Advice for budding guitarists!

[CrowsofFritz]

STOP ASKING FOR TABS!

This may seem harsh, but it's very helpful in the long run. The internet is a great place for sure, but if you're relying too much on it, then you'll be screwed when jamming with others.

Learning by ear doesn't just help you to learn by ear (haha), it also helps you jam with others easier. It's almost like knowing theory... without knowing theory. I don't know how to describe it.

I'm also saying this due to all the begging I'm seeing on Youtube videos. I'm seeing rookies asking for tabs for EXTREMELY difficult flamenco and classical guitar songs... What do you noobs think you're gonna do with those tabs? Certainly not learn the song... correctly at least....

 

[aaronmcoleman]

The only way I know of to become good is to learn in junior high and not have any friends. That way you'll practice a ton! Of my friends who play, only those of us who learned early and had no friends got any good.

Good point, learning by hear is so important for just getting a feel for intervals and sounds. It makes you listen critically to the style, the notes, and the tone.

 

[CrowsofFritz]

The only way I know of to become good is to learn in junior high and not have any friends. That way you'll practice a ton! Of my friends who play, only those of us who learned early and had no friends got any good.

Good point, learning by hear is so important for just getting a feel for intervals and sounds. It makes you listen critically to the style, the notes, and the tone.

Haha, I like the no friends part. Very true! I only had two good friends then.

 

[Justsomeguy]

STOP ASKING FOR TABS!

This may seem harsh, but it's very helpful in the long run. The internet is a great place for sure, but if you're relying too much on it, then you'll be screwed when jamming with others.

Learning by ear doesn't just help you to learn by ear (haha), it also helps you jam with others easier. It's almost like knowing theory... without knowing theory. I don't know how to describe it.

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^ is a MUST! ime as an educator over the past 5 years the problem has gotten worse and worse. my favourite example was a group i had who were learning some crappy Linkin Park track. the vocals in the chorus sounded odd but the singer was definitely singing the right melody at the right pitch so figured it may be the guitars/bass. i had a quick listen to the track and it was obvious that the chord progression in the chorus was slightly different from the verse. i explained this to the group, played them the track, and one of the guitarists said "what are you on about, i'm playing it perfectly along to the tab and it sounds fine to me" in the end i had to convince them that the tab wasn't right (which took 10 long minutes of explaining, listening, playing the part to them) and suddenly it sounded fine.

back in my day (chirst i sound old!) if you wanted to learn a track you either had to buy proper sheet music for it or learn it by ear. there as no shoddy internet tabs or youtube videos of people playing the song in the wrong key or all with power chords on one string!

the other big thing i've seen a lot of in the past couple of years is guitarist learning their favourite new wave metal songs by tab but can't play a standard open chord....or any chords that aren't in drop D...... or even name the pitches of the strings. the danger is that once you get to a certain point with your playing, if you've missed the fundamentals it becomes very hard to go back and learn them/unlearn all the bad techniques you've picked up along the way.

 

[CrowsofFritz]

This ^^^^^^^^^^^^ is a MUST! ime as an educator over the past 5 years the problem has gotten worse and worse. my favourite example was a group i had who were learning some crappy Linkin Park track. the vocals in the chorus sounded odd but the singer was definitely singing the right melody at the right pitch so figured it may be the guitars/bass. i had a quick listen to the track and it was obvious that the chord progression in the chorus was slightly different from the verse. i explained this to the group, played them the track, and one of the guitarists said "what are you on about, i'm playing it perfectly along to the tab and it sounds fine to me" in the end i had to convince them that the tab wasn't right (which took 10 long minutes of explaining, listening, playing the part to them) and suddenly it sounded fine.

back in my day (chirst i sound old!) if you wanted to learn a track you either had to buy proper sheet music for it or learn it by ear. there as no shoddy internet tabs or youtube videos of people playing the song in the wrong key or all with power chords on one string!

the other big thing i've seen a lot of in the past couple of years is guitarist learning their favourite new wave metal songs by tab but can't play a standard open chord....or any chords that aren't in drop D...... or even name the pitches of the strings. the danger is that once you get to a certain point with your playing, if you've missed the fundamentals it becomes very hard to go back and learn them/unlearn all the bad techniques you've picked up along the way.

Nicely put. The good in me wants to help these people learn the basics. The bad in me just wants to tell all the beggars to get lost and embellish the fact that there are enough crappy guitarists and we shouldn't help the crappy ones get as good as us! lol

But I was listening to Carlos Montoya on vinyl the other day. There would probably be some n00bs asking for those tabs, (good thing it's not on Youtube ) and I know it would just be IMPOSSIBLE to learn the song. I'm learning "Carnival of Venice" transcribed by Francisco Tarrega right now. Since I can't read music, I'm learning by ears. It's turning out damn well. I love being able to play with the track! Again, tabs can only give you the SLIGHTEST idea of the song.

