warning! noise ahead

  • Thread starter Thread starter travelin travis
  • Start date Start date
The lead has the parkinson shake to it.

Someone is awesomely beating those cymbals to death. :D


Good stuff for the soul Travis !! :) :cool:
 
did you move to seattle?

go. i have to admitt the guitar is kinda cool all amped up on the shrooms like you had it.
 
I really dig the drum sound on this...especially the snare.Cymbals may be a bit to prominet.Kinda a retro feel which is cool by me.Good solo near the end,I like this.
 
A Reel Person said:
It's raucus and raw as fuckin hell.

Raw and raucus is exactly what I was shooting for and I'm very happy that your ears heard it that way. :) Very happy! Thanks for listening and sharing your opinion Reel Person.

A Reel Person said:
I guess after listening several times and posting, I'm a bit more curious about production details. I'm quirky like that about recording.

I'll try to explain as best as I can but I really I just went with my ears on this one with zero regard toward any right or wrong way of doing things. The production was just as sloppy and raw as the music itself. :p Everything was done on the fly, including writing (out of frustration). A kid in the Guitar/Bass thread was going on about how amp modeling was complete shit so I attempted to show him that it could be used creatively. My attempt flew in under his radar. Oh well......win some, lose some. :p

Everything was software based which made experimenting pretty easy.

I started with the drums (a midi plugin) played on a midi keyboard. The drums were mixed for a big roomy sound. A guy that turned me on to The Flaming Lips got me interested in their drum sound. A compressor plugin was used to distress the drums.......high ratio, fast attack and release. I'm pretty bad on drums so the drum part was actually like 10 takes spliced together.

After getting the drums fairly close to being in time...........let me sidetrack for a minute. Playing drums on a keyboard is hard! :D Playing drums in time when you're not a drummer is even harder. I had to play along with a metronome for like 15 minutes before recording just to buff my timing a bit.

Anyway, I laid down the rhythm guitar next........you know the drill, pick a couple of chords and go with it. I used a amp modeling plugin and went for a fender blackface twin sound (I know that's completely rediculous). The plugin has some room ambience parameters that I tweaked for a roomy sound to go along with the drums. I added a tube screamer plugin (also rediculous) before the amp modeler to add a little more grit.

Next was the bass. I thumped the top two strings of my strat knockoff along with the drums for a pseudo bass line. I found out that when I cranked up the kick drum level, grooving with the drums was much easier. I'll have to remember that trick. The guitar was pitch shifted at -12 semi tones to sound like a bass. That introduced alot of funky artifacts like warbling sounds, clicks, etc. so I had to eq the living shit out of it. I ended up rolling off the lows at around 125-150 hz (cut boominess), notched at 250-300 hz (made the kick drum sound better), and made a big bump at around 2300 hz (let the bassline cut thru). It still sounded like shit but hey, it's not a real bass. Compression was added in an attempt to gel the kick and bass together (ha!).

The lead guitar was 100% experimentation and it was alot of fun. I started with the same settings as the rhythm guitar but cranked up the gain and the ambience (reverb) all the way. I wanted something washy and noisy but that was'nt quite working. I placed the tube screamer plugin after the amp and things got interesting (overdriven reverb) and fuzzy. That was sounding nice and raunchy but I wanted more noise. I added a univibe plugin (a pretty bad modeling attempt) between the amp modeler and tube screamer. I never found the sound I was looking for with the univibe but I settled on a really slow chorus that added some suttle swoosh and more noise. :D I recorded the track with this sound but added one more amp plugin at the end of the chain at mix time. The last modeler added more fuzz and scouped the mids. I think the key ingredient to this sound was adding the tube screamer after the reverb washed amp modeler. I'm sure that could be done by running a very roomy sounding guitar track thru a dirt box and recording the result.

Sorry to be so windy Reel Person. You showed a genuine interest and you seemed to get the idea that I was shooting for so I felt obligated to go into a little detail. Thanks for listening man. :)
 
true-eurt said:
Why don't we get this kind of stuff in my neighborhood? ;)

Because most people don't enjoy this type of thing, I think........ :D

true-eurt said:
The lead has the parkinson shake to it.

i like that description. thanks for listening true.

turtlishous said:
all amped up on the shrooms like you had it.

i like that description too. thanks turtilshous.


variaxman said:
I really dig the drum sound on this...especially the snare.Cymbals may be a bit to prominet.Kinda a retro feel which is cool by me.Good solo near the end,I like this.

the compressor settings really shaped the snare sound alot......just a little tweaking one way or the other makes a big difference. thanks for listening variaxman and i'm really glad you liked it.

Nicole_Rose said:
the mix isnt' great, but the tune is cool. :)

the mix is a complete joke! :D i'll be the first to tell you that my mixing skills are near non-existant. the thing that surprised me was that with all the noise going on, it did'nt seem to matter much. thanks for listening nicole.
 
