Typical track counts folks use in their DAWs....?

[miroslav]

I'm looking to upgrade my DAW software, Samplitude, since they just came out with version 11...though now they offer a basic Samplitude 11 and a Samplitude Pro 11.

So I looked at their differences and noticed that apart from some included guitar/amp sims, room sims and de-esser...they main differences are that the basic will only allow up to 16 consecutive plug-ins per any single Object, Track or Bus...but, you can have a million objects in any one track...so that's still a lot of plugs...where the Pro version gives you 64 consecutive plugs per...which to me seems like absurd anyone needed that many plugs on one Object/Track (but never mind that).
The only other major difference between Basic and Pro...is that Basic only gives you 128 track...while Pro give you 999.

Now...I know the ITB guys may need more plugs than someone like me who ultimately mixes OTB, and mainly edits ITB...so maybe they need(?) the 64 plugs/Object/Track/Bus....
...but how many actual tracks do people need to do a song...ITB or OTB???
I dunno...I rarely break the 30 track barrier...and that's including doubled tracks and whatnot.
I mean...999 tracks...for typical Rock/pop/Country/R&B music!?

Anyway, I'm not looking to comment on people's production approaches...I was just trying to decide if I really want/need to upgrade to the full Pro version which is more than double in price than the Basic version.
All other features are identical.
(For anyone interested in the new Samplitude: http://www.samplitude.com/uploads/SAMPLITUDE/pdf/Samplitude_Comparison.pdf)

Since I'm not a big plug-in user...the additional sims and whatnot, aren't a major draw...and I just can't see that I would need more than 128 tracks, but I was curious what other people were typically using...as one of these days, I may want to do some stuff all ITB...but even then, I think 16 plugs/Object or Track and 128 total tracks is more than enough for me.
I guess I can’t see the need to get the Pro version….am I missing something?

 

[darrin_h2000]

I have 24 availible tracks and havent exceeded them as of yet or bounced...and Ive added string sections...used 8 mics on drums...etc

 

[DrewPeterson7]

You're worried if 128 tracks will be enough?

Geez... Admittedly, I do instrumental rock, but even on something fairly heavily layered, I rarely break 40 tracks, and even then a couple of those last few tracks will just be for a few seconds or a chorus or two or whatnot. I suspect 128 will do just fine.

 

[Seafroggys]

Hmmm well I never came close to Cubase LE's 48 track limit for my album. I think a typical full instrumentation song would be:

4 drums
3 piano
3 acoustic guitar
2 lead guitar
1 rhythm guitar
3 vocals
2 bass
1 VST organ
1 VST synth

that's 20?

 

[darrin_h2000]

Once you get past the major players...what are you putting on all the additional tracks?...near 40 is quite a bit.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

Once you get past the major players...what are you putting on all the additional tracks?...near 40 is quite a bit.

I'm a layering nut. And again, I dont have to worry so much about vocals.

I'm demoing for an instrumental album ATM, but even then I usually separate my drum parts out into separate tracks for the kick, snare, hihats, and generally two separate crash symbol hits I move around as needed. So, for the base drum tracks I'm probably looking at 5 tracks. Additionally sometimes I'll toss in a second kick pattern or second snare pattern or something so call it 7.

Then, for rhythm guitars, distorted parts will be at least two tracks of electric. Depending on my mood when I'm tracking, I'll sometimes use more than one mic on the tracks, so let's say 4 tracks of electric guitar spanning two performances, for distorted passages. If there's a clean part (and often there is) I'll have a clean guitar track as well, sometimes two if there are interlocking parts or if for some reason the track works well with L-R clean guitar. On top of that, I do a lot with acoustic rhythm parts too, either two seperate takes or one take recorded with a stereo mic pair, each mic to its own track. That's 4 distortion, 2 clean, and 2 acoustic, for another 8 tracks.

Bass is just a single track of bass guitar.

Leads, usually I record the "melody" parts as one track, and the actual solo as another. Two tracks there. Sometimes I'll do some harmony parts, which usually means another two tracks. So we're up to 4 here. Additionally, since I improvise all of my solos, I'll often keep a couple different takes while tracking just in case something starts to bug me. So, while they may not make the final mix, it's not uncommon for me to have another three tracks of lead guitar out there but muted.

So, for the "fundamental" tracks, I'll generally have up to 7 for drums, another 8 for rhythm guitars, one for bass, and then maybe 7 for lead guitar. I'll go through maybe up to 23 tracks for a busy "main" performance. And that's with only two takes of rhythm guitar - most people do 4.

