$ to start a "pro" studio

  • Thread starter Thread starter wes480
  • Start date Start date
A few more things to factor in, cost wise:

- Insurance, utilities, downtime for maintenance, etc
- Hiring someone to help move stuff in/out/around
- Studio buildout costs
- Time spent reading everything available (and trying to work it into your system) about 'how to do this' is not paid time, but it is absolutely essential time. There are more sources of qualified, award winning information than most of us have time to read.
- A million dollar set of ears

(Many quality recordings have been made on 'lesser' gear when the engineer/producer knows what to do with their equipment, hi or medium end...superlative work can come out of the Diet ProTools or the stated 1604 and a couple of ADATs...try to get at least one of each LD condensor, SD condensor, quality dynamic...if you don't have at least one SM57 you will be arrested...)
 
VOXVENDOR said:
Alot of what keeps clients rolling in, is the fact that you might have many options....

Sure you can run out and get that Otari Radar24 thing.... But where do all the Analog fanatics in your city go....

Almost every "pro" studio, I can think of in the Toronto area has a few different choices of recording method.
Click to expand...

While it would be nice to be able to be all things to all people, plenty of studios make money by servicing a particular market niche.

One could theoretically concentrate on doing film or video soundtracks. Or maybe jingles. If you had tons of synths and sound modules, you could specialize in electronic muisc or maybe hip-hop. If you had a fabulous collection of acoustic guitars and mandolins, you could specialize in bluegrass. There's no end to the possibilities: you might have a really great piano, or a really kicking drum set, or a great collection of vintage guitar amps, or a B3, or a fabulous room with a high ceiling, or a 100's of exotic percussion instruments, etc. etc.

Any one of the above would be incentive for a specific type of musician doing a specific type of project to come to your studio. While it would be great to have ALL of those things, that's not realistic even for some of the biggest pro studios. The trick is to evaluate your strengths and focus your marketing to take advantage of them.

There will always be someone looking for something you can't provide. No sense worrying about that. If we all waited until we had saved up $200,000 to open a studio, there wouldn't be a whole lot of studios in this world. There are a lot worse ways to start out than buying an Otari Radar System. I wouldn't mind having one myself! It would be silly not to get it just because I couldn't afford to ALSO buy a 2" 24-track AND a Pro Tools HD rig at the same time, just to try and keep every theoretical client happy!

In the end, the clients only care about how good your product sounds. Make a couple of clients really happy, and they'll tell all their colleagues, as will the sidemen on the sessions. Pretty soon, lots of people will know about you. That's what keeps clients "rolling in". And practically no one will ask whether you got started with either $50,000 or $100,000 as a condition for hiring you!
 
Well, this is kind of a loaded thread isn't it?

First off you need to decide what kinda of studio you want to be withing your financial context. Most of the bigger facilities were built from smaller modest project type studios. At some point the client base and income allows you as a business to start upgrading to bigger things. Yeah, a project studio will cost you somewhere between $15,000 to $80,000. To get that kind of money next week probably isn't reasonable. Most of the big facilities are carrying significant loans on their consoles and recorders. It takes time, money and skill to make a successful recording business. Lot of studios go out of business everyday because of dreaming big and forgetting to open thier eyes to reality. Start with a plan, like a project studio in your home with at least 24 tracks of something relatively popular. Get some good mics for various applications, preamps etc...glean from this post some of the items and intruments. Don't bother with buying some stuff because you can't rent alot of things on a daily and you can transfer those costs to the customer. One tip I can give is to contact the closest rental place and tell them your an upstart project studio and will be renting stuff from them, they will provide you with a list of stuff they rent and the prices, this way you can build your hourly rate around paying for these rentals. I use to rent everything from drums, pre's, mic's, stands, compressors...you can even rent a 56 input console from some places. Cost and client management is key to moving forward. Remember that as soon as you start paying for things you can't afford on a regular basis, bankrupt is where youll end up.

SoMm
 
what is this $50, 000?

what is this $50, 000 figure that everyone is pulling out of the hat? It doesn't seem like you would even know how much a studio would cost unless you know what you want it to have and have researched the whole thing. Case in point, you wouldn't go to a builder and ask for a quote on a house unless you knew what you wanted. "Can I have a house built for $50,000?" "well what do you want in it?" " I don't know" --- "he looka like a man"(ms swan) sounds silly but that's what you are asking. On the other hand, if you already have things worked out, then don't ask for approval just do it. But if you really have $50,000 then why don't you start your own production company, sign acts, book studio time, and spend your money making records and promoting them. If you move units, you will get signed on with sony or universal etc; if not you wouldn't be totally broke. But chances are that you will end up in a$2,000,000 studio before you would on your own. Just remember it only takes $10,000 to open a subway.

just my $.02
 
50k sounds about right for a 35-50 $ an hour studio. Not counting buildout/accoustics

when someone asks me " whats the most expensive piece of gear in here ?" I say " the cabling"

