Amplitube and Drums Test. Need Advice.

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bigbubba

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Hi all,

At the urging of SnakeDog, I downloaded Amplitube and after wrestling with it for a while finally got it to work.

Here's a piece that I just did using Amplitube for the guitar. I would appreciate it if you guys would listen to it and give me your opinions.

1 - Do the guitars sound as if they're mic'd? Is this amplitube sound the same as other mic'd sounds you hear? Is this good enough to not have to mic an amp if one of the amplitube sounds is what I'm looking for?

2 - How about the drums? In the beginning, I'm going for a big boom boom or a thum thum banging on some kind of heavy toms. But this sounds like just a kick. How do I get that big bang bang sound of a drummer banging away with all he's got?

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/songInfo.cfm?bandID=419303&songID=3060713

Thanks. :)
 
really enjoyed the tune, Bubba. Nice playing. I'd say guitars sonded pretty good. Drums were a little boomy at times. I liked the tone of them, but I think they hide some of the guitar at times. Nice bass sound also. There just seems to be a bit of boom in the bottom end. But I like the tone of the guitar, and it sounds nice in this tune.
Ed
 
Hehe, you listened to me, that's usually a bad move :p
Anyway, I like the sounds here. Good bass sound, neat guitar tones. I think it worked out well. Did you like the program? If so, I could PM you a bunch of my presets.
Cool playing ;)

I'll answer question #1 since I'm thin on drum knowledge.
#1) B

let me try again...
#1) IMO if you do it right you can get away with using the amp software. I've gotten some pretty good sounds over the last year and fooled a bunch of people. It's neat too how when you have a song recorded, you can easily change the guitar tones to make a brand new sound to a song, whereas when mic'd you are somewhat stuck.
 
SnakeDog - Yeah, acutally I really like the amplitube stuff. Before this I was using the Guitar Suite from http://www.simulanalog.org/guitarsuite.htm. They has some Boss DS-1, SD-1, plug-ins. They also have a JCM900 simulator. Sounds pretty good. And best of all, it's free. It was done as research.

Now I have amplitube stuff. I am not sure if I want to buy it, yet. But I'll use the demo for as long as possible.

And yes, I would like some other cool presets! :) Thanks. :)

Dogman - Thanks. The boom is probably due to the big stadium feel. The reverb and the EQ are introducing a good amount of boom. I did want the drums to be banging. And I don't know how to get rid of the bad boom but keep the heavy thum thum (banging booming drum) sound there. Hoping someone will come along shortly and provide some insight. :)
 
Sounds ok to me, but you won't convince any guitarplayer / drummer. Here's some pointers:

1) The toms in the beginning, they sound waaaaay too much like a drummachine. Mix that velocity and timing up.
2) The boomboom in the beginning sounds too static. Bring small accents on the 1 and randomize the volume up just a little bit.
3) The reverb sounds fairly cheap. Too much hi's in the floor tom reverb.
4) Try a bandpass filter with a narrow band boosted by about 6db and sweep that around in the 100 to 500 hz range untill you suddenly hear the oompfh you're looking for. Maybe another one of those in the 40-100 hz range.
5) The guitar solos sound overly processed. I'd search for a more raw and pure tone, and lay low on the chorus/reverb/delay (at least turn the wet/dry more towards dry).
6) The crunch that starts towards 0:52 sounds overly EQed. With this kind of thing (digitally modeled crunch guitar) I'd stay away from any EQ not already in the modeling plugin.
7) Doubling that track and panning it left/right (not hard) will help aswell.

Hope that helps :)
 
Halion said:
1) The toms in the beginning, they sound waaaaay too much like a drummachine. Mix that velocity and timing up.
Click to expand...
Check! Although, before I go there I am trying to really make it sound like a drummer is banging on floor toms and the snare. Like a heavy bang. Like the boom boom clap in the beginning of "We will we will rock you."

Halion said:
2) The boomboom in the beginning sounds too static. Bring small accents on the 1 and randomize the volume up just a little bit.
Click to expand...
This sounds like this might also help in getting the sound described above.

Halion said:
3) The reverb sounds fairly cheap. Too much hi's in the floor tom reverb.
Click to expand...
That's just the reverb that came with the preset on amplitube. I'm sure I can turn it down. I was kinda going to a pointless Pink Floyd solo and it fit the mood perfect. But it's a good point and that's the kinda feedback I like to hear. :)

Halion said:
4) Try a bandpass filter with a narrow band boosted by about 6db and sweep that around in the 100 to 500 hz range untill you suddenly hear the oompfh you're looking for. Maybe another one of those in the 40-100 hz range.
Click to expand...
It's about time I learnt what this is. Can you explain to me what exactly is sweeping? I mean this is something I've been reading about but never really figured out what is means. How do you sweep in a frequency range. Especially in softwares. I am not asking for a howto necessarily in a particular software, but more on which parameters to use to do what. :)

Halion said:
5) The guitar solos sound overly processed. I'd search for a more raw and pure tone, and lay low on the chorus/reverb/delay (at least turn the wet/dry more towards dry).
6) The crunch that starts towards 0:52 sounds overly EQed. With this kind of thing (digitally modeled crunch guitar) I'd stay away from any EQ not already in the modeling plugin.
Click to expand...
One word: Amplitube. To all of that. Of course, I need to play around more and use it properly. :)

Halion said:
7) Doubling that track and panning it left/right (not hard) will help aswell.
Hope that helps :)
Click to expand...
That really helps. You know, you listen to your own music and you start thinking, "I've finally done it. There's nothing wrong with this one." Then you upload it, go to work the next day and listen to it again with fresh ears and think, "May be I've done it. I need a few more tweaks." Then someone else points out all the little areas that need attention and you finally realize just how much more this needs to be worked on. :)

Thanks again for all your comments. This really does help. :)

Anyone, else?
 
