some drum setup questions - a survey, sort of

[antichef]

I've been asking my drummer friends these questions and watching live and videotaped drummers to the extent possible, and getting different answers:

1) is your bottom hihat level with the floor or not?

2) when fully open, what's the [nearest] distance between your top and bottom hihat?

3) what's the [nearest] distance between your bottom hihat and the top of your snare drum?

4) what's the distance between the top of your throne/stool/seat and the top of your snare drum?

I don't have many data points, but I'm seeing a trend that the harder hitting louder drummers tend to have the hats further apart from each other and further away from the snare.

Yes, I'm a drumnube, and in 6 months I may want to ask an entirely different set of questions, but if you're so inclined, I'd be interested to know your answers to these questions.

 

[NCdan]

1) not even close to level

2) probably 3-4 inches

3) I keep my hi hat as high as I can while still playing comfortably, so I'd say that there's probably around a foot of distance.

4) I really don't know the answer to this one, and since my drums are in another country right now I can't check that.

1 and 2 are largely personal preference, 4 is mostly determined by how tall you are and how deep your drums are, and 3 is just common sense (get the hi hat too close to the snare and you'll get too much bleeding). I like some serious jangle in my hi hat so it cuts through, and I like to have a lot of tonal options in between completely closed and open.

 

[Greg_L]

I've been asking my drummer friends these questions and watching live and videotaped drummers to the extent possible, and getting different answers:

1) is your bottom hihat level with the floor or not?

2) when fully open, what's the [nearest] distance between your top and bottom hihat?

3) what's the [nearest] distance between your bottom hihat and the top of your snare drum?

4) what's the distance between the top of your throne/stool/seat and the top of your snare drum?

I don't have many data points, but I'm seeing a trend that the harder hitting louder drummers tend to have the hats further apart from each other and further away from the snare.

Yes, I'm a drumnube, and in 6 months I may want to ask an entirely different set of questions, but if you're so inclined, I'd be interested to know your answers to these questions.

1) yes
2) about 1/4 inch
3) about 18 inches. I like my hats as high as they'll go.
4) I dunno. 6 inches maybe? I put my throne so my knee is roughly 90 degrees. I position the snare for easy rimshots.

 

[Andy666]

I think you should just set it up as you like it best.

Make sure you sit comfortably and your hat isn´t to far away so you have to reach for it.

Remember there are no rules. Just do it ;-)

 

[dintymoore]

1) is your bottom hihat level with the floor or not?
No, it's slightly slanted, that's what the tilter is for. I tilt it the minimum I can to get rid of the "air lock" sound.

2) when fully open, what's the [nearest] distance between your top and bottom hihat?
Around 2", maybe a bit more.

3) what's the [nearest] distance between your bottom hihat and the top of your snare drum?
About 3". But I have my snare at a radical slant - I play traditional left hand grip. The other side of my snare is about a foot lower than my bottom hihat cymbal.

4) what's the distance between the top of your throne/stool/seat and the top of your snare drum?
About an inch on the bass drum pedal side and 8" on the hihat side.

My snare is so slanted that my left knee can go underneath it. It's extremely comfortable.

I don't play loud all the time - I prefer to play all volumes! To me the highest level players are the ones that can play incredibly soft with the same intensity as when they play loud. Not many people can do that. Someone once said "anybody can cook loud", and while that's not really true I know what they meant.

I came into this as a Hendrix type drummer, but most people would call me a jazz drummer (I guess?). I really don't care about music of the past too much.

Growing up I went through all kinds of stages as far as how I setup. Think of it - if you play piano you can't change anything except the stool height. There's no left hand setup or 3/4 size for kids.

 

[RAMI]

1) yes

3) about 18 inches. I like my hats as high as they'll go.

Hey Greg, how high is your floor tom???

If you like your hi-hat as high as it go, and you say your hi-hat's level with your floor, that's a high-ass floor, no???

(unless I misunderstood the questions)

 

[Greg_L]

Hey Greg, how high is your floor tom???

If you like your hi-hat as high as it go, and you say your hi-hat's level with your floor, that's a high-ass floor, no???

(unless I misunderstood the questions)

Wait, what?

Level with the floor, as in level with the floor you stand on. Not floor as in floor tom. Some people keep their bottom hat tilted. I think that's what he's getting at.

To answer your question, my floor toms are about the same height as my snare give or take a twat hair.

 

[RAMI]

Wait, what?

Level with the floor, as in level with the floor you stand on. Not floor as in floor tom. Some people keep their bottom hat tilted. I think that's what he's getting at.

To answer your question, my floor toms are about the same height as my snare give or take a twat hair.

No, level with the floor tom. Ah, I see the confusion now. I took "level with the floor tom" to mean "the same height as the floor tom".

 

[Greg_L]

Here's a quick pic of my shit.

 

[antichef]

thanks everybody - yeah, I meant level with the floor you stand on with regard to #1 - reading it again, I can see the confusion. I'll start asking about toms when I can hit one without dropping a stick... Dintymoore, I didn't even consider the snare slant issue, which mucks up #3 some.

