1
1manband
New member
Can anyone tell me the pro and con of having an ADAT machine? Also, would someone tell me the same about this particuler machine? thanks
Wireneck
New member
It all really depends on your application and uses but I guess i can try and give you some Pros and Cons from my standpoint.
Pro- They are becoming relatively cheap to buy new and used due to people switching over to the HD24 and other DAWs.
Alot of professional studios still have them installed so you can bring your material back and forth between a home setup and a professional setup.
Cons- it is alot harder to edit on these without using some type of DAW. Opposed to pro tools or something of that nature.
The Xt is 16 bit you may want to think about that before you purchase. Unless you are looking at a Xt20 which is 20 bit.
Pro- They are becoming relatively cheap to buy new and used due to people switching over to the HD24 and other DAWs.
Alot of professional studios still have them installed so you can bring your material back and forth between a home setup and a professional setup.
Cons- it is alot harder to edit on these without using some type of DAW. Opposed to pro tools or something of that nature.
The Xt is 16 bit you may want to think about that before you purchase. Unless you are looking at a Xt20 which is 20 bit.
1
1manband
New member
unfortunatly i allready bought it, i knew i would use it just to record on, i will run the tracks to computer for mix and burn, i knew they were 16 bit and since i do this just for fun mainly, that didnt bother me, i was more interested to see if they are very touchy? kinda moody ya know? i heard they can be delicate and break down alot. thank you for the reply wireneck. anything else you could tell me about using one would be greatly appreciated, like tips or tricks with them.
E
eh91311
recordist
Used ADATs are like any other type of gear. Some are reliable, some are problematic. Keep up on the maintenance (cleaning, belt and idler wheel replacement) and you should be fine. Make a habit of slamming in S-VHS tapes and smoking 3 packs a day in the studio and your ADAT will have problems for sure.
MISTERQCUE
Not Just Anutha Brutha
Wireneck said:
Both LX's and XT's are both 20 bits! The older BlackFace models are 16 bits!
F
foreverain4
New member
MISTERQCUE said:
no, there was the xt that came out before the xt20. the xt is only 16 bit and the xt20 is 20bit. i have one of both machines. but, you can record 24 bit on the xt20 with external converters. you only get 6 tracks though as it puts the extra bits on tracks 7 and 8.
so, it goes, blackface, xt, xt20 and lx20
i have found my machines very reliable and they are probably one of the most stable formatts in the industry. i have the hd24 but plan on keeping my adats around for a while.
tjohnston
New member
I have the xt 20 I hate the way it makes the treble strings on my guitar sound. I love the idea of big clumsy buttons for me to press. Its easy... press what track you want and then press record.
MISTERQCUE
Not Just Anutha Brutha
foreverain4 said:
Good catch Wireneck as you are correct! I wrongly assumed U were referring to the XT20.
I too switched from ADAT's to the HD24 having prev'ly owned 2 XT 20's and 2 LX20's. I eventually sold off 1 of each to finance my purchase of the HD but prior, I was HOOKED on ADAT's!!!
I treated my ADAT's as if they were my own children with the utmost care and they have served me well! Not one ever gave me a prob. ADAT's are finicky machines. With proper maintenance
and care, they will provide the user exceptional performance.
ChuckU
New member
I'm considering buying an ADAT thinking it's a good way to do a quick and dirty demo, then fly the tracks into Sonar either analog thru my Delta 1010s or get the lightpipe add-on for the Delta.
I have a guy that wants to get rid of an ADAT. He owes me for some studio time. I don't know what model he has and I don't know what I should offer. Any ideas?
I have a guy that wants to get rid of an ADAT. He owes me for some studio time. I don't know what model he has and I don't know what I should offer. Any ideas?
MISTERQCUE
Not Just Anutha Brutha
ChuckU said:
Wassup Chuck!
1st determine what model homeboy is selling. Preferably, it would be better if it's an XT or LX (20-bit/ 44.1 & 48 rts) making sure you check the units head-hours( press "locate" & "stop".)While the XT has a few more features than the LX( (better converters, 10-locate points to the LX's 5, etc), both provide more than adequate performance. Indeed there are some concerns in buying a used ADAT foremost being it's tape-heads. If the unit has been maintained properly over time, than basically you should have no probs during operation with it!
