Advice needed w/room treatment and pc noise

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kobuk

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Hi,

I am setting up a home studio and after doing a lot of research on room acoustics I am still confused as to what to do for my situation.

Room dimensions: (see attached drawings below)

Length: 28.5 ft
Width: 11.5 ft
Walls: 5 ft then walls slant towards ceiling
Ceiling: 8 ft
Room open on North side
Stairs in NE corner

The room is an upstairs loft, so it has an open wall to the rest of the house. I know I need to build some bass traps for the corners but I'm wondering what to do about the other side that's open to the livingroom of the house. It also has a Gambrel type slanted ceiling (see pic below).

I'm thinking I probably have some unusual problems to deal with due to the unusual room dimensions. The questions I have are:

1. General advice on where to put the mixing desk and the most important areas to look at for absorption and diffusion.

2. How to cheaply isolate the pc from the room (box,cabinet)

3. What to change on PC that would make the largest difference in reducing PC noise (Foam, Fans, PSU etc.)


Room layout - top view:

https://img487.imageshack.us/img487/4228/studiolayout5fx.gif

Room layout - side view:

https://img481.imageshack.us/img481/905/studiosideview6eo.gif


Thanks,

Sean
 
The easiest thing to do is realize that you're making home recordings and that most folks won't hear any of the problems you're describing. However, given that you're like me and like to ignore that obvious fact...

Get some extension cables, and move your PC physically out of the room. Keep your monitor, mouse, keyboard, etc in the room, but put the tower somewhere else. Downstairs, maybe? In a closet? That will fix your isolation issue and your noise issue.

As far as anything else, I'd advise getting some heavy blankets that you can move around on frames as necessary. They will help to diffuse sound from the reflective surfaces in the room.

The biggest advice I'd have is to simply start recording in your space! You never know - that open area might provide the most excellent ambient reverb... And experimenting with your equipment will tell you more than most of us online can, even if we knew a million more details.

Good luck!
 
Remember, for PC based recording, moving your PC to another room will also require extra cabling to suit the needs of the hardware and to a length suitable for the run. You can find fans that have a low db rating and you can find isolation pads specifically made for the inside of your PC case.


http://www.frozencpu.com/noi-02.html

http://www.frozencpu.com/scan/se=Noise Dampening/se=Fan Silencers/mp=menu_search.html

http://www.frozencpu.com/scan/se=Noise Dampening/se=HDD Silencer/mp=menu_search.html

http://www.frozencpu.com/scan/se=Power Supplies/se=PSU Accessories/mp=menu_search.html

My tentative plans are to: Using the materials listed above, rebuild my PCs into rack mount cases, purchasing the best/quietest fans I can find and building a Rack to house them in. I'm thinking of using a layered type design on the rack I want to build, basic wood frame with a layer of insolating foam or whatever and an outer wooden finish, treated door, etc on the front and ventialtion panels/access panels on the back. GG it's gonna take forever, but it should be pretty darn cool if it works out right.
 
Some things to consider:

In general larger fans are quieter because they spin at lower RPMs. Consider this when choosing case and CPU fans.

It is possible to buy video cards without fans. I recently got a plain box nVidia GeForce 6200 card for $99 at Fry's with no fan.

It will cost more per gigabyte but you can use laptop drives in a desktop chasis with an inexpensive adapter, saving on drive noise.

Also LCD screens are quieter than CRTs.
 
Bigger fans aren't always logical, or even possible. You also have the option of using a fan controller, there are plenty of 5.25' bay mountable fan controllers where you can turn the RPM down on any size fan. Example: Turn the fans down while you are recording/mixing/mastering. This would take actual testing of the hardware though to make sure it would suit your needs, but a viable option nonetheless.
 
Thx for all the replies.

I have recorded in this space before and that recording is now being played on a local college radio station. Naturally I'd like this next project for the same guy to sound a little better since I know he's going to tirelessly promote it and it could be heard by a lot of people. We tracked the drums in a high end studio so I'd like the guitars and vocals to sound as good as possible.

It's going to be very difficult to move the PC into another room since the room I'm recording in is open to the nearest room. The nearest closed off space is about 40 ft away. There's a landing around the corner from the room that may work but it wouldn't offer a barrier to the recording space.

Creamyapples1, thanks for the links to the pc gear. How well do the various rubber silencer products work? The rack idea seems like a good one. I've seen other people's design somewhere else online and they claim it was dead silent.

I'm still wondering where to place the mixing position given that there is an open wall? I haven't seen any reference to this type of room anywhere else.
Is there a rule of thumb for distance from walls etc?

thanks,

Sean
 
dkerwood said:
The biggest advice I'd have is to simply start recording in your space!
Click to expand...

Most people (especially those new to the field, not necessarily the original poster, who has some experience) won't know just how valuable this particular statement is. :)
 
maybe you could build a isolation box for your pc? a plywood box, lined with rockwool/fabric, a sealed door, and a ventilation chamber on the back.
 
Sean,

> General advice on where to put the mixing desk and the most important areas to look at for absorption and diffusion. <

See my Acoustics FAQ:

www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html

It's a fair amount to read, but it has the answers to most of your questions.