Hey there bigbubba. I liked the tune man, can't wait to hear it finished. Here is a chart of equalization frequencies to help you with your mix. I've learned quite a bit from it, and now I'm a little bit more prepared when it comes time to mix down a track.

http://www.recordingeq.com/Subscribe/tip/tascam.htm

Sweeping means going through the audio spectrum and homing in on a particular band of the signal. Basically, as all the instruments have different core frequencies they produce, if you know what frequency is related to what instrument, you can home in on it and tweak at will. I'm regularly cutting about 2 db from the bass track at 250hz to help separate the bass from the drums, so the mix doesn't sound to muddy. I also cut about 2db from the guitars at 400hz so they don't interfere with the bass signal. These are just settings that I've become comfortable with, and I'm sure once you play around with equalization a little bit, you'll find what suits your tastes best. here is another good link, and much info.... oh so much info:

http://theprojectstudiohandbook.com/directory.htm
 
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It's all got to do with the reference level (of quality) if you ask me. No single engineer has the highest reference level at the beginning of his job/education whatever. You learn gradually untill you find the sound that is the absolute best thing you can get. Ofcourse even than it is partially a taste thing.

Sweeping simply means moving the frequency of a filter. What I usually do to find out if something works for me or not is take a bandpass filter, make the Q fairly narrow (not all the way to the narrowest though), boost it hard (like, 12 db or something) and then start moving it around. If you gradually move the frequency from hi to low (start at like 5 khz) than you will hear a resonance at some points (in any kind of track basicly) and fairly little effect on other points. That's because there is simply more going on at some frequencies than at others. Once you reach the low-mid range, you will hear some really big *whoomph* kind of sound. That's the kind of sound like in my toms, but ofcourse not nearly as much. Just a little. So I pinpoint the spot where the oomph sounds too loud but not super anoying, and then I turn the volume of the bandpass down to about +3 db. Now mute everything and don't listen to your music for a minute. Now listen to the entire mix again. See how the tom suddenly stands out more, without beeing overly oomphy? :)

Same goes for things like guitar growl or snare crack.

On the reverb: the amplitube reverb might be good for guitars but don't use that stuff on the drums. Turn it down a little on the guitars and you're there (= as good as it gets). Try a reverb with less treble. You'll be able to make the reverb bigger and longer without it becomem too much *tshhhhhhhhhhhh* every hit.
 
Radiohead0709 - Thanks man. I like the EQ chart. :)

Halion - Thanks, I really appreciate it. :)

So the "bandpass filter" will be its own plugin in an ideal situation just like a reverb or a chorus plugin? I ask 'coz I've been the "apply low band pass" or "apply high band pass" as one of the option is some other plugins also.

Thanks all for listening and giving suggestions.
 
I've been googling for a "band pass filter" plugin. Is there any recommendations from you guys? Is there any good free plugins. Obviously, one can't go out and buy everything they like so free is good. :)

Thanks. :)
 
Bigbubba...I'm not going to repeat what was already said. Unfortunately, being a drummer, the drum machine lacks through no fault of yours, though Halion gave you some good advice.
Just wanted to let you know I love the tune itself.
 
Guitars sound really fekin good apart from the distorted guitar in the left channel. Drums are a little boomy. Very impressed with the clean guitar tone.
Eck
 
Hey Bubba - great tune.

I like the guitars (clean and distorted) and the mix/paning. This really reminded me of Pink Floyd as soon as it started :D . Sounds like this software has some good plug ins to use.

I like the guitar sound better than the direct overdrive sound you had on your previous track (it wasn't bad - I just like this one better).

BTW - What kind of "drums" are you using ?
 
RAMI - Thanks. I'm glad you like it. As a drummer, what would you use on your kit that would give that heavy band sound that I'm trying to create here. If you don't know what sound, I'm trying to get the "boom" as in boom boom clap in the beginning of "We will we will rock you." But the boom will be a little more reverb'd and slightly heavier and longer in duration if you will. Then I will focus on volume variations. :)

ecktronic - So you don't like the particular dist. sound, or do you think that any dist. sound doesn't belong in this piece. I got a whole enchilada of sounds available under the name of Mr. Amplitube. :)

ido1957 - When I was recording I started with the drums and the keys. After I heard that play, I thought to myself that this sounds very Pink Floyd and I wanted to keep that sound throughout. So I tried hard to play randomly and pointless like Pink Floyd. Ok ok, I know they're talented people that play good tunes but sometimes it would be more about hitting few notes and just creating the mood.

The big boomy sound is something I've been wanting for a while. I actually have a verse of a song written that I'd like this music to be for. The rest of the song will come later. :)

All thanks for listening and for suggesting the improvements, both major and minor. :) I really appreciate it.
 
ido1957 - For drums, I'm using leafDrums. It's free software that will allow you to create patterns and create a song using patterns. It comes with some default sounds. You can add more.

So I use ns_kit which is a huge kit of drum kit samples. It used to be free, now the freely available version is lower quality and higher quality stuff is available for a price or something. Since this is really drums sampled, I think eventually I might be able to get a good sound out of them. I think someone like RAMI could probably make this software and this kit work.

Anyhoo, there you have it. :)
 
Halion - Thanks.

Would my Parametric EQ plugin do as shown in the picture below. I think that is what you guys were talking about.

The band width determine how wide a band it works on.
The center frequency is the frequency around which the band is. And I just change that around and that is sweeping.

That sound right?

Thanks all. :)
 

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