I now use my ADATS for archival, occasional 2-track mixdowns and speed-tracking throwdowns.
ADAT's def'ly come in handy when you wanna' do some quick-tracking on the fly.
ChuckU
New member
Thanks for the info, my fellow Stankee-hater!! I'll probably see him tomorrow night and get the skinny.
Cyrokk
Farce of Nature
I use my adat for two primary purposes:
1) I record vocals in a walk-in closet on the other side of my bedroom studio. The adat is extremely easy to set up. The unit itself is very quiet and can be placed just outside the door of the closet with no noise and no hassle.
2) Outside of recording vocals and possibly archiving, I use the lightpipe so that I can cut all other tracks straight to the pc using the adat as an A/D converter. The analog outs work in conjunction with the lightpipe allowing for monitor mixing. Since this requires no tape, less stress on the heads means less maintenance at larger intervals.
There are a lot of other options with using adat with a pc. With the right soundcard, you can also sync up the 8 tracks with the pc for additional tracks, sub or aux mixes.
Cy
1) I record vocals in a walk-in closet on the other side of my bedroom studio. The adat is extremely easy to set up. The unit itself is very quiet and can be placed just outside the door of the closet with no noise and no hassle.
2) Outside of recording vocals and possibly archiving, I use the lightpipe so that I can cut all other tracks straight to the pc using the adat as an A/D converter. The analog outs work in conjunction with the lightpipe allowing for monitor mixing. Since this requires no tape, less stress on the heads means less maintenance at larger intervals.
There are a lot of other options with using adat with a pc. With the right soundcard, you can also sync up the 8 tracks with the pc for additional tracks, sub or aux mixes.
Cy
A
aarowsmith
New member
maybe you too can still use adats???
Another use for tape based adat machines is a quick set up for drum recording a drum kit at a friends house or studio also using a small 8 track mixer in a small rack suitcase with 6 mics/headphones for portable 8 track recording and playback. You can record 6 tracks while listening to the 2 track stereo mix reference track on tracks 7 and 8, for example.
Or if you don't have a Grand Piano but your friend does and or Uncle? So then you can bring your adat suitcase over and you can quickly record some stereo tracks with your 8 track adat tape machine. And still have some tracks for your guitar or whatever.
If you run out of tracks you can use your mixer to bounce 6 tracks down to a stereo mix on tracks 7 and 8, and or just buy another adat machine for 16 tracks total. And or You can make a mono scratch track on a new tape and then you have 7 more tracks for recording all in sync with your first tape.
After all your recording sessions, you can then dump it all down digitally into your DAW computer using your adat optical input on your sound card, and of course edit all your 8 tracks to oblivion if you want ?!? So many uses and so little time........sigh'
Adat is affordable now! And yes it still sounds great! And especially if you already own and have a portable 8 track mixer and mics. You then have a Live 8 XLR mic recording rig for cheap! Depending on your mixer, so you can record live with 8 tracks uncompressed! Try that with the expensive little plastic recorders on the market today?!? Or try a 8 mic Live recording with your Laptop computer, it would be next to impossible without latency problems!
And like one musician said, you can use adat for getting quick ideas down and making demo's easy and quick. And if you look around you can buy SVHS tapes still cheap.......not to mention you can put to use the descent adat a/d and d/a converters for your busy studio for extra inputs/outputs.
You see, People you too can still use adat machines in this throw away society', and if you still listen to CD's then you will like adat, because it does sound better than CD quality! So if this is good enough for your ears, then well get one already and use it!
Another use for tape based adat machines is a quick set up for drum recording a drum kit at a friends house or studio also using a small 8 track mixer in a small rack suitcase with 6 mics/headphones for portable 8 track recording and playback. You can record 6 tracks while listening to the 2 track stereo mix reference track on tracks 7 and 8, for example.Or if you don't have a Grand Piano but your friend does and or Uncle? So then you can bring your adat suitcase over and you can quickly record some stereo tracks with your 8 track adat tape machine. And still have some tracks for your guitar or whatever.