 

[SlowerHand]

@Greg_L: Hoe. Lee. Shit! I like to put my hi hat hat pretty high as well, but oh my Bob, how do you manage to put it so high AND so far left?!

 

[antichef]

so high AND so far left?!

Reminds me of my phone conversation with the drummer of my last band, who also has his hats about that far from the snare (and the hats themselves 3" apart) - he said one of the important drivers for his technique was to compete with asshole guitar players playing Marshalls real loud (who would that be?? ) and he needed to hit hard and loud, and so needed the distance for velocity build-up.

 

[Greg_L]

@Greg_L: Hoe. Lee. Shit! I like to put my hi hat hat pretty high as well, but oh my Bob, how do you manage to put it so high AND so far left?!

The angle of the pic exaggerates it a bit. They are as high as the stand will go, but they're not far left at all. If you look straight down from the top, the right edge of the hats are about even with the left edge of the snare.

I like em high though. I don't do any intricate hat stuff - ever - so I don't need or want them in the way of big huge snare whacks. Finesse and dynamics are not my thing. I'm full-bore, all the time.

 

[Supercreep]

3) about 18 inches. I like my hats as high as they'll go.

 

[Greg_L]

 

[SlowerHand]

He calls himself Supercreep for a reason. We might never understand his humor.

I'm not too big on hi-hat fiddling either. They should add dirt and texture to the rhythm for me, not subtle little rapidfire clicks.

 

[antichef]

Over the weekend at our local jazz festival, I've been lucky enough to be able to study a few different (and very talented) jazz drummers - we set up a kit, and they bring in their cymbals and sticks and set up (except for one local guy, who had his own kit) - as a rule, these guys are keeping things close together (less than 1" between hats, hats less that 1' from snare), substantiating my hypothesis. They're sure able to play loud when they want, though. The kits are sparse - like one rack and one floor tom, they pretty much have 1 crash, 1 ride, and the hats, and that's it.

We had a "master class" yesterday, and Jason Marsalis demonstrated how to play a bad drum solo (that is, boring, in his opinion), and how to make it better - jaw dropping chops (even during the "boring" part - actually more so in a way, because his point was that it was boring to emphasis technical prowess over musical appeal). I also noticed that his heels didn't touch the floor at all when they were on the pedals.

 

[dintymoore]

With the right technique, you should be able to have your wrist a couple of inches above your snare, and when you bend your wrist up, your forearm can stay down and the tip of your stick can actually touch your shoulder!

The volume you get is from how high you raise the stick before you hit. If you raise the stick 1/4" and then let it drop, it's a soft hit. If you raise your stick up to touching shoulder (full swing) and then hit, it will be super loud. Your arms are just to move around the set so your wrists can be in different places. The volume comes from how high your stick goes up before it goes down, not "how hard you hit".

"Draw the sound out of the drum, don't pound it in!" is an old saying.

With the right technique (man is this important!) the sticks will "play themselves" and you can play for 4 hours and it will be nothing.

... I also noticed that his heels didn't touch the floor at all when they were on the pedals.

There's heel up and heel down styles, both are fine. I'm heel up mostly, but I do both.

One of the biggest things that helped me with my kick was when a drum teacher told me something that really worked for me: Play with your heel up on the bass drum. Use the muscles right behind your toes. Rest the bass drum beater on the head when you're not using it! Important! So the beater sits against the head and when you want to hit, it comes back and and then hits, and stays against the head (lightly) when you're not using it. That helped my solidness big time. I just keep the beater there lightly, and if I'm not using my kick for a few moments my heel will come down and the beater will come back.

Do stuff like this at practice, but when you play in bands don't think about this shit at all! Just 100% think about the song.

I always try to be super loose when I play, but there is a tension in the forearms that needs to be there, those muscles are ready.

 

[Greg_L]

Over the weekend at our local jazz festival, I've been lucky enough to be able to study a few different (and very talented) jazz drummers - we set up a kit, and they bring in their cymbals and sticks and set up (except for one local guy, who had his own kit) - as a rule, these guys are keeping things close together (less than 1" between hats, hats less that 1' from snare), substantiating my hypothesis. They're sure able to play loud when they want, though. The kits are sparse - like one rack and one floor tom, they pretty much have 1 crash, 1 ride, and the hats, and that's it.

We had a "master class" yesterday, and Jason Marsalis demonstrated how to play a bad drum solo (that is, boring, in his opinion), and how to make it better - jaw dropping chops (even during the "boring" part - actually more so in a way, because his point was that it was boring to emphasis technical prowess over musical appeal). I also noticed that his heels didn't touch the floor at all when they were on the pedals.

Is that the kind of stuff you're wanting to play?

 

[Minion]

Everyone is different and sets up there drums different ....

I personally have my Hi hats as high as I can get them because I am 6 foot 5 and everything else is high ....

I probably have less than 1 cm of space between my top and bottom hi hat because I play all lot of double kick and play my hi hat slack a lot of the time ....

There are no hard and fast rules .....