I can dig the freak out vibe, but this joint needs a vocal, my brothers.
 
That's the second nicest thing anyone has ever said to me. Will you share a 3 way marriage with Nothingface and I and carry our 3 headed baby? Which version were you referring to Fancy?

LMFBO!!!
Hey I got a great idea! We could use your song as the soundtrack to this movie!
Well, that and a little wah-wah with laser sound effects! :D
 
Supercreep said:
I can dig the freak out vibe, but this joint needs a vocal, my brothers.

I'm open to any volunteers. :D I'll even rearrange to accommadate a vocal. Thanks for listening Supercreep. I'm glad you were infected with the freak out vibe too.

Nothingface said:
LMFBO!!!
Hey I got a great idea! We could use your song as the soundtrack to this movie!
Well, that and a little wah-wah with laser sound effects! :D

That would rock. ATTACK OF THE 3-HEADED BABY!

In 3-D of course. :D

Thanks for listening Nothingface.
 
Oh my god, those production details are amazing!

A) those plugin efx are ridiculous, alright;
B) you found the grit;
C) funky artifacts: check!;
D) pump the kick;
E) 12 semitone downshifts;
F) Crank it to "11";
G) Plugin, plugin, plugin, plugin;
H) Plugin some more;
And it's a wrap!

Damn, that was truly fascinating, and I now understand 100% why it sounded like it did. There's tons of distortion and oddities about the sound that's almost indescribable,... but with the way you piled it on, man, whew! No wonder. I was gonna say previously that it was rife with a sizzling digital distortion throughout (the bad kind), but I didn't wanna commit to that specific comment until I heard the details. I'll say it now, though. It sounds like every step of the way in the signal path was over processed, over driven, and over plugin-ized.

It was a lot of fun listening, though, and I mean that. My ears needed a good scouring. :eek: ;)

Thanx again! ;)
 
PS: I often refer to the digital distortion I hear as "hash",...

and it's friggin irritating as could be! I'd try to stay away from that type of distortion, if possible. It puts a sizzling haze over the whole mix. Plus, the plugins to achieve efx are not cuttin' it. IMO, there's so much you could do that would sould better with other line/mic techniques, but not.... that

Which isn't to say I'm trashing your song. Your song is good. Your recording is harsh, and not quite hitting on realism of what jam sessions actually sound like. There's an added compression that gets put on by all the stages of overdriven excess. Piling on of digital efx is not where it's at for me, and this is a prime example why. Amp sims and plugin efx are often lacking as a baseline, then so much more of the overall mix varies on technique. I think the amp sims do suck, and the plugins make things worse.

As an alternative,... for guitar I like to use one favorite distortion pedal line-in straight into the board (EQ'd on the monitors before ultimately going to phones),... mixed with a close-mic sound to achieve a live/overdriven sound. That's something that you can do any time. Then, there's the classic way of turning your amp up to volume and micing the amp/room. I'm committed to the idea that a close mic on the body of the electric guitar livens up any line-in sound for a much more realistic and pleasing tone to the guitar, (or good in any guitar mix),... that's in a whole other league of realism and tone than this cut.

You see, I think your entire process of recording rendered a loud, raucus, compressed & distorted recording that was like a "generation" away from itself, in sonic quality. Like a tape of a tape. Also, the hash distortion is rife over the whole mix. The drums, instead of going thud, or thump, or bump, or pow, go... boosh boosh. That drum tone is not good, btw. None of those "room" tones or sims are good. The tracks not only seem like each instrument's in a separate "room", but they're all sucky, distorted rooms.

I hardly ever have this much to say about a mix. Harsh, man. I like it, but as an artistic statement. I could do with a bit more punch, realism in tones and less hash.

Thanx for entertaining my comments, and for an entertaining little song. No doubt, the playing wails. For an experimental, raucus punk piece, this one rocks. :eek: ;)
 
PS: The part about working with the metronome is one of my favorite parts!

I'm sorry. I shouldn't write long posts!................ :eek: ;)
 
A Reel Person said:
I hardly ever have this much to say about a mix. Harsh, man. I like it, but as an artistic statement. I could do with a bit more punch, realism in tones and less hash.

I suppose the question then is: does the statement out weigh the want for better tone and and a cleaner production? Did the idea get across despite the digital harshness of it all? I'm completely with you on how trashy the plugins sound. But can a trashy, harsh sound be used creatively with a positive result? Was that the result? If I had the gear and space to do so, I would have strived for things like clarity, separation, and a nice sound stage. I also would have spent alot of "time" working to get those qualities in the recording. From previous experience, I know my inspiration would have been seriously dilluted by the time I got down to actually capturing the idea. Also, I have NEVER played like that thru a real amp (I think I broke my digital cherry right there).

