Need two more channels, what should I get?

[Myriad_Rocker]

I'm doing my budget estimates for my new studio build and I want 24 total channels available to me. This is a full studio build and the clients I'm targeting are any band or musician that wants to record. Additionally, I may be hosting some clients from some labels out of Nashville or various indie labels.

Here's my pre list so far...I only have 22 channels here. I'd like some good versatility in my choices and I'm having a hard time picking my other two channels. Single channel units are fine, dual channel units are good, too. So, suggest away!

2 x API 3124+ (fairly colored; 8 total channels)
A Designs Pacifica (good amt of color; 2 channels)
True Systems Precision 8 (nice and clean; 8 channels)
Vintech 473 (pretty colored; 4 channels)

Also, if anyone wants to chime in why I should or should not have 24 total channels of pre available, feel free. I don't HAVE to have 24. It's just a good number I was shooting for since I'll have 24 inputs.

 

[antichef]

no suggestions (but are you looking at the API 3124+ or the 3124MB+? - I'm trying to decide if it makes a difference for a home recording person who doesn't do sound reinforcement and has an otherwise modest setup), but on the total number thing, I don't think there's a real reason to have 24, especially when it's a mixture like that. Back when I was a musician, we'd often talk about studios using the number of sliders on their desks (e.g., "it's a 24 track studio", or "that's a 64 track digital studio (oooh...)"), etc. - and the particular numbers which happened to correspond the different big console models started to sound familiar. Not that it really mattered, but it did imply X number of simultaneous tracks of the same channel strip, being built into the console and all - so by having the different types (which is a great idea, I think), you're already sort of deviating from that numbering scheme. So 22's fine (and if you have a DMP3 lying around, you can claim the 24 number..., right?)

 

[Myriad_Rocker]

no suggestions (but are you looking at the API 3124+ or the 3124MB+? - I'm trying to decide if it makes a difference for a home recording person who doesn't do sound reinforcement and has an otherwise modest setup), but on the total number thing, I don't think there's a real reason to have 24, especially when it's a mixture like that. Back when I was a musician, we'd often talk about studios using the number of sliders on their desks (e.g., "it's a 24 track studio", or "that's a 64 track digital studio (oooh...)"), etc. - and the particular numbers which happened to correspond the different big console models started to sound familiar. Not that it really mattered, but it did imply X number of simultaneous tracks of the same channel strip, being built into the console and all - so by having the different types (which is a great idea, I think), you're already sort of deviating from that numbering scheme. So 22's fine (and if you have a DMP3 lying around, you can claim the 24 number..., right?)

I actually replied to your thread that you posted but got an error. So I'm not sure if my post made it. For the money and the use I'll get out of the MB, it's not even on my radar. I just want the API channels and don't really care about the bussing and whatnot on it.

The main reason I'm looking at 24 is so I can fill up my inputs. I'm getting two Lynx Aurora 16's and to leave two empty seems a bit of a waste.
It's not that money isn't an object and I'm buying pre's just for the sake of buying pre's. Money is certainly an object and I REALLY REALLY want to score all of the stuff on my list (including the Barefoot monitors) used. But it's not likely. I just wanted to go in "fully loaded" so to speak.

As far as the 24 channels vs 64...I think that with the advent of routing and computer recording in general, the need for 64 inputs (!!!!!!) is a bit outdated. A lot of those channels were used up in bussing and stuff.

 

[tmix]

Are you going to do any mixing out of the box?
If you are you could use the last 2 for returns from your mixer .

You have an excellent mix of pres, you cover all the bases that I would be looking for.

 

[LeeRosario]

I'm doing my budget estimates for my new studio build and I want 24 total channels available to me. This is a full studio build and the clients I'm targeting are any band or musician that wants to record. Additionally, I may be hosting some clients from some labels out of Nashville or various indie labels.

Here's my pre list so far...I only have 22 channels here. I'd like some good versatility in my choices and I'm having a hard time picking my other two channels. Single channel units are fine, dual channel units are good, too. So, suggest away!

2 x API 3124+ (fairly colored; 8 total channels)
A Designs Pacifica (good amt of color; 2 channels)
True Systems Precision 8 (nice and clean; 8 channels)
Vintech 473 (pretty colored; 4 channels)

Also, if anyone wants to chime in why I should or should not have 24 total channels of pre available, feel free. I don't HAVE to have 24. It's just a good number I was shooting for since I'll have 24 inputs.