If you run out of tracks you can use your mixer to bounce 6 tracks down to a stereo mix on tracks 7 and 8, and or just buy another adat machine for 16 tracks total. And or You can make a mono scratch track on a new tape and then you have 7 more tracks for recording all in sync with your first tape.
After all your recording sessions, you can then dump it all down digitally into your DAW computer using your adat optical input on your sound card, and of course edit all your 8 tracks to oblivion if you want ?!? So many uses and so little time........sigh'
Adat is affordable now! And yes it still sounds great! And especially if you already own and have a portable 8 track mixer and mics. You then have a Live 8 XLR mic recording rig for cheap! Depending on your mixer, so you can record live with 8 tracks uncompressed! Try that with the expensive little plastic recorders on the market today?!? Or try a 8 mic Live recording with your Laptop computer, it would be next to impossible without latency problems!
And like one musician said, you can use adat for getting quick ideas down and making demo's easy and quick. And if you look around you can buy SVHS tapes still cheap.......not to mention you can put to use the descent adat a/d and d/a converters for your busy studio for extra inputs/outputs.
You see, People you too can still use adat machines in this throw away society', and if you still listen to CD's then you will like adat, because it does sound better than CD quality! So if this is good enough for your ears, then well get one already and use it!
Last edited:
A
aarowsmith
New member
Also some complain about not having 24 bit audio quality in tape based ADAT's ?
Yes it is partially true, but the SVHS ADAT machines can still record 24 bit recordings using a 24 bit A/D converter like the Behringer ADA8000. It comes with good mic preamps and A/D converters and has ADAT lightpipe connection for your computer sound card or ADAT machines.
If you use the ADA8000 to record into your ADAT XT20 for example, you can get very close to 24 bit audio quality, because only the last actual 3 bits are dropped off on a 24 bit recording. Which is very close in sound quality to 24 bit A/D and D/A converters. Some musicians say they can hear the difference, but on CD recordings you will not really hear the difference, maybe DVD audio, probably maybe.
Also 20 and 24 bit audio signal to noise ratios are much higher than 16 bit. So therefore, sampling at higher rates than 48 k will not increase your signal to noise ratio. Your higher sampling rates will sound a tad bit smoother in the high end, but at a higher cost to storage space and computing cycles/latency.
Your computer latency issues become very apparent at 96 k sampling rates, and especially the higher you go. When you process effects on your digital sound files your computer will slow down at higher sampling rates. So when down sampling for CD audio transfer, you are better off staying at 44 k , 48 k and or 88 k max sampling rates.
ADAT XT20 and LX machines still sound very good today, they are dirt cheap compared to the expensive plastic 8 track SD media recording machines that they have had for years now.
And ADAT tape machines have allot more professional quality +4 db and -10 db level INS/OUTS connectors that can be used all at once in real time for mixing and recording live 8 tracks at once. Get another ADAT machine for 16 tracks at once recording and playback and for bouncing tracks, for safety tape backups and also for 2 track stereo mastering.
And the ADAT A/D and D/A converters are still better than the 16 bit little plastic SD media recorders, and even some of the hard drive portable recorders that record in compressed 16 bit formats. Use ADAT instead, and even the old "blackface" converters sound better than the new little 16 bit plastic recording devices, trust me.
But are they more reliable ? Like everyone says, if you do proper maintenance on ADAT's, then they can run solid for years to come. Most used ADAT's have allot of life left in them, some can go as high as 6,000 head hours and most used machines have only 500 head hours on them or less !!! Especially the old "blackface" ADAT 16 bit machines seem to be a little more durable and long lasting with much fewer repairs.
I have recorded from a 24 bit A/D converter into a ADAT lightpipe of a "blackface" ADAT machine, and it actually sounded better than its own A/D converters even though it was recorded onto its own digital SVHS tape. So when I played it back through its D/A converters, it sounded very close to the original 24 bit recording. So even though the "blackface" is only 16 bit, the playback sounded even better than its own A/D converters because I used a 24 bit lightpipe A/D converter to record digitally into the 16 bit "blackface" ADAT machine .