I love real amps and real rooms and real drums more than I could ever put into words. There are'nt any authentic substitutes for any of it. On the other hand, I'm sure that you can agree that nothing in my twisted little song comes across as trying to sound realistic or organic. I started out with that intention but as usual, frustration (and reality) set in. Normally at that point, I would have put down my guitar and said, Fuck it, it ain't happening. This time I said, Fuck it. See what happens. Experiment. Find something.

To tell you the truth, I think I learned a valuable lesson here and I have to give credit to all those shitty sounding plugins. This is the first piece of music that I've posted here in a long time. Reason being, I rarely write much less finish anything. I normally just whine about not being able to get a specific tone or give myself some other bullshit excuse for not writing at all.

More than anything, I hope my frustration comes across in the first version. That's what I hear in it......and the fun of experimenting with no regard toward anything that's correct for the sake of being pleasant to another listener's ears..........like a kid with a crayon just having fun.

Reel, I originally thought that you heard what I heard. I guess that was an unrealistic assumption. I think you heard the fun in it but the frustration obviously did'nt make it to the other side. Maybe I did'nt make enough noise. :D Or maybe I'm defective. :p Thanks for taking the time and sharing your honest opinion Reel.
 
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I liked it, but sonically it has a lot of howling and sonic anomalies.

I think by reading your posts, that a lot of it was intentionally manipulated to be that way, and that's okay. As recordings go, it sounds a bit mashed together, howling in certain spots for certain reasons, and a veil of digital sizzle over the entirety of the mix.

Given that it has problems, I also think it works artistically,... so I hope that makes sense. The playing rocks. The recording...................harsh but still listenable in an adventurous sense. Not showcase sound quality, IMO, but it's still cool 'cause I like harsh sounding experimental stuff, too.

I'm still not sure I clearly understand your point in the post. Was it, 'these effects suck and I'll show you how much' (achieved),... or was it 'I'll make these canned effects sound as good as anything else you can offer' (not).

I think distortion is a double edged sword. Used up to a certain point & it's sonically enhancing as an effect. Used over that threshold and it becomes a detracting factor from the overal clarity and punch of the mix. Not to say that over-the-top-ness can't be used somewhat as an enhancing factor. This mix, by far,... is not the worse example of distortion I've ever heard, (Check Soundclick for The Doug Hill Band). ;) :eek:

I believe there is a way to develop the most over the top distortion with an external module that puts the distortion element onto the source signal. Then, the recording process can capture that distorted source signal with clarity, and that works.

(I think) Where it's starts to go wrong is when the recording process (or other internally manipulated factors in this case: plugins) are starting to distort themselves. Then, it's beyond an effect, it's an anomaly. You've gone from a pleasant distortion to an unpleasant sounding distortion.

My other point is that canned plugin efx such as this just don't sound real. Also, when you put different tracks into different "rooms", sometimes you can hear it & it throws a "disjointedness" into the sonic image. IMO, the tracks are not supposed to sound like they're all playing in different rooms, but instead should sound like they're playing in the same room. I have many examples of tracks recorded in the same room & what it sounds like.

Artistically and experimentally this song works, achieves the goal. I wanna emphasize that. It was intentionally harsh and over the top, and I get that,... I think! A real enjoyable listen! All music doesn't have to be tidy & squared away! There's room in this world for raucus noise to take the stage!

I wanna emphasize that this clip works artistically for me, and yes,... the sizzle and unpleasant efx are all part of the package, though it's over compressed, over distorted and over plugin-ized. I'm probably contradicting myself by now, so I'll leave it at that! :eek: :eek: ;)
 
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A Reel Person said:
I'm still not sure I clearly understand your point in the post. Was it, 'these effects suck and I'll show you how much' (achieved),... or was it 'I'll make these canned effects sound as good as anything else you can offer' (not).

My point was: this stuff is'nt real, don't treat it as such. I would'nt play thru a vox and expect a marshall. that would be rediculous and frustrating.
 
Also,...

a line-in guitar [pedal] mixed with a close-mic on the body of the guitar can do so much to enhance the clarity, which is a technique that's quiet in the room and done invariably on headphones, ('cause of the live mic in the room). I'm not necessarily talking about mic'ing up a Marshall stack on "11", either. I mic an amp very rarely, & get most of my other guitar/bass sounds with a line/mic technique and headphones. :eek: :eek: ;)
 
...

Okay, if you're saying 'these efx are a slice away from reality and I'm taking it several levels further from reality with a don't-care/fuck-it attitude', then yes, it works on that level. Very much so! I keep saying: Artistically this piece "works" for me! Bottom line: It's weird and wailing and I like it!:eek: ;)
 
A Reel Person said:
Bottom line: It's weird and wailing and I like it!:eek: ;)

That was my bottom line too Reel. Despite all the wrongs in the sound, the bottom line is the bottom line. :D
 
How you got there isn't as important as that you did get there.

You produced a piece that makes a statement. :eek: ;)
 
quote: How you got there isn't as important as that you did get there.

Yep, I might have arrived with three heads and scoured ears, but I did get there. :D
 
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