Looks like a pretty solid list so far. Are you making these selections as a competing studio/full time or just a side project thing? I ask because the preamp selection is a deciding factor for many types of genres and clients. That and what mics you have in your locker. I know studios that get business just because they own a Neumann U87 microphone (to give you an idea).

I would recommend cruising some commercial studio sites and look into thier equipment lists.

Having worked losely with a studio design firm here based out of Pompano Bay Florida (DAW Design), I learned about equipment selection as it applies to people who hunt for studios with certain types of gear. I was helping a friend design a studio up to spec and able to really hit a homerun.

The API and Vintech (Neve clones) seem fine to me. Two very popular choices in rock and pop genres. The A designs and pacifica I'm a little partial on. Very esoteric in some aspects. Here's a list of what I think could help you out:


-Focusrite ISA 220 (standard stock in many studios...components designed to Neve Spec)
-Focusrite Red 7 (I've seen it on alot of digital production like dance and Hiphop/RnB
-Avalon 737 pre (also pretty standard in vocal applications)
-Amek 9098I single channel pre (derived from the 9098i console designed by Neve)
-George Massenberg pres comes up alot in studio production (could in clean applications)
-SSL makes some good single channel units to look into, if you got the money
-Summit Audio turns up alot in studio production

I would try to be in the market for at least one good tube preamp.

I would also really look into any of the Portico series from Rupert Neve designs. Keeping up with the trend, you realize that the stuff happening here is the wave of the future in alot of studio applications. Vintage King is a good place to step up the game in terms of finding more specific industry gear.


Just some thoughts.

 

[Myriad_Rocker]

Are you going to do any mixing out of the box?
If you are you could use the last 2 for returns from your mixer .

You have an excellent mix of pres, you cover all the bases that I would be looking for.

No, all the mixing will be ITB. I won't have a console, so to speak. I'll be using a DAW controller. The Mixed Logic M24 to be exact.

Yeah, I was really looking to cover a good range of sounds on the pre's. Thanks.

Looks like a pretty solid list so far. Are you making these selections as a competing studio/full time or just a side project thing? I ask because the preamp selection is a deciding factor for many types of genres and clients. That and what mics you have in your locker. I know studios that get business just because they own a Neumann U87 microphone (to give you an idea).

I would recommend cruising some commercial studio sites and look into thier equipment lists.

Having worked losely with a studio design firm here based out of Pompano Bay Florida (DAW Design), I learned about equipment selection as it applies to people who hunt for studios with certain types of gear. I was helping a friend design a studio up to spec and able to really hit a homerun.

The API and Vintech (Neve clones) seem fine to me. Two very popular choices in rock and pop genres. The A designs and pacifica I'm a little partial on. Very esoteric in some aspects. Here's a list of what I think could help you out:


-Focusrite ISA 220 (standard stock in many studios...components designed to Neve Spec)
-Focusrite Red 7 (I've seen it on alot of digital production like dance and Hiphop/RnB
-Avalon 737 pre (also pretty standard in vocal applications)
-Amek 9098I single channel pre (derived from the 9098i console designed by Neve)


I would try to be in the market for at least one good tube preamp.

I would also really look into any of the Portico series from Rupert Neve designs. Keeping up with the trend, you realize that the stuff happening here is the wave of the future in alot of studio applications.


Just some thoughts.

Thanks for the informative post. I appreciate it.

I will, at first, being doing this part time until I build up a good list of clients. But my goal is to do it full time. I'm building a full blown studio. I just sold my house and I'm building a house with a separate building for a studio.

The genres I will be focusing on will be any and all things rock. From pop rock and country/rock to metal.

Here's my mic list that I'm considering.

Royer R-121
Josephson C42 Pair
Neumann U87ai
Shure SM57 x 4
Audix i5
Shure Beta 52
Sennheiser MD421 x 3
AKG C 414 B-XL II Pair

I already own the following:
Shure SM7b
Soundelux 151
Audix i5
Audix D6
Audix D2 x 2
Audix D4
AT 4033 (considering selling)
Rode NT5 (considering selling)
Casecade Fathead II (considering selling)

I don't hear much talk about Focusrite. I've been in studios that have them but they don't seem to get much praise that I've read or heard. The Avalon 737 seems to be on EVERYONE'S hate list. That's why it's not on my list.

Do I really need to consider the Portico with the Vintech on my list?