But "Blackface" ADAT machines still using it's own A/D converters to record with still sound better than most CD players and DAT machines, so if your thinking 16 bit A/D sounds aweful, well give it a try and hear it for yourself. The 16 bit ADAT recordings have a nice almost analog warmth to the recordings. And I have heard other sound engineers say the same thing. I have heard allot of good sounding albums on "blackface" ADAT machines.
I remember allot of Jazz and rock GRP recordings that were made on the old 16 bit ADAT machines, and they sounded great !!!
I am super suprised at my old 16 bit ADAT tapes that bands use to record on, and yes they still playback perfectly today, and sound better than 90% of the CD Masters I have heard.
Everything made today is Pro Tools, and then Mastered with full Compression and Limiting, using a computer or hardware. And it sounds god aweful mostly !!!
Some newer albums in the past 13 years or so have hardly any real dynamic sound quality to them, and some recordings even distort the A/D converters on CD players and computers because the digital levels are compressed and limited way too high and beyond digital 0 db level !!! I am not saying all album masters, but allot are this way and you can clearly hear it.
So yes you can get better sound quality than Pro Tools using even the old 16 and 20 bit ADAT equipment, if you know what you are doing in the recording and especially the mastering stages.
Just listen to your older CD albums 14 years or older, they have better dynamics and better sound quality than most of the new Pro Tools 24 bit loud compressed to hell and beyond digital distortion they are mastering today.
Absolutely retarded on behalf of all record companies CEO's that they think they will profit from the "volume wars" and sacrifice good sound quality ! And too not benefiting their own customers who actually pay their rent' !!!
Because mastering engineers are paid extra now to slam and fully compress and limit to hell the digital volume levels, to absolute maximum, and beyond, causing total crap loud volume and digital distortion with no real dynamics. And so yes the sound quality suffers greatly because of it.
Not to mention most people buying MP3's in a compressed crappy sounding format online, why not buy the actual CD instead, why not ? Because it actually sounds better !!! That's why........
Some of the mastering sound engineers, just to keep their Jobs have to listen to their retarded CEO's complaining that the volume levels on the Masters just aren't loud enough, absolutely Going against every good audio Law these mastering engineers were once taught ?!?
I am hearing some really compressed and really loud distorted and hardly any dynamics crappy sounding masters all in 24 bit glorious distortion for the past 13 years !!! And Yes I am
totally pissed off because I have to hear these so called "24 bit mastered" god aweful sounding albums. Thank you record companies, is this why you are losing money ?!? I really think so'.
Sorry for the long rant....... I think I need a drink now and listen to my old ADAT recordings......
Yes it is partially true, but the SVHS ADAT machines can still record 24 bit recordings using a 24 bit A/D converter like the Behringer ADA8000. It comes with good mic preamps and A/D converters and has ADAT lightpipe connection for your computer sound card or ADAT machines.
If you use the ADA8000 to record into your ADAT XT20 for example, you can get very close to 24 bit audio quality, because only the last actual 3 bits are dropped off on a 24 bit recording. Which is very close in sound quality to 24 bit A/D and D/A converters. Some musicians say they can hear the difference, but on CD recordings you will not really hear the difference, maybe DVD audio, probably maybe.
Also 20 and 24 bit audio signal to noise ratios are much higher than 16 bit. So therefore, sampling at higher rates than 48 k will not increase your signal to noise ratio. Your higher sampling rates will sound a tad bit smoother in the high end, but at a higher cost to storage space and computing cycles/latency.
Your computer latency issues become very apparent at 96 k sampling rates, and especially the higher you go. When you process effects on your digital sound files your computer will slow down at higher sampling rates. So when down sampling for CD audio transfer, you are better off staying at 44 k , 48 k and or 88 k max sampling rates.
ADAT XT20 and LX machines still sound very good today, they are dirt cheap compared to the expensive plastic 8 track SD media recording machines that they have had for years now.