--Ethan
 
Here's a link to a thread in which I posted a couple of pictures of the isolation box which I built:

https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=185877

As you can see, the box was built as one of the supporting members for my desk. I wish I would have taken pictures during construction like Rick did, but at least I can explain how it works. There are 3 fans drawing cool are in and 3 blowing hot air out. The cool air comes in from the underneath through a series of baffles and is then blown up into the box in front of the equipment. The warm air is sucked up by the fans at the top rear of the box and routed through a baffled vent which is at the side of the box, (spanning the rear underside of the dex between the iso-box and the equipment rack. The box is made of 3/4" MDF, and the door was made using 2 panes of 1/4" glass. There is 12u of rack space inside, enough for two 4u computers, an ethernet switch, a rack mount kvm, and a power conditioner. Cables are routed through the baffles on the side between the iso box and the equipment rack at the left. The whole project is not quite complete, (I still need to make some decent looking monitor stands for example) but eventually I'll post a link to more pictures and details.

The iso-box does a great job of keeping the equipment quiet. There's one thing I still need to improve on however. For the ventilation fans I used the quietest fans I could find (PC power and Cooling fans rated at 20 dbA). While you can't actually hear the fan noise outside of the box, you do get a faint hum from vibration which I believe is due to the fans being screwed directly to mdf parts which then transmit vibration throughout the rest of the box. To combat this, I plan to separate the fans from the MDF using carpet pad, and attaching the fans with a system of rubber band hangers rather than directly screwing them down inside the box. Hopefully then I'll have a dead-silent solution.
 
thx

Thanks again to everyone's advice.

Ethan,

your article helped me to see that I should turn my desk around so that the speakers are facing the open wall. I'm hoping I won't hear any echo off the far wall (30 ft away) as long as I stay closer to the inside of the room I'm in. If I do I'll have to build some baffles to close off the open wall some.

Jeff,

I really like the iso box and rack setup. I'd like to see some close ups of the box where the fans are etc. I can't picture what you mean by baffles when you refer to the inflow and outflow vents.

Another question.

How well do kits with rubber/silicone gaskets for fans etc. like the one Antec sells work to reduce noise?

They claim an 80% reduction in noise, which I find impossible to believe. I've googled for reviews but haven't found any. I'm thinking of getting some gaskets, a couple of quieter fans and some absorbing foam for the inside of the case. Those seem like the cheapest ways to reduce some of the pc noise. The drives also have a pretty loud high pitched noise which I need to address.


Thanks again,

Sean
 
nice lookin iso box you got there jeff. what did you line it with?
 
kobuk said:
I really like the iso box and rack setup. I'd like to see some close ups of the box where the fans are etc. I can't picture what you mean by baffles when you refer to the inflow and outflow vents.
Click to expand...

Here's a rough sketch to show you what I mean by a baffled air intake. Basically this system is under the rack enclosure part of the box. The air flows in through an opening at the bottom rear of the box. The baffles are made of 3/4" MDF which basically makes a "tunnel system" for the air to flow in from the back to the fans which are drawing it in from the front. The more baffles you use, the further the sound is restricted from escaping out the port in the back. I lined the "tunnels" with acoustic foam; not sure how much additional help this really was, but I had the foam so I did it for good measure. Once the air makes it through the fans, it is forced upward through a slot into the main portion of the box. The cool air is then drawn into the front of the computers and hot air is ejected out the back of the computers. The hot air is drawn into a box by three more fans at the top rear of the iso-box, then directed out into a similar (but differently shaped) baffling system attached to the top left rear of the box. This outflow system also serves as a routing path for the numerous cables going into and out of the box.

Once I finish the desk and perfect the fan mounting system I will put together a detailed article with more pictures and diagrams and post a link to it here in the forum.
 

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kobuk said:
How well do kits with rubber/silicone gaskets for fans etc. like the one Antec sells work to reduce noise?

They claim an 80% reduction in noise, which I find impossible to believe.
Click to expand...

I actually used gaskets like this where I mounted my fans in my iso-box. I'm not entirely happy with the solution. I still get a bit of vibration transmitted from the fans to the box, probably through the screws as much as anything. Using the gaskets in a metal PC case along with nylon screws might be better, but I can't imagine they would provide an 80% reduction. The gaskets really seem too thin to reduce the vibrations that travel through them by that big an amount. As I said in an earlier post, I'm going to try to combat the fan vibrations in my box with a layer of carpet foam between the edges of the fans and the wood surfaces they mount to, and use rubber bands through the screw holes of the fans to hold them in place.
 
TravisinFlorida said:
nice lookin iso box you got there jeff. what did you line it with?
Click to expand...

I just glued in gray carpeting in the front where the air comes through the slot (for aesthetics) and continued it around the the spot where the rack rails are attached to the box members. I thought this might cut down some on vibrations transferred to the box from the PCs and the rails. Behind the rails, the walls and ceiling of the box are lined with 1" acoustic wedge foam, and the back door is covered with 2" foam.
 
Forget the rubber gaskets as a first stop - get a low noise PSU, CPU and GPU cooolers first. The gaskets are a minimal return, as are the dampling materials - and I know, because I've got all three - Zalman PSU, mounted on Vantec gasket, Spire Whisperock, Zalman passive heatpipe on the vid card and Spire Soundpad through the case. Seagate HDs FTW.

The soundpad cuts some high end from the noise coming from the case, but not the overall volume really.
 
re: PC noise

Thanks for the input on PC quieting Willybomb.

I opened my case while the pc was running and identified the two biggest culprits as the CPU fan and the hard drives. I have an Antec truepower psu which has audible air noise from the fan but the hard drives seem to be making the loudest high pitched whine. I've seen some enclosures that help to eliminate drive noise but am a little concerned about how safe they are for the drive's longevity.

Seems like an Iso box of some sort might be the best solution for me since I can't remove the pc from the tracking/mixing room. My room is 28 ft long so I'll have to experiment with using different sound absorbing materials/gobos between the pc and the rest of the room first and see if that lowers the noise to an acceptable level.
 
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