I dont care how cheap your console or recorders ( or discs ), a WORKABLE, RELIABLE patchbay and cabling AND power grounding scheme is gonna cost bucks

I would assume at LEAST 5 96 point TT patch bays and their cabling, even if you make them yourself is gonna take up a LARGE chunk of change

24 tracks of even modestly pro tape machines or converters will take you well over 10 grand

assume at LEAST 10 channels of decent mic pres costing at least 1500 a piece and then a few more not so good mic pre's costing 500 - 800 a piece

at least 10 channels of decent compressors at 1200 or more a piece and some cheaper ones ( like the mighty mighty RNC ) around 300- 500 a piece

well we havent even gotten into mics yet, or fx...speakers? amps ? no problem getting to 50 k with even a 35-50 $ an hour setup

so when people bitch and moan about having to pay 35 bucks an hour, do the math...at that rate the studio will never break even, they are doing the customers a service by sacrificing their own quality of life....so SMACK EM
 
First of all i'd like to say this thread is great! Its a real eye opener to the possible pitfalls and high points of opening a project studio.

My one question lies in the most difficult part of the home project studio...the room...

Now i know a "good" room, is just a room that sounds good (go figure huh).

But besides recording in it and listening to how good the recordings sound, how can you tell what will be a good room?

what are some basic, textbook charictaristics of a good sounding room?
I figure that a small, square room with low ceilings is the defintion of a typical, dead sounding room (which of course i currently have, but its filled with crap), so what is a good sounding room?

high ceilings, lots of different angles on the walls, so the room isn't shaped like a square or rectangle... anything else? Im not talking about building a room with the sand under the floors, and all that fancy stuff, but just a basic shape of a room that would work well for a makeshift home studio. With foam on the walls of course!
 
ambi-
A small, box shaped room is anything but 'dead'. The reverberations and reflections in it aren't going to give you a classic reverb or delay type of sound, but they are going to apply some very obvious "room EQ" (actually, a bunch of early reflections with uneven frequency response) all over anything recorded through a microphone. Just slapping some kind of foam all over everything won't cure much. I think you'll get the best information by doing a search on "acoustics".
It's late & I don't recall the names of books off the top of my head. In really general terms, the more volume (cubic footage) & the less cube-shaped a room is, the better it will sound. Asymetrical is good, no parallel surfaces is good, a mix of reflective, absorptive and diffusive materials for floor, walls and cieling is good. There are some great resources for learning how to build bass traps, treat walls, etc. etc. - Ethan Weiner (sp.?) has some great articles on his website. BUT- If you're not good at math and physics, you may need the help of a professional to determine what the problems are with your room and what the options are to correct them.
Hope this steers you toward the right direction in your search. Good Luck!

Scott
 
pipelineaudio said:


I would assume at LEAST 5 96 point TT patch bays and their cabling, even if you make them yourself is gonna take up a LARGE chunk of change
Click to expand...

So far I've been almost entirely in agreement with Pipelines many posts recently, and I'd like to take the opportunity to welcome his insight to this board.

But 5 96pt tt's might be more than some would need. I have two now, and while not EVERYTHING in my studio goes through them, with one additional one I could accomplish that (right now my synths are still going through 1/4" bays). Meanwhile I still have a few spare points.

Now, clearly, I may not have as many outboard pieces as some, but I am a Pro studio - and it seems that one could easily get started with two or three tt bays.

As far as expense, I bought mine off e-bay with 50' of Belden cabling already soldered on every point for about $300 each from a Nashville studio.

Sorry if it seems like nitpicking!
 
its a minor point...I was just assumiong this configuration:

Patchbay 1 :
top row: mic lines from snakes
full normalled to
bottom row: mic preamp ins

Patchbay 2 :
top row: tape machine output
half normalled to
bottom row: Console tape return ( or line in or another patchbay to do both)

Patchbay 3 :
top row : channel insert send
half normalled to
bottom row : channel insert return

patchbay 4:
top row direct out/mic pre out
half normalled to
bottom row: tape machine input

patchbay 5:
facilities; aux send and return, mix outs, group outs, etc...migfht need a few bays for this

patchbay 6: outboard

might be overkill but you know :)

actually with 96 poijnt patchbays a 24 track studio would be well under this like you say, but leave room to grow

and again ,this is just my style of building...if you work in a different way you could get a way with a lot fewer...I see a lot of midi guys with tremendous power needing only to patch a few things...

how is yours set up ?

thanks for the welcome BTW :)
 
But if you really have $50,000 then why don't you start your own production company, sign acts, book studio time, and spend your money making records and promoting them. If you move units, you will get signed on with sony or universal etc;...
Click to expand...

Why would we want to start a production company when we want to record? If I had $50K+ I'd sink it into a studio. Hell, If I had an extra 10K I'd spend it on studio gear too.

Do you want to record or do you want to run a production company? Maybe you're in the wrong place.
 
you tell em sennheiser!!!!!

we are miswired retards, that cant get enough of recording...all the problems, all the sacrifices, and we keep coming back for more...

it is a bug, and once you are bitten it will eat all your time and money, but I wouldnt have it any o ther way!
 
this may sound like an extreme newbie question, but what the hell is a patchbay?
i have a rough understanding, but it doesn't really make a lot of sense to me.

Its a rack that has a punch of 1/4' inputs and outputs... and im guessing it doesn't change the signal at all.. and you plug stuff into it, and then out...
 
pipelineaudio said:


we are miswired retards,
Click to expand...

I think that Im going have to plagerize that remark for my wife the next time she asks me why I do it!

Im left handed musician who constantly tinkers around with finding new ways to do recording equipment junky, er I mean a miswired retard!

SoMm

Wecome to the club ;)
 
ambi said:
this may sound like an extreme newbie question, but what the hell is a patchbay?
i have a rough understanding, but it doesn't really make a lot of sense to me.

Its a rack that has a punch of 1/4' inputs and outputs... and im guessing it doesn't change the signal at all.. and you plug stuff into it, and then out...
Click to expand...

You're partly right - although it doesn't HAVE to have 1/4" holes. You can have XLR patchbays, midi patchbays, digital patchbays, and of course, TT patchbays which is the pro standard that uses much smaller holes.

The main advantage to patchbays is that you can keep your gear always wired up and ready to go - all the routing that you ever need to do (hopefully) can be accomplished just by plugging in a patch cable. This means you don't have to stop and crawl around behind your rack with a flashlight when you want to change the assignment of your vocal mic from tape track 2 to tape track 3. Or if you want to try the same mic with a different compressor. As you can imagine, the convenience factor is huge.

A bonus factor is that in a half-normalled configuration you can actually split (called "mult") a signal so that it can be assigned to two seperate destinations.

As you correctly note, the patch bay itself should not (hopefully) alter or degrade the signal.

In the end the necessity for a patchbay can only be decided by the individual. If you have one mic, a mixer with all the jacks on the top surface, minimal outboard processing or effects, etc. a patchbay may not be all that necessary. But if you find yourself crawling around behind a rack more than once in a while, you'll probably enjoy having one.
 
YES, ok good, it makes sense now. I never really sat down and tried to understand the logic of it. When i actually though about it it made sense.
thanks!
 
When you consider the investment of the building, the gear, and the equipment/instruments, you could EASILY be into an investment of well over $150,000, and thats for a studio that's.... well I wouldn't call it modest, but i wouldn't call it high end either.

My own investment to date is around $80,000 in equipment, gear and instruments, and I'm still lacking half a dozen nice pre's and a facility. So it seems to me that $150,000 studio set-up is a minimum investment.

You know what's really sad about this? For that $150,000 investment, you're going to be darn lucky to gross $60,000 a year. And that's not your first year either, that's after 2 - 3 years, and you become established.

The way I see it:
If you could book 100 hours of studio time a month, and an average billing rate of $45 - $50/hour, you'd gross $54,000 - $60,000/year.
Maybe by your 2nd or 3rd year you could raise your rates to $60/hr, but you'd still have to book 100 hours per month. I'm not sure how realistic booking 100 hrs per month is either. There's an average of about 173 hours per month (based on a 40 hour week)
Maybe you could do more or less hours per month, but on average, for your first few years, let's say that's what you did, you'd only net around $43,000/year.:(

This business is SO EXPENSIVE to run, for what you can charge for it, it seems difficult at best to make a decent living at it.

sigh.... it has to be a labor of love. :p
 
I think that the real point about all of this was made earlier, to my way of thinking Pro Studio is a facility that is self supporting and does not require some benifactor to shovel an endless supply of additional finance to keep it going. If we are talking major league recording studios then I would have thought that it has more to do with people than gear. If I think of it from the customer view point I would be more interested in the track record of the Engineer and producer and rely on their judgement to select a facility.
If we are talking self supporting studios I know of two in my area that have been succesful and self support. They have both done this in very different ways.
The first took over the rent on a vacated local radio station and utilised the infrastructure thereby getting a pre-built facility that covers most requirements. The main bulk of income from this facility is not bands but voice overs duplication and DJ mixes. This studio has a set of ADAT machines and some fairly good mics and outboard but nothing spectacular.
The second took over a practice studio and with a modest lottery grant set up a facility that teaches music and recording in the day and opens as a set of practice rooms in the evening. They no longer use their own recording studio but have retained elements of it to rent for people who have project studios to add live elements like drums and loud guitars.
The thing they both have in common is a clear idea of what they are about and an appreciation that musicians are generally poor and unreliable and have therefore survived by being diverse.
 
"to my way of thinking Pro Studio is a facility that is self supporting and does not require some benifactor to shovel an endless supply of additional finance to keep it going"

I am trying to think of any big music recording studios where this is the case...all I see have money being shoveled at them

How do you make a million dollars in the studio bizz?

start with 2 million

What do you call a studio that looses money ?

Front...or tax write off

What do you say when you studio MAKES money ?

:!@#$ our cover's blown, gotta do laundry elsewhere"
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top