 

[Justsomeguy]

Unfortunately my jobs requires that i help these people, and i do try and push people down to road of learning by ear rather than relying on shoddy internet tabs but at times i do just want to scream "FOR THE LOVE OF GOD USE YOUR F*****G EARS AND LISTEN!" especially when you've helped them work out the verse of a track by ear and said "right, i'll leave you to work out the chorus and i'm going to check on the other groups" only to find when i come back they've gone straight onto their smartarsephone and found the worst tab they can in a completely different key and can't hear why the two parts don't sound right together!

my big issue is when people can't hear when a tab is wrong don't get me wrong, i dig out tabs every now and then as a quick starting point, but i normally find within seconds whether the tab is right, close, or well flippin off. i also get irate when i see a tab that's miles off and think "it's ok, i'll look at one of the other google results" only to see that every result it exactly the same wrong tab by exactly the same person on every reputable tab sight

there's sooooooo many great ear training websites on the internet and i only wish that budding guitarists would spend more time on any of these than just hanging out on crappy tab sites

 

[mjbphotos]

And some of those tabs are just SO wrong! Usually prefaced by 'this is my first tab and I don't have a copy of the song so I'm doing it from memory'!

 

[Justsomeguy]

the worst ones are where they're prefaced "i played along with this and it's 100% right" only to be so wrong that the tab for "enter sandman" actually plays like "twinkle twinkle little star"

 

[aaronmcoleman]

some of the tabs are just impossible to read too. I don't know who made them, but most of the emails for the creators are @geocities.com or some other email from 1996.

Welcome to the 90s!

 

[Track Rat]

The only way I know of to become good is to learn in junior high and not have any friends. That way you'll practice a ton! Of my friends who play, only those of us who learned early and had no friends got any good.

Good point, learning by hear is so important for just getting a feel for intervals and sounds. It makes you listen critically to the style, the notes, and the tone.

My god. You just discribed my early life.

 

[YeshuasFan]

Unfortunately my jobs requires that i help these people, and i do try and push people down to road of learning by ear rather than relying on shoddy internet tabs but at times i do just want to scream "FOR THE LOVE OF GOD USE YOUR F*****G EARS AND LISTEN!" especially when you've helped them work out the verse of a track by ear and said "right, i'll leave you to work out the chorus and i'm going to check on the other groups" only to find when i come back they've gone straight onto their smartarsephone and found the worst tab they can in a completely different key and can't hear why the two parts don't sound right together!

my big issue is when people can't hear when a tab is wrong don't get me wrong, i dig out tabs every now and then as a quick starting point, but i normally find within seconds whether the tab is right, close, or well flippin off. i also get irate when i see a tab that's miles off and think "it's ok, i'll look at one of the other google results" only to see that every result it exactly the same wrong tab by exactly the same person on every reputable tab sight

there's sooooooo many great ear training websites on the internet and i only wish that budding guitarists would spend more time on any of these than just hanging out on crappy tab sites

My nephew "learned" to play by tabs. He can't read a note of music and has no clue about other elements of music such as rhythm, harmony, counterpoint, or composition theory--yet somehow he managed to wrangle a music scholarship out of one of the local universities where he lives. The problem was he got cocky in his guitar class and started telling some of the other students the instructor didn't know what he was on about. That of course led to him flunking the class, losing his scholarship, and now he is a dropout.
Of course this is the same twit who thought he needed an SG to learn jazz on--when I told him for good jazz tone he needs a good hollowbody or semi-hollowbody. But of course I've only been playing and writing music for 40+ years so what do I know?
Now the twit thinks because he paid over $3,000 on e-bay to locate authentic period parts to build his own Frankenstrat [because he thinks EVH is the only guitarist worth listening to] that he has what it takes to become a luthier. I told him when he can build an acoustic guitar that ranks with a Manzer, an Olson, or a Petros--or an electric guitar that ranks with a D'Angelico he can call himself a luthier. Anybody can assemble a guitar from pre-soldered, pre-cut and finished parts.

 

[Justsomeguy]

My nephew "learned" to play by tabs. He can't read a note of music and has no clue about other elements of music such as rhythm, harmony, counterpoint, or composition theory--yet somehow he managed to wrangle a music scholarship out of one of the local universities where he lives. The problem was he got cocky in his guitar class and started telling some of the other students the instructor didn't know what he was on about. That of course led to him flunking the class, losing his scholarship, and now he is a dropout.
Of course this is the same twit who thought he needed an SG to learn jazz on--when I told him for good jazz tone he needs a good hollowbody or semi-hollowbody. But of course I've only been playing and writing music for 40+ years so what do I know?
Now the twit thinks because he paid over $3,000 on e-bay to locate authentic period parts to build his own Frankenstrat [because he thinks EVH is the only guitarist worth listening to] that he has what it takes to become a luthier. I told him when he can build an acoustic guitar that ranks with a Manzer, an Olson, or a Petros--or an electric guitar that ranks with a D'Angelico he can call himself a luthier. Anybody can assemble a guitar from pre-soldered, pre-cut and finished parts.

Wow, there's a lot of venom their man! "Cocky young guitarist syndrome", or CYGS, happens all the time, but hopefully most people will learn from their mistakes and learn to take others advice, even if it takes a while. i have no problem with people who have learned from tab and then moved on and advance their playing but it's the ones who think they're the bee's knee's and won't accept comments, feedback, help, or advice that grind my gears.

