THINK HARD - Artificial Double Tracking Question

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Darkhorse

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Does anybody know how to do Artificial Double Tracking(ADT)? I know the Beatles invented it some 35 years ago, so I would think in this day and age there would be some way to do it relatively easy. I have a tascam 488 8-track analog machine. Is there some way to record say a vocal on to track one, and then bounce that same track on to another track but some how change it (by slightly speeding it up or slow it down or something)? I have a processor that has some dual chorus option and a couple other things- but there is something about doing double tracking that has it's own distinct sound you can't get from a processor. Trying to match a voice or guitar well takes two much time and is sometimes hard to do.

Are there any creative people out there?

Any help is gud stuff!
 
Not sure about the 488, but the old 424 has RCA tape outs on the back. You could take a tape out and feed it back into another mixer channel. Of course, this doesn't solve the speed problem as you would be recording onto the same tape as the source. Any playback speed change would be recorded at that altered speed.

I'm not really familiar with the technique you're describing (at least not by that name). You could patch some effects between the tape out and mixer in, maybe a pitch corrector, but you said that effects don't cut it. Hmmm...If the 488 has the same feature as the old 424, you can at least experiment from there. Good luck!
 
I'm pretty sure I don't know what you're talking about, but the first things I thought when you mentioned changing the speed of the second track was pitch. I don't know about your recorder, but the 424III has a pitch control on it. You could bounce track one over with the pitch tweaked and then play both tracks back to see what the hell just happened. That sounds really interesting. I've never used that pitch control for anything...
 
If I was double tracking, I'd just record it again. It gives the best sound in my opinion. Effects can always fake it pretty good, but I like old-fashioned techniques.

Isaiah
 
If you were a bit more specific on what effect you actully want,
it would be easier.

I'm not familar with your specific tape but you should be able to bounce
(ping-pong) by using the bus assigns.
Set your channel inputs to tape so that you can use the fader to set the level, then with the bus assign, assign your track to the output bus you want, making sure that the output you want is patched to the inout of the tape track you want. Set the tape track to record and your set.
Doesn't your manuall explain how to do this ?.

To change the speed you'll need a vari-speed option on your tape.
If you have one i'll explain the technique if not then you'll need to use the effects you own.
 
hey, I don't really know what you are talking about. But, although double tracking by playing twice is a pain in the ass. A tight double panned hard stereo is the best there is. Just my suggestion.
 
i have the 424 mkIII...usually i track drums, bass and guitar to tracks one thru four, mix it to a cd-r, and then record it (with some compression of course) back to track four on my recorder. (i dont have to bounce to the cd-r, i know, but it sounds better than internal bounces). since track four is automaticaly routed to Channel four, i pan that close to hard left. Then I use the TAPE OUT for track four (which goes to my patch bay) thru some effects, usually a tad of chorus and a compressor, send that back to a free CHANNEL, and pan that one close to hard right. That is the easiest way to get a doubled track without even re-recording it..... i think the 488 has more than 8 channels, so you should be able to do this.....
 
by the way...dont bounce on the 488...no headroom!!!!


ha ha ha ha ha
 
try using the effects send into a delay pedal / chorus / pitch shifter, etc.. then run that signal back into the amp and re-mic the amp. Don't use the effect return, just record the whole thing to a NEW track. the new track will be "played" by the old track perfectly and have the additional effect(s) to give it a different color. "pseudo" double tracking.

You can then keep the old track and new track for true double tracking or you can just use the new "pseudo" double tracked track.

You can do this with monitors too, re-mic the mix back down to one channel. With effects and proper volume it sometimes comes out better than an actual bounce...depending on what the source was.
 
It sounds like you mean you want the same track recorded twice, but offset slightly, to make it sound thicker?
I wonder if you could send the original track out through a REALLY long patch cord and back in to another track?
I know it sounds like i'm joking but the theory seems to be good, in that the longer the patch cord, the longer it would take the sound to get back to your recorder, and so they would't QUITE sync up, maybe achieving the sound you're talking about....
Along the same lines, maybe you could run the track out to a delay with the mix turned all the way up, so you only get the DELAYED signal coming back, set the delay for a Really short time, and send it back to your new track....
You'll have two tracks offset.
Sounds possible...
maybe I'll try that...

Good luck!
 
ADT works like this. If you put a vocal through a delay and change the delay with a modulator you will get a pitch changing effect. As the delay gets longer the pitch will drop and it gets shorter the pitch will rise. Set a delay unit to say 40msec delay and then modulate the delay, not fast mod just enoughto hear the pitch change. Now mix that with the original and you will have two voices that are in time but one is changing pitch so it sounds like a double track.

That's how I used to do it anyway with a lexicon Primetime :)

I've made an mp3 file to demonstrate.

There are three tracks on this file, (355K). The first is the straight vocal, the second is the modulated vocal (overmod for demo) and the third is the two mixed together.




cheers
John
 
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I just wanted to tell everybody thanks for all the advice. Most of the theories are pretty good. I sent it through a delay and put it on another track. It seems to have worked for the most part. I still plan to try some of the other ideas. I LOVE THIS SITE!
 
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