Advice needed for Vocal + Acoustic Instrument Mics

[timberp]

Thanks. I was not thinking this through. I want to try doing the singing and playing all at once, and since it sounds like the stereo micing is the way to go for the instruments, I'll need a mixer, so that I can put a an instrument mic on each channel and the voice mic on both channels and feed this into my USB device and on into my laptop. I guess this adds a mixer to my budget. I'll get it all figured out eventually. All the help here is extremely valuable. Any favorite budget mixer (I really only need four channels)?

Thanks again,

Tim

 

[Mark7]

Define budget (in your case).

 

[Lance135]

Thanks. I'm learning a lot from all of this. I hoping that my music is on the more subtle end of the spectrum, so I'll probably opt for the condensers. Clearly I'll have to work on my recording environment once I get my computer/USB interface/mics set up.

BTW, after reading more, I guess I'm not surprised that folks are not raving about the AKG 3000 B, but I thought that there might be more positive feedback on the Rode NT-1A or the Studio Projects C1. For my budget ($400 all together for two mics) I thought that more folks would say good things about these.

Thanks again,

Tim

Yes, you'll definitely learn a lot if you can wade through all the stuff on here that isn't about recording. I've read so much about the C1 & the NT-1A that's positive, I'm sure you won't regret having those microphones. I haven't tried either microphone, myself, but I know that if you don't like them, you won't have much trouble selling them.

 

[cominginsecond]

Skip the Edirol. If you're going to buy a mixer anyway, you don't need mic preamplification, so you can spend that $250 on an interface with four inputs and outputs: the M-Audio Delta 44. That way you can have separate tracks for the vocal and the instruments. If you do it the way you are suggesting, you won't really be able to manipulate the vocals separately from the instruments, and, believe me, you'll want to.

 

[grimy paco]

Make a choice "PICK ONE" Rode NT-1 or Studio Projects C1 both are very good mics for $200.00. I have used them both in the past and eventually moved on to the RODE NTK & Studio Projects T3.Tube is the way to go later if you got the coin.Spend the extra $200.00 on a good pre amp it will make a world of difference.
You should try tracking one at a time it will be worth it in the long run.

 

[timberp]

Skip the Edirol. If you're going to buy a mixer anyway, you don't need mic preamplification, so you can spend that $250 on an interface with four inputs and outputs: the M-Audio Delta 44. That way you can have separate tracks for the vocal and the instruments. If you do it the way you are suggesting, you won't really be able to manipulate the vocals separately from the instruments, and, believe me, you'll want to.

That makes a lot of sense, but I'm afraid that for better or worse I'm stuck with a laptop. I do like the idea of bringing the tracks in separately, but I don't know that it is an option to bring in more than two with USB (don't have firewire).

Thanks. All the ideas are great!

 

[timberp]

Define budget (in your case).

Let me try, without giving my whole life story. When I started this tread, I said that I wanted to budget about $400 for mics. Here is a little more detail:

I have been playing folk music for years, and lately I have gotten more serious about playing and performing. The majority of what I do is folk music for children (although I do ballads, Celtic, etc. too). I do a lot of volunteering where my children go to school, in the community, etc. I really enjoy this, I get a good response from parents and kids, and it keeps me from going crazy with my day job. I'm now at the point where I need to do demo CDs and put songs on my site for the kids. I also need small sound system so that I don't get horse when performing for larger (30 - 80) sized crowds. Anyway, I sold off the misc. stuff I could to raise some money for recording/performing. All told, I'll have about $1,600 to spend on equipment for recording and amplification. I don't expect to have any chunks of similar change for quite a while, so I'm trying to make the most of what I have. At this point, based on all the great input, and some speculation, I am imagining something like the following:

Vocal mic (still mulling over all the great suggestions) $200
Instrument mics (probably matched 603s) $200
USB interface $150 - $250
Powered stereo mixer/preamp (that way I can separate the two channels - need power for the PA) $350???
Speakers $500
Misc. cables, stands, etc. $150

I already possess a decent laptop (USB, but no firewire) and Adobe Audition.

The aspect that still confuses me is the mixer/preamp portion of this. Unless I get powered speakers (seem pricey) I think I will need approximately 200W from the powered mixer. Should I get a cheap powered amp and a separate preamp? One unit that does it all? I'm willing to look at all sorts of solutions, but at the end of the day, my $1,600 needs to get me performing and recording. I'm very open to innovative solutions, and there is clearly a lot of expertise and innovation collected in this group.