 

[Kierkes]

That's all well and good, OP, and I'm not taking anything away from your argument. I just have this niggling feeling that your rant is directed at those who want the guitar to become their primary instrument (voice notwithstanding) and have never experienced music in a pedagogical light before.

Take me. While I do believe the overwhelming advice from the experienced that I need to learn the proper way, I am primarily a singer; I've done professional opera, some high school musical theater (after the professional opera! ), and I haven't gone a single day without thinking about music theory in some way for the past five years. I can pick out chord progressions, I can color chord progressions, and I can harmonize easily. Basically, I can do everything that a competent musician should be able to do. And I play the piano rather well.

I recognize that your point CANNOT be lost on me because I've owned a guitar for only a couple of weeks. I need to take the necessary steps to learn to play it properly. However, I bought it without any intention of it becoming a major instrument for me; I just want another dimension in my arrangements.

I'm not in any way arguing or contradicting anyone, but I'm sort of probing you guys here: Is this thread pleading musicality in general, or is there a specific point to guitarists in here?

Because if it's the latter, I'm right there with you waving my arms trying to get everyone to come to my side. There are so many people I know who are "guitarists and pianists" who aren't "musicians." And I'm not even limiting myself to classical theory here, I'm just really imploring musicianship here.

 

[CrowsofFritz]

That's all well and good, OP, and I'm not taking anything away from your argument. I just have this niggling feeling that your rant is directed at those who want the guitar to become their primary instrument (voice notwithstanding) and have never experienced music in a pedagogical light before.

Take me. While I do believe the overwhelming advice from the experienced that I need to learn the proper way, I am primarily a singer; I've done professional opera, some high school musical theater (after the professional opera! ), and I haven't gone a single day without thinking about music theory in some way for the past five years. I can pick out chord progressions, I can color chord progressions, and I can harmonize easily. Basically, I can do everything that a competent musician should be able to do. And I play the piano rather well.

I recognize that your point CANNOT be lost on me because I've owned a guitar for only a couple of weeks. I need to take the necessary steps to learn to play it properly. However, I bought it without any intention of it becoming a major instrument for me; I just want another dimension in my arrangements.

I'm not in any way arguing or contradicting anyone, but I'm sort of probing you guys here: Is this thread pleading musicality in general, or is there a specific point to guitarists in here?

Because if it's the latter, I'm right there with you waving my arms trying to get everyone to come to my side. There are so many people I know who are "guitarists and pianists" who aren't "musicians." And I'm not even limiting myself to classical theory here, I'm just really imploring musicianship here.

Yes. It's mainly pointed to guitarists and not musicians. Thank you for pointing that out!

 

[Kierkes]

You're welcome; I'd imagine most people have experienced quite profoundly the effect of the guitar becoming the "everyman's instrument."

 

[Lt. Bob]

And some of those tabs are just SO wrong! Usually prefaced by 'this is my first tab and I don't have a copy of the song so I'm doing it from memory'!

yep .... and just to be clear here ...... lots of sheet music is wrong too. Not as much as TABS but unless you buy orchestra level sheet music, you can't totally count on it either.

 

[Lt. Bob]

and let me say that I love young guitarists that learn by TABS and can't actually play without them to save their life.
At 60 years old, if the younger players were as good as they ought to be, then I'd not be working 7 gigs a week and couldn't pay my bills since music has always traditionally been a young mans game. Just being young gave you an 'in' without much regard of your actual skills. Older folks need not apply no matter how good they might be.
But so many younger players have been schooled on the 'net that i have absolutely no problem staying booked.
So what i meant to say earlier is ..... "Yes ...... TABS are all you need to know"!

 

[Greg_L]

I learned how to play guitar by ear when I was about 14 or 15. A friend of mine showed me a few chords and how to play a powerchord, and I was off and running. There were no tabs and there definitely wasn't any sheet music for the kind of stuff I listened to. Playing by ear was the only way. I'd pop on a record or tape and jam along to the whole album like I was in the freaking band. It also taught me good timing and rhythm. Mind you, I'm not really technically any better at playing now than I was back then, but my ears are trained pretty good. I learned pretty quickly how to pick out the bass line, or separate the guitars and listen to and learn the differences. To this day I think that has served me pretty well. I still don't ever look at tabs. Tabs are gay.

 

[Greg_L]

Oh, and my advice to budding guitarists - don't suck.

 

[brother rat]

I'd pop on a record or tape and jam along to the whole album like I was in the freaking band.

This.

By the time the internet was around and tabs were everywhere, I had no use for them. I could pick out songs by ear faster than I could learn the tab. Plus I started by playing bass, which gave me a good feel for the root of the songs. By the time I started playing guitar about ten years later, I could do pretty much what I wanted with most songs. I'm not a super talented musician by any stretch of the imagination, but I can sit in and jam with just about any band. Some of the younger kids I know who are learning their instruments can't jam at all. And it's because they've only learned from tabs. As much as I hate jam bands, I think jamming is a necessary skill for a musician.