 

[LeeRosario]

I don't hear much talk about Focusrite. I've been in studios that have them but they don't seem to get much praise that I've read or heard. The Avalon 737 seems to be on EVERYONE'S hate list. That's why it's not on my list.

Do I really need to consider the Portico with the Vintech on my list?

No problem, it's my passion

The "standards" tend to go more into the nature of competing business when it comes to studios that are starting out, I've seen. I personally am not a big fan of focusrite stuff.

Some of the pres on my list are just like a standard boiler plate from where to start. Some designers are actually starting to implement the analog summing amps for these in the box setups. *If* you went down that route, SPL is amazing with this. In fact, I think a must have from SPL these days is their transient designer. Way solid drum sound possibilities.

In terms of the portico, it's kind of a double edge sword. Technically it's not something you HAVE to have, but it's coming up more and more. The options are a little more diverse than most pres. For example, thier Fidelice has 4 different flavors of analog silk modeling, which is ridiculous to me (in a good way). I haven't heard the Fidelice, but I don't doubt it'd be another great pre from Mr. Neve. I wouldn't know how it holds up to the test...yet .

It'd be great if you could do an in store pre amp and mic shoot out before you really had to throw all your financial savings into this. Hearing it would give you absolute confidence to what your buying.

The mic selection looks solid enough. Again, more of a personal taste thing, while still trying to be diverse for more applications. You may not even really need a full blown 24 channels and could even get away with something like 16 channels of quality front end.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

I don't hear much talk about Focusrite. I've been in studios that have them but they don't seem to get much praise that I've read or heard. The Avalon 737 seems to be on EVERYONE'S hate list. That's why it's not on my list.

In my small orbit of experience, the Avalon mainly gets trashed by white rockers who hate rap music and who have never even heard an Avalon, mostly because the Avalon seems to have become a favorite in the hip hop community. It's not rational, but it's there; take it however you wish.

Focusrite is one of those companies that you have to drill down to the individual gear because, unlike botuique-only brands, they make a wide range of preamp classes; some of them pretty good, others no better or worse than your average prosumer preamp.

With that in mind, and with my being in agreement that you've already got plenty of quality preamp/channel strip, I might suggest as a possibility adding a Focusrite Liquid Channel (or Liquid 4pre) to the mix just to give yourself a channel or more of chameleon-like sound adjustability. Think of it like adding a wildcard Joker to the deck .

You also have a pretty good mic list put together. A couple of options I'll throw in just to confuse things a bit more: perhaps drop one of the Sen421s and add a 441 in there; if the 421 is a BMW 3-series, the 441 is the 5-series big brother. A *great* all-around mic. It cost a little more than the 421, but you can balance that out by replacing the Royer with an AEA R84 or R92 and still getting a fantastic ribbon mic for almost any use.

Just some ideas to confuse you even more. I *wish* I had your problems .

G.

 

[Myriad_Rocker]

In my small orbit of experience, the Avalon mainly gets trashed by white rockers who hate rap music and who have never even heard an Avalon, mostly because the Avalon seems to have become a favorite in the hip hop community. It's not rational, but it's there; take it however you wish.

Focusrite is one of those companies that you have to drill down to the individual gear because, unlike botuique-only brands, they make a wide range of preamp classes; some of them pretty good, others no better or worse than your average prosumer preamp.

With that in mind, and with my being in agreement that you've already got plenty of quality preamp/channel strip, I might suggest as a possibility adding a Focusrite Liquid Channel (or Liquid 4pre) to the mix just to give yourself a channel or more of chameleon-like sound adjustability. Think of it like adding a wildcard Joker to the deck .

You also have a pretty good mic list put together. A couple of options I'll throw in just to confuse things a bit more: perhaps drop one of the Sen421s and add a 441 in there; if the 421 is a BMW 3-series, the 441 is the 5-series big brother. A *great* all-around mic. It cost a little more than the 421, but you can balance that out by replacing the Royer with an AEA R84 or R92 and still getting a fantastic ribbon mic for almost any use.

Just some ideas to confuse you even more. I *wish* I had your problems .

G.

I'm a white rocker who hates rap.

Nah, I've heard the Avalon in a local studio here. It's alright. It didn't make me go, "Hey, is that an Avalon?" I thought it was a fairly clean pre? No?

 

[Myriad_Rocker]

Well....I think I've taken the True Systems Precision 8 off of my list. After reading some more, I just don't think it's worth the change. I'm still really looking for 24 channels.

Now I'm looking for 10 more channels I suppose...ugh.