Thanks,

Tim

 

[jayster10125]

sorry

I want to follow this thread really closely because it's interesting and is giving me info on what I might need to buy. I don't want to steal the spotlight, I just couldn't figure out how to have the thread notify me without replying!

The music you're playing sounds really interesting. I always enjoyed when a performer like you would come in to my elementary school... (only 5 years ago)

Thanks for all of the great info and advice!

 

[sdelsolray]

Let me try, without giving my whole life story. When I started this tread, I said that I wanted to budget about $400 for mics. Here is a little more detail:

I have been playing folk music for years, and lately I have gotten more serious about playing and performing. The majority of what I do is folk music for children (although I do ballads, Celtic, etc. too). I do a lot of volunteering where my children go to school, in the community, etc. I really enjoy this, I get a good response from parents and kids, and it keeps me from going crazy with my day job. I'm now at the point where I need to do demo CDs and put songs on my site for the kids. I also need small sound system so that I don't get horse when performing for larger (30 - 80) sized crowds. Anyway, I sold off the misc. stuff I could to raise some money for recording/performing. All told, I'll have about $1,600 to spend on equipment for recording and amplification. I don't expect to have any chunks of similar change for quite a while, so I'm trying to make the most of what I have. At this point, based on all the great input, and some speculation, I am imagining something like the following:

Vocal mic (still mulling over all the great suggestions) $200
Instrument mics (probably matched 603s) $200
USB interface $150 - $250
Powered stereo mixer/preamp (that way I can separate the two channels - need power for the PA) $350???
Speakers $500
Misc. cables, stands, etc. $150

I already possess a decent laptop (USB, but no firewire) and Adobe Audition.

The aspect that still confuses me is the mixer/preamp portion of this. Unless I get powered speakers (seem pricey) I think I will need approximately 200W from the powered mixer. Should I get a cheap powered amp and a separate preamp? One unit that does it all? I'm willing to look at all sorts of solutions, but at the end of the day, my $1,600 needs to get me performing and recording. I'm very open to innovative solutions, and there is clearly a lot of expertise and innovation collected in this group.

Thanks,

Tim

Tim,

One thing you might consider is getting a non-powered mixer that can serve double duty, for gigging and for studio work. Get powered speakers for gigging. Check out the Soundcraft folio. Small, decent and cheap. Also, there's an item missing from your studio budget: monitors.

 

[timberp]

Tim,

One thing you might consider is getting a non-powered mixer that can serve double duty, for gigging and for studio work. Get powered speakers for gigging. Check out the Soundcraft folio. Small, decent and cheap. Also, there's an item missing from your studio budget: monitors.

Funny that you should mention Soundcraft. I was just on their site. After some more reading, from what I can tell, it is not that I need a stereo mixer, but rather that I need a mixer that has a pan function, so that I can direct one 603s to the right channel and one to the left channel and the vocal to both channels. It looks like most of the powered mixers don't even have a pan from what I can tell. Anyway, I like your advice about just getting a non-powered mixer. Then I can get to business on the recording and look for an inexpensive amp on ebay. Not that I will need a high powered unit. I might even get by with a Soundcraft Powerpad (30W per channel) for a lot of what I will be doing. Or the powered speakers. Thanks for reminding me about the monitor. Now if I can just move enough of the dust bunnies from under the sofa, I might find something else to sell on ebay

Thanks,

Tim

 

[Innovations]

Distinguish between performance and recording micing. For your situation in performance one microphone on you and one on the instrument is standard and fine because the room itself will give the sense of space unless you are playing to a large hall.

For recording the standard setup, as Richard said, would be to track the guitar first in stereo and then record your vocal over than as a separate mono track and then mix in software. Again you only need two channels so a stereo sound module is fine. You could go to a UA-1000 USB2 device and get ten channels, but the price will at least triple.

 

[timberp]

Distinguish between performance and recording micing. For your situation in performance one microphone on you and one on the instrument is standard and fine because the room itself will give the sense of space unless you are playing to a large hall.

For recording the standard setup, as Richard said, would be to track the guitar first in stereo and then record your vocal over than as a separate mono track and then mix in software. Again you only need two channels so a stereo sound module is fine. You could go to a UA-1000 USB2 device and get ten channels, but the price will at least triple.

Sounds good. Am I safe to assume that a single 603s would be fine for performance? As far as the USB goes, I really reluctant to sink much into the USB interface, as I expect that will become outdated pretty quickly. I'll just have to get busy learning to set down the separate tracks.

Thanks,

Tim