However, like I said, I'm a layering nut. I'm not as bad as I used to be, but there was a time when I seemed physically incapable of recording anything without a couple tracks' worth of Ebow harmony lines, slathered up in delay and mixed back somewhere. Depending on how heavy handed I get that could add anywhere from one to 8 additional tracks.

I also get off on guitar noise - I'll often intentionally go back and overdub little snippets of string noise or little chirp-y pick scrapes or the sound of the strings hanging loose and flopping against the polepeices after a pick dive, or the odd backwards note or two here and there, or maybe a bit of feedback. It won't be all over the place, but that sort of stuff plus some delay can add a nice ambience to a sparse piece.

Anyway, long story short, while I might use only 20-ish tracks on a "main" mix, if the song will support it I can easily burn through that many ambience tracks.

Yeah, I know, I'm sick. To be fair, I've also done demos with guitar, bass, and drums where I come in at fewer than 16, or even 10 if I don't bother to subdivide my drum loops.

 

[kcearl]

I dont think Ive got past 20 tracks either...the only time "lite" programs come into it is if they limit the amount of effects on each channel and even then there are ways around that limitation....

Ive used Samplitude 10 SE..nice program but do yourself a favour and give PreSonus Studio One Pro a wee look over..it has some pretty stand out features and is the new kid on the block

 

[RawDepth]

Depending on your computer, you'll likely run out of processing power long before you get to 128 tracks each with plugs running.

Besides, what is stopping you from bouncing a few tracks to a temporary sub-mix track, thus reducing the track count?

In response to processing power...I use Adobe Audition and it has a handy feature called "track freeze." It makes a temporary copy of any single track (onto the hard drive) with the track pluggins pre-calculated, just like a "save file" command would do. Only it is non-destructive. So, repeated playbacks do not require redundant calculations. Now I can pile track upon track with lower cpu usage.

 

[Chili]

... and who would use 16 plugs per track?? I rarely use more than 2!!

 

[miroslav]

You're worried if 128 tracks will be enough?

No...not at all. Like I mentioned, I rarely exceed 30 tracks.

I'm trying to understand the selling point of 999 tracks and 64 plugs per Object/Track.

That's why I asked what others typicaly use...I thought I've been missing something by keeping my track count low.

 

[Seafroggys]

... and who would use 16 plugs per track?? I rarely use more than 2!!

2 at the most, though for vocals its usually 3, maybe 4.

 

[darrin_h2000]

... and who would use 16 plugs per track?? I rarely use more than 2!!

Ive never used a plug in effect...but I have 2 racks full of vintage effects that I like to use instead.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

I'm trying to understand the selling point of 999 tracks and 64 plugs per Object/Track.

Other than the over-simplistic marketing tactic of "more is better", and the fact that in many ways the ability to add more track and object capacity is a relatively easy and cheap-to-implement programming task if you have the architecture for it...

There are musical genres that can require large track counts. Classical, orchestral and synth compositions can add up tracks very quickly. We had a guy here a couple of years ago who did some spectacular self-production with electric violin and orchestral samples who used (if I remember exactly) some 104 production tracks - not counting scratch tracks, alternate takes, etc. - for one composition. I think there were some 40 violin tracks stacked on top of each other at some points in the track. (He has since signed with Sony/BMG based upon the strength of that "home recording". )

I don't remember what editor he used (PT, maybe?), but Samplitude *is* a legacy favorite amongst the classical and orchestral crowd, so track count can be a real attraction for them. Maybe not 999 tracks, but as long as you're programming your software in triple digits, might as well go all the way.

As far as me, I don't think I've ever exceeded 30 or 40 at a time, and even then it was often only half of those that made the final mix. But then again, I haven't had the chance to engineer the Firebird Suite as performed by The New York Symphony...or Tomita, FTM

G.

 

[miroslav]

I can see orchestral or maybe techno/electronica getting high track counts...
...I was mainly talking about rock/pop/r&b/country.

Still I would think the "Basic" version with 128 tracks would be more than enough even for the esoteric bunch.

I'm probably going to go with the Basic version if I upgrade...the extras in the Pro version don't appear to have anything I'm in real need of.

 

[Dogbreath]

They talkin 128 virtual tracks? I dunno. Mines got 256 virtual tracks but I think I've only gone into the virtual track pool a couple dozen times in a decade.
I've rarely gone over actually using 24 tracks in a tune.
And I hardly ever bounce.

Except for....

 

[darrin_h2000]

Well if the program can do 1000 tracks and 16 plugs at once and be stable it should do 48 with a reasonable ammount of plugs without worry