And ADAT tape machines have allot more professional quality +4 db and -10 db level INS/OUTS connectors that can be used all at once in real time for mixing and recording live 8 tracks at once. Get another ADAT machine for 16 tracks at once recording and playback and for bouncing tracks, for safety tape backups and also for 2 track stereo mastering.
And the ADAT A/D and D/A converters are still better than the 16 bit little plastic SD media recorders, and even some of the hard drive portable recorders that record in compressed 16 bit formats. Use ADAT instead, and even the old "blackface" converters sound better than the new little 16 bit plastic recording devices, trust me.
But are they more reliable ? Like everyone says, if you do proper maintenance on ADAT's, then they can run solid for years to come. Most used ADAT's have allot of life left in them, some can go as high as 6,000 head hours and most used machines have only 500 head hours on them or less !!! Especially the old "blackface" ADAT 16 bit machines seem to be a little more durable and long lasting with much fewer repairs.
I have recorded from a 24 bit A/D converter into a ADAT lightpipe of a "blackface" ADAT machine, and it actually sounded better than its own A/D converters even though it was recorded onto its own digital SVHS tape. So when I played it back through its D/A converters, it sounded very close to the original 24 bit recording. So even though the "blackface" is only 16 bit, the playback sounded even better than its own A/D converters because I used a 24 bit lightpipe A/D converter to record digitally into the 16 bit "blackface" ADAT machine .
But "Blackface" ADAT machines still using it's own A/D converters to record with still sound better than most CD players and DAT machines, so if your thinking 16 bit A/D sounds aweful, well give it a try and hear it for yourself. The 16 bit ADAT recordings have a nice almost analog warmth to the recordings. And I have heard other sound engineers say the same thing. I have heard allot of good sounding albums on "blackface" ADAT machines.
I remember allot of Jazz and rock GRP recordings that were made on the old 16 bit ADAT machines, and they sounded great !!!
I am super suprised at my old 16 bit ADAT tapes that bands use to record on, and yes they still playback perfectly today, and sound better than 90% of the CD Masters I have heard.
Everything made today is Pro Tools, and then Mastered with full Compression and Limiting, using a computer or hardware. And it sounds god aweful mostly !!!
Some newer albums in the past 13 years or so have hardly any real dynamic sound quality to them, and some recordings even distort the A/D converters on CD players and computers because the digital levels are compressed and limited way too high and beyond digital 0 db level !!! I am not saying all album masters, but allot are this way and you can clearly hear it.
So yes you can get better sound quality than Pro Tools using even the old 16 and 20 bit ADAT equipment, if you know what you are doing in the recording and especially the mastering stages.
Just listen to your older CD albums 14 years or older, they have better dynamics and better sound quality than most of the new Pro Tools 24 bit loud compressed to hell and beyond digital distortion they are mastering today.
Absolutely retarded on behalf of all record companies CEO's that they think they will profit from the "volume wars" and sacrifice good sound quality ! And too not benefiting their own customers who actually pay their rent' !!!
Because mastering engineers are paid extra now to slam and fully compress and limit to hell the digital volume levels, to absolute maximum, and beyond, causing total crap loud volume and digital distortion with no real dynamics. And so yes the sound quality suffers greatly because of it.
Not to mention most people buying MP3's in a compressed crappy sounding format online, why not buy the actual CD instead, why not ? Because it actually sounds better !!! That's why........
Some of the mastering sound engineers, just to keep their Jobs have to listen to their retarded CEO's complaining that the volume levels on the Masters just aren't loud enough, absolutely Going against every good audio Law these mastering engineers were once taught ?!?
I am hearing some really compressed and really loud distorted and hardly any dynamics crappy sounding masters all in 24 bit glorious distortion for the past 13 years !!! And Yes I am
totally pissed off because I have to hear these so called "24 bit mastered" god aweful sounding albums. Thank you record companies, is this why you are losing money ?!? I really think so'.Sorry for the long rant....... I think I need a drink now and listen to my old ADAT recordings......
Last edited: