80's Orig no verse chorus format 2GOOD2B

[LazerBeakShiek]

This session experiment uses no actual hardware other than the Apollo USB. The Presets are from the Unison models that came with it. They sound excellent, and to me the presets are effectively mixing. Is my hardware equipment holding me back? Am I supposed to trust the software?

I made up an Original 80's tune on the fly to demonstrate this. It uses no verse chorus format. Just a mix to mix.

Let me know if you think it sounds ok.

 

[rob aylestone]

I had to go to one of their videos to find out what it actually did. The magic words 'sweeten to taste', 'colours' and the dreaded 'musical' appeared, the all I heard was a tone change. They then did an A/B with all the processing in the demo removed then on again. I could do that with any compressor and some EQ.

On your recording I can't say what it did for you that your other recording system failed to do?

I certainly won't be adding one to what I have - a clever interface with plugins. Using it as a preamp and using your DAW which we know has loads of plugins, would be what? Not so good, or better?

Over the past ten years I have had 4 interfaces. My plugin collection gets moved from computer to computer - so my old tracks can be used (bar a few 16 bit ones) I'd worry that when the interface dies, all your old material can't be replicated, and I bet you still like the reverbs and compressors you have in the DAW.

The song is not bad, but I reckon your usual setup would have sounded exactly the same.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

It still sounds like an amateur in his bedroom.

I bet you still like the reverbs and compressors you have in the DAW.

Not particularly. I like a nice rushy spring reverb. Or delay. These vocals of mine were 'space cadet bad' so I used some sci-fi bouncy reverb. Know of a nice spring vst? Guitars are dry. Drums EZ stock. Presets. All of it. I don't trust myself.

The song is not bad, but I reckon your usual setup would have sounded exactly the same.

Its garbage haha . I plan to try and record the analog instruments to tape first. Then align them back into the DAW. Ill see how it goes and report back.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

Due to some technical problems I couldn't make the analog tracks on the 1/4". Next weekend.

I did redo the bass track, only using a SM58 and MD420 pair. I tried to mix just the bass against the drums and guitar. Trying some mic placement ideas. Probably go back to the reactive load. Not sure. I'm looking for a slap bass sound. Any slap bass sound.

Vocals out , too distracting. Words didnt make sense. It is just for mix practice..

Let me know if the final volume is good, and if it is in time.

 

[TalismanRich]

Most everything sounds pretty good, except the bass is somewhat boomy. It really shows up when it comes in at the beginning. When you get to the bridge part at 1:45, the bass disappears, then reappears with a vengence at 1:58.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

except the bass is somewhat boomy. It really shows up when ..

Yeah, you know I had a bunch a threads in the past with posts about boomy bass. Guess I never figured it out. When I use the microphones up against the cabinet, it had proximity bass going on.

I want to, remove the plastic side handle, and try lowering a microphone inside the cabinet. Not in front. But inside. So the Cabinet is its own iso box. Just an idea.

 

[charlescarpatio]

Yeah, you know I had a bunch a threads in the past with posts about boomy bass. Guess I never figured it out. When I use the microphones up against the cabinet, it had proximity bass going on.

I want to, remove the plastic side handle, and try lowering a microphone inside the cabinet. Not in front. But inside. So the Cabinet is its own iso box. Just an idea.

I am not a bass player and I remember everytime I would try to play with my fingers it would sound like that, you have to be good to record bass with your fingers, slaping then is another level above. If you are a guitar player you'll sound much better with a pick. There is a trick you can use to save this bass mix, put some eq. so you only hear the high frequences of the original slapping bass and replace the low frequencies that are boomy with either a pick bass or a bass vst.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

. If you are a guitar player you'll sound much better with a pick.

hahah get the fuck out a my thread.

 

[rob aylestone]

I had no problem with the bass in that section Rich mentioned - it plays a long note and I hear it? How odd.

I don;t know what Charlescarpatio means? If you play bass, you have a number of stock techniques, that you select to suit the song - so it will be your four fingers, plus the bottom side of your thumb, or a pluck with your thumb - as Brian Wilson always used, and that is a very dull 'duh'. You can use your thumb to whack the strings, and your first finger to pull the string out so is slaps, which is different from the guitarists pull off. You can for percussiveness use your fingernail as a pick on a down stroke, or use a pick. You can even mimic double bass by slapping the strings against the fretboard. They all sound different and you can record them all.

With lazer's music - have you tried a DI and not used a mic at all? That could give you another sound to play with?

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

So I picked my car up from the trasmission shop. It was fixed, drove it home. Pulled in the garage, and while I was exiting my car, my toe got caught on a wire hanging by the gas pedal. Swinging my leg out the car I ripped the wire out of four places. The interior lights imedately shut off with the radio and a bunch of other accessories. Wow. I finally get the transmission fixed and now...

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

I had no problem with the bass in that section Rich mentioned - it plays a long note and I hear it? How odd.

I fight with it. Sometimes I think solo'd the tracks sound ok. If I try to mix them, there are holes in the mix. Flat tracks too. I am trying to record all the tracks from scratch myself. It is a challenge.

You can use your thumb to whack the strings, and your first finger to pull the string out so is slaps, which is different from the guitarists pull off. You can for percussiveness use your fingernail as a pick on a down stroke, or use a pick. You can even mimic double bass by slapping the strings against the fretboard. They all sound different and you can record them all.

I use my fingers. I do not pick the bass strings. Playing 40 years .

With lazer's music - have you tried a DI and not used a mic at all? That could give you another sound to play with?

DI into the Apollo and use the SVT Unison model? I could try that. I like the split crossovered ADA cabinets. I try to get the compression horn mic'd in the 2x10 to make the slap sound. It is not working as I planned.

 

[TalismanRich]

I had no problem with the bass in that section Rich mentioned - it plays a long note and I hear it? How odd.

I don;t know what Charlescarpatio means? If you play bass, you have a number of stock techniques, that you select to suit the song - so it will be your four fingers, plus the bottom side of your thumb, or a pluck with your thumb - as Brian Wilson always used, and that is a very dull 'duh'. You can use your thumb to whack the strings, and your first finger to pull the string out so is slaps, which is different from the guitarists pull off. You can for percussiveness use your fingernail as a pick on a down stroke, or use a pick. You can even mimic double bass by slapping the strings against the fretboard. They all sound different and you can record them all.

With lazer's music - have you tried a DI and not used a mic at all? That could give you another sound to play with?

Interesting that you don't hear what I do. I listened first on my little 5" speakers, and then when I went down to the 8" JBLs, it really showed up. It's like certain notes are accentuated. I doubt it's my speakers, two different sets in two different rooms, plus headphones. Very unlikely that they all have the same resonant frequency.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

It is dumpy sounding in the bass. Filtered 40-4000Hz. Taking that to 140-4000 doesn't help much. What's on the track is a bad recording. My next one will apply the Filter and EQ of the channel strip at the time when it is recorded. Right now, it is wide open to get the most dynamically in at the start. Then I tried to clean up with the EQ. Let me start with better at the beginning.

 

[rob aylestone]

What concerns me is that you seem to have to always use loads of eq. I rarely do, just small tweaks never big adjustments from flat.I tend to move mics first before thinking about eq. Often some tracks will be just as recorded. I’ve never eq’d a track before recording. If I needed to, I’d not even be pushing record in the hope I could fix it later.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

I am using no EQ or FX.

I filter with the EQ on 1 track. Trying to control the bass boom.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

I’d not even be pushing record in the ''''hope'''' I could fix it later.

Yes. I feel like this too.

This was a project done then. That time as the other. It uses no EQ or FX at all. The tracks are as they come preset. After they were recorded I slid the faders. Only slightly to blend. All the Apollo presets by the same guy seem to work together. Although this project was slightly out of time. It might sound better. Does it? Why would presets sound bad?

No vocal
no verse keys
no lead guitar

..to reduce the busy mix.

Tore Down

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

Here is the rough mix with the voices. Adding voices increases the difficulty like a mad man. I have no idea how to record voice, so its flat with some reverb. Tons of mistakes. probably should not share it yet. I need to nudge the voices so they line up in unison better. It sounds ok , for using no actual amplifiers or keys.

 

[rob aylestone]

I think the snag with the recordings isn't technical, but a general lack of tightness. You’re trying to fix musical issues with technology. The voices don’t align because each take is different and you’ll spend ages trying to fix it. I read a story about Freddie Mercury, where he had a real knack for being able to replicate his performance. On different takes. Others just mess up, like me, and need to do it again (and again, and again).

the other things you do sometimes are have multiple guitars playing cross rhythms. I don’t know the US terms, but dotted quavers/semi-quaver ‘dumpy-dumpty’ rhythms playing at the same time as triplets often happen when one guitar stumps down, up while another plays I think quick downstrokes. In this tune you also have that repeated guitar downward arpeggio that is continuous and seems cut and pasted so it becomes a metronome, the other things try to stick to and don’t. The result is a pile of tracks playing the same song, but because it’s just you, they’re all separate, not like a band would play. When you add tracks, are you playing every one to a click, or are you playing to the guitars, which are all playing to a different one? This is what makes it loose. I think the quality of each track is not a problem, just that as you overdub new versions to fix things, it gets looser and looser. I wonder if you’ve drifted into a way of recording that does some things well, but does other things less good? Maybe this has also happened in the distorted guitar tracks? Could this be what has clouded the blend of the others? Lots of thoughts, but this is very clean so we can hear it.

 

[LazerBeakShiek]

When you add tracks, are you playing every one to a click, or are you playing to the guitars, which are all playing to a different one?

I like to play two instruments at the same time. It locks you into a time signature.

This is what makes it loose. I think the quality of each track is not a problem, just that as you overdub new versions to fix things, it gets looser and looser. I wonder if you’ve drifted into a way of recording that does some things well, but does other things less good? Maybe this has also happened in the distorted guitar tracks? Could this be what has clouded the blend of the others? Lots of thoughts, but this is very clean so we can hear it.

Distorted tracks? I don't follow. Nothing is used fx wise.

 

[rob aylestone]

Sorry, in the previous songs with the distorted guitars that didn’t sit very well, could they have also had the cross rhythms and that helped filling the ‘holes’ giving that wash kind of style.