what do you do when....

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eeb

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What do you do when you're recording a band and they're paid to date and ask for the "unmixed" copy and then post it on their myspace.


here's the lowdown

I'm recording a "hardcore" band.. just a bunch of kids.. first timers in the recording world.. it's kinda nice because no matter what I've done so far "sounds awesome" to them. We finished vocals last night (well the best we could considering they just kicked out their "vocalist" so the guitarist took a shot at screaming but that's another issue). After we were done the session they paid me up to date and asked if they could have a copy of the unmixed version until i mix it (i'm actually mixing it without them there for the most part because they're so green they don't evan have a clue what they want it to sound like as long as it's "good" and "loud" :( So i saw no harm in giving them a copy.. it's rough.. the vocal takes aren't cleaned up.. i haven't even touched a level on them yet so the volume is all over the place.. but i figured it was just for them.. until i see the track on their myspace...

It's their recording.. they're paid up to date so they can do what they want but it makes me look f*&^&in bad if ppl think this is all i can do. Would i be out of line to politely ask them to take it down? Good things come to those that wait right?
 
Yeah - I'd probably just explain the situation to them and have them take it down until it's mixed properly. Sounds like they are just young/clueless and don't understand that they are causing problems.
 
exactly.. good kids..

hehe it's kinda an ego boost when all you do is tweak a volume or bring up a plug in and they're like "whooooaaaahhh that' s amazing you're REALLY good at this aren't you" haha and someone saying that WITHOUT being sarcastic that is hahaha

I'll just ask them to take it down for a few days until i get a mix for them..

just wasn't sure if I was even in the right with doing so.. it's sorta a grey area because technically it belongs to them because they paid for it
 
hype up the mix that you're working on and then tell them that if they're happy enough with the rough mix to post it on their site, you might as well move on to the next band. :p
 
hahaha

that's a little bit evil.. I know how it is.. i remember the first time I recorded in a studio... i couldn't wait to show people... that's all it is.. but alot of their friends also play in bands and i have a great opportunity for getting more work and starting to get connected with the younger music scene which to me seems very very good.. so i want to make sure they sound really good (evan though they're really not so great but hey give em time I figure.)

The first time I recorded i had such a positive experience with that particular studio that i stuck with it for years and years (until i got into recording myself) I know many other bands that did the same thing and now he's booked solid all the time (in fact he's starting to refer bands to me)

so in a wierd way these kids are kinda critical to me and my new business.
 
if a band asks for a "rough mix" right after the session, i usually ask them for their email address and tell them i will send them mp3's in the morning. ;)
 
i just gave a band that i'm recording a rough mix to put up on their myspace. i feel its alright as long as they are paid up and make sure the songs say unmixed or rough mix next to them on the myspace player.
 
ya they did specify that it was "unmixed" but 80% of ppl listening (including young bands who have no recording experience) probably don't understand how big of an impact mixing has on a record... i'm just worried it will reflect poorly on me
 
do they mention you on their MySpace site? in other words...if I took a look at their site would I know who recorded/mixed their album?

I know how it feels...but don't worry so much. They seem happy with it so far and they're probably talking you up to everyone they know...they're just excited to get their song recorded and on their myspace site to show it off. Just finish the song and they'll replace the old one with it. Or if it's really that big of deal, have them put up a "disclaimer" or something.
 
eeb said:
What do you do when you're recording a band and they're paid to date and ask for the "unmixed" copy and then post it on their myspace.
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What I do is refer them to the written work order agreement we have that shows that a rough mix is not what they paid for and therefore is not what they are going to get. They can either wait for my work to be done like they originally agreed to, or they can pay me a little extra for what is essentailly a second mix, with the agreement that the rough mix is always ID'd as a pre-mix only.

I really wouldnt care about the extra money, I'd just use that as a discouragement to talk them out of being hasty. And in your case, they are apparently already way too hasty of a bunch to begin with in that they couldn't even wait to replace their lead vocalist before they hit the Big Red Button, and they really need someone to slow them down a bit for their (and ultimately your) own good.

G.
 
I've had the little bastards ask for a rough mix to listen to, and when I say "no - I have to actually mix this before I'm giving it to you", somebody will say "no you don't - I have that program, and all you have to do is hit "save-as wave file" and burn it to a disc!" Then they start acting like they know more about what I'm doing than I do.

I've had that argument more than once.
 
hahah yeah..

i really don't like the idea of giving unfinished work to anyone.. especially since i'm trying to build up my name/reputation. but I'm likely doing a mix tonight so it shouldn't be too bad
 
yea eeb, they sound like some excited kids and i don't see anything wrong with that. in the future it might be a good idea to give bands a few rough preview clips (not the full songs) on cd to hold them over until the final mix is done.
 
I just had a hardcore band pull this bullshit on me. They didn't even have lyrics, the vocalist just went in and screamed a bunch of non-words. I gave them a rough copy to let them listen to and 2 hours later it's on myspace with over a hundred plays from all their little high school friends listening. I called the guy that posted it and told him he had to take it down because it made me look bad. 10 minutes later it was down with an explanation that it was posted by mistake. Maybe you should just let them know that it hurts your business when they do that.
 
Hmmm. Interesting topic. I have gotten rough mixes from studios before. I never put it on my space or anything. I was always paid ahead so I figured it was my right. In my case it was something to think about before I came back into the studio the next day to continue mixing.

I guess myspace does throw a wrench in things. Sounds like SSG has got the idea. Handle it before it happens.

F.S.
 
Freudian Slip said:
I guess myspace does throw a wrench in things. Sounds like SSG has got the idea. Handle it before it happens.
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Yeah, just to clarify; I agree that in this case it's just kids and no big deal. Also, I have no problem with giving the client rough mixes as part of the process and package; it's done all the time by everybody - including me - for very legitimate reasons.

But until recently, one did not often have adolescents as clients in this business (well...at least not calendar-year-wise ;) :D.) Now with the movement of this business into homes and at lower rates, this seems to be happening more often. Combine that with the MySpace phenom like F.S. points out, and the new Internet paradigm of free-range-content, and things can get out of hand very quickly.

I think this is yet another reason bracing the importance of setting expectations in the form of an agreement on terms of service from the outset. This may be just shits and grins for the high school MySpace band, but it remans a business for the studio. Spell it out from the outset what they are agreeing to pay for and what exactly they get (and don't get) for it; including either only the private use of the rough mixes, or the need for a disclaimer along with any public performance of the rough mix.

The problem is, that brings up another sticky issue; the entering of a legal business agreement with a minor. I'm not sure just how legal or binding that is on either end of the bargain. Of course there is a pretty simple solution to all of this; don't accept clients under the age of 21 ;). Unfortunately accepting only legal age clients would probably put half the people on this board out of business... :o

G.
 
I personally wouldn't even ask for a rough mix, I'd want to wait until it's finished before taking it home and showing it to other people. It sounds like they were just excited about going to a real studio and recording there, though.

I'd tell them that you want to give your studio (and yourself) the best rep possible and ask politely if they can take it down until you give them a final mix.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
The problem is, that brings up another sticky issue; the entering of a legal business agreement with a minor. I'm not sure just how legal or binding that is on either end of the bargain. Of course there is a pretty simple solution to all of this; don't accept clients under the age of 21 ;). Unfortunately accepting only legal age clients would probably put half the people on this board out of business... :o

G.
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A legal agreement is also not valid unless it's with a competent party;) We're all screwed:D

I think just having an understanding before hand is a good start. Giving the band a little info about first impressions might not hurt either. If they are lost in the delusion that talent scouts for record companies are scrounging myspace for young talant, then convincing them that no one will come back to here the final mix if they are turned off by the rough mix might help:D

It's so strange to me that these days a band would pay for studio time and not get a cd pressed afterwards. Thinking about it though I bet it happens alot.

F.S.
 
Freudian Slip said:
A legal agreement is also not valid unless it's with a competent party;) We're all screwed:D
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Hahaha...if that's the case, our clients sure are screwed! :p

G.
 
They paid for it. It's theirs. They can do whatever the hell they want with it.

I suppose if you want to be an asshole and not give them a fucking rough mix of their work that they paid for ... then go ahead and be "that guy."

Everything sounds like crap on myspace anyway.

.
 
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