 channels of so-so preamps that you will want to replace in a year or two and which will have then declined significantly in value. Even at the @$250 a channel price point, however, your options for quality pres that will truly sound different will be somewhat limited. Keep in mind that the difference in sound between different pres, even really expensive ones, is a lot less distinctive than the difference in sound between mics. Nuanced is probably a more appropriate descriptor. Whether you are able to hear some of those differences will depend on the rest of your recording chain (especially your monitors) and your room. You might want to take this a bit more slowly and listen to what you are actually getting for your money as you go along, rather than jumping in with both feet (and 8 channels of additional pres) all at once.

Yeah, well I'm thinking of just getting a couple, the goldmike and the rnp, when i start out, along with the firepod, and I'll buy a couple more expensive when i get used to recording with these and feel the need/have the money for more.

I will be using M-Audio LX4 5.1 surround monitors, mainly so i can mix in surround, even though they won't be great quality speakers. But for a lot of it, i will be using a pair of NS10 copies, with better low end than NS10s, for mixing. I ill also use headphones for reference, i find i can hear the small things i wouldn't notice with speakers. Saying that, i've never mixed in a room with good acoustics.

I will be spending a great deal on quality acoustics in my 7'x8'(slightly smaller) room. I will have a lot of bass trapping, and broadband absorbtion in the first reflection points, with absorbtion covering the back wall and behind the speakers.

I will be seeking advice soon for mics. I'm planning on SPB1s for overheads, acoustic guitar vox etc, maybe splash out on a few more mics for vocals, because mics can sound great with one person, and awful with another, so i'd like a variety, lol. And then a few of the usual, SM57s for snare, toms, amps etc. bass mic(s) D112 etc. Maybe a few cheapie mics to play around with.

 

[pandamonk]

Groove Tubes (GC was blowing out the Brick here over the holiday weekend for $200 or so

Aww i wish someone could have bought one and sent it to me cause in a quick search I've only really found one and it's £350.

 

[pohaku]

You might watch e-bay and see if the price drops significantly. At the local price you quoted, it may be worth it even with shipping. The cost of GT mics dropped some after they were blown out at GC a year or so ago. The GT-44 started going for closer to $200 on e-bay after that -- which is a great deal on that mic.

 

[pandamonk]

You might watch e-bay and see if the price drops significantly. At the local price you quoted, it may be worth it even with shipping. The cost of GT mics dropped some after they were blown out at GC a year or so ago. The GT-44 started going for closer to $200 on e-bay after that -- which is a great deal on that mic.

I checked ebay.co.uk and couldn't find the brick

 

[pandamonk]

I've just thrown together a pic on paint of what the desk should look like. What du think?

Ohh and should i put the sub up between the two NS10 copies?

 

[technominds]

I think he means this...

 

[Kevin Deschwazi]

Something just occurred to me.

Are you sure you can use the firepod and the Delta 1010 to get 16 channels into the same DAW?

I'm not saying you can't but I've never heard of anyone doing it and I've got a hunch it might not be doable.

 

[kojdogg]

Something just occurred to me.

Are you sure you can use the firepod and the Delta 1010 to get 16 channels into the same DAW?

I'm not saying you can't but I've never heard of anyone doing it and I've got a hunch it might not be doable.

yeah i think you're right about that-- mixing the pci interface and the firewire. you can either daisy chain firepods together or use multiple delta 1010's in the same system, but i don't think you can mix the two.

i may be wrong here too, but i'd definitely double check that

 

[pandamonk]

yeah i think you're right about that-- mixing the pci interface and the firewire. you can either daisy chain firepods together or use multiple delta 1010's in the same system, but i don't think you can mix the two.

i may be wrong here too, but i'd definitely double check that

Yeah, i'll check that out before i buy.

 

[technominds]

Something just occurred to me.

Are you sure you can use the firepod and the Delta 1010 to get 16 channels into the same DAW?

I'm not saying you can't but I've never heard of anyone doing it and I've got a hunch it might not be doable.

I use two different soundcards at the same time.. my Layla24 and a Waveterminal... You cant use them at the same time using AISO but using MME and other formats i believe you can. Also, you can get AISO combining plugins that you load seperately, and then choose your inputs and outputs from all soundcards, then select a special 'combined' ouutput and input for your program, i think Adobe does one.

(Im using SONAR by the way)

 

[pandamonk]

I use two different soundcards at the same time.. my Layla24 and a Waveterminal... You cant use them at the same time using AISO but using MME and other formats i believe you can. Also, you can get AISO combining plugins that you load seperately, and then choose your inputs and outputs from all soundcards, then select a special 'combined' ouutput and input for your program, i think Adobe does one.

(Im using SONAR by the way)

I plan on using sonar too, will this be possible d'you think?

 

[Kevin Deschwazi]

I use two different soundcards at the same time.. my Layla24 and a Waveterminal... You cant use them at the same time using AISO but using MME and other formats i believe you can. Also, you can get AISO combining plugins that you load seperately, and then choose your inputs and outputs from all soundcards, then select a special 'combined' ouutput and input for your program, i think Adobe does one.

(Im using SONAR by the way)

That's useful to know