Tasacam 244 questions

[4tracker]

This is a stupid question, but since I have never recorded 2 tracks at the same time on my 244, I have to ask --- I am wondering if the pan nobs should both be set left or should one be set left and one set right? i.e. the Track 1 pan left and Track 2 pan right? Or Track 1 and Track 2 both panned left? I think it's the former but want to be sure. The manual doesn't mention how to record 2 live tracks.

Thanks.

 

[The Ghost of FM]

Arm track 1 or 3 and pan hard left.
Arm track 2 or 4 and pan hard right.



Cheers!

 

[4tracker]

Arm track 1 or 3 and pan hard left.
Arm track 2 or 4 and pan hard right.



Cheers!

That's what I thought, thanks buddy.

 

[Level Anything]

Hi,

I wasn't sure if I should start a new thread or not. I have a 244 that I bought off ebay last summer for as-is condition. I studied up on it and replaced the belts which made it run fine for about a month when it started eating tape. I then took off the faceplate and cleaned under there while I was replacing the idler tires and that seemed to make it run smooth. I don't use it much so when it started to give me trouble last night I unplugged it mid-session which seriously put a damper on my flow. The problem is that it was on and running for about an hour when I started to notice it was starting make a squeaking sound (a quieter version of how it sounded when I first got it with the melted belts etc.) and that it smelled faintly like hot batteries (you know what I mean?)

This really gets me down as I've put so much work into this machine and I have a real affinity for it and there's nothing that sounds like that.

Does anyone know why it would be making those noises with new belts? The only thing I can think of is that I replaced the belts with a pair that came for my 246 but I was under the impression that they were the same size. I may try to swap them and see if that makes a difference. Any guesses or advice would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[The Ghost of FM]

Hi,

I wasn't sure if I should start a new thread or not. I have a 244 that I bought off ebay last summer for as-is condition. I studied up on it and replaced the belts which made it run fine for about a month when it started eating tape. I then took off the faceplate and cleaned under there while I was replacing the idler tires and that seemed to make it run smooth. I don't use it much so when it started to give me trouble last night I unplugged it mid-session which seriously put a damper on my flow. The problem is that it was on and running for about an hour when I started to notice it was starting make a squeaking sound (a quieter version of how it sounded when I first got it with the melted belts etc.) and that it smelled faintly like hot batteries (you know what I mean?)

This really gets me down as I've put so much work into this machine and I have a real affinity for it and there's nothing that sounds like that.

Does anyone know why it would be making those noises with new belts? The only thing I can think of is that I replaced the belts with a pair that came for my 246 but I was under the impression that they were the same size. I may try to swap them and see if that makes a difference. Any guesses or advice would be appreciated. Thanks!

The 2 belt kit(capstan and control belts) would be the same for the 244 and 246 but if you used an older belt set out of one unit and put it in the other, that belt, due to age, may be in a degraded condition and might explain the noises you reported. Or if you only replaced the capstan belt and neglected to change the control belt, that too might explain it.

Best bet is to purchase a fresh new belt kit to eliminate those variables.



Cheers!

 

[Level Anything]

Thank you Ghost, I appreciate the advice. Yr name rings out in the recording forums that I frequent haha! That Tascam picture thread you started is super cool. That was you right?

Anyways, both belts were brand new when I put them on so I'm seriously stumped at this point. I was thinking that the fact that it started making noises only after it had been running for an hour makes me think that maybe the belt wasn't put on correctly and that the constant turning of the capstan wheel threw it further off alignment? I'm guessing here. Now that school is finished and I have more time I'm going to open it up again and take a look. The smell of also worries me. It was that smell you get when you run your electronics too long and they heat up.

Ugh. I have a 246 that I bought off a guy for $60 here in NYC last summer and I put belts on that and then found out that the pinch roller is sticky and soft so I ordered a new one which is a pretty tough job to replace but I swear to God, I will have a working classic 4-track by the end of the winter. Even if I have to resort to something drastic.

 

[fat_fleet]

Arm track 1 or 3 and pan hard left.
Arm track 2 or 4 and pan hard right.

Ghost, did you realize the OP was talking about tracking and not mixing?

It doesn't matter where you put the pan knobs while you're tracking, panning will only affect output/mixing.

 

[The Ghost of FM]

Ghost, did you realize the OP was talking about tracking and not mixing?

It doesn't matter where you put the pan knobs while you're tracking, panning will only affect output/mixing.

The OP was asking about recording a stereo pair of tracks on a 244. In that scenario, the pan controls do affect how each of the channel strips lays its signal across a stereo pair of tracks. This comes in handy for things like drum kits where you want to pan multiple mic channels into a stereo presentation of the kit or miking an acoustic piano or guitar with multiple mics to a set of stereo tracks with each mic panned to a desired stereo presentation. Further, if you read page 27 of the 244 operation manual, all of what I just outlined will be fully confirmed...Scout's honor!



Cheers!

 

[The Ghost of FM]

Thank you Ghost, I appreciate the advice. Yr name rings out in the recording forums that I frequent haha! That Tascam picture thread you started is super cool. That was you right?

Anyways, both belts were brand new when I put them on so I'm seriously stumped at this point. I was thinking that the fact that it started making noises only after it had been running for an hour makes me think that maybe the belt wasn't put on correctly and that the constant turning of the capstan wheel threw it further off alignment? I'm guessing here. Now that school is finished and I have more time I'm going to open it up again and take a look. The smell of also worries me. It was that smell you get when you run your electronics too long and they heat up.

Ugh. I have a 246 that I bought off a guy for $60 here in NYC last summer and I put belts on that and then found out that the pinch roller is sticky and soft so I ordered a new one which is a pretty tough job to replace but I swear to God, I will have a working classic 4-track by the end of the winter. Even if I have to resort to something drastic.

Thanks for the additional info on the belts and smells the unit produces. The smell issue is the most alarming one to my mind and attempting to localize specifically which component is producing that smell might go a ways toward solving the service issues. If you have a drinking straw, perhaps try using that with one end of the straw up your nose and the other end of the straw moved around to the various components to "sniff out" which item is overheating...assuming you have a decent sense of smell.

About the new belt kit you installed, was this a kit purchased from teac parts out in California or a third party vendor off ebay?

About the wallpaper thread, yup, that's me and thanks for the kind words about that.

Cheers!

 

[skywaveTDR]

Most people are of the assumption that they ONLY need a belt in many mechanisms. This can easily be found false when they do change a belt and find that it does not work or that the unit stops working a little down the road. These older machines- not only Teac or Tascam need a full level of service to make them work long term. How do I know this? I have been doing them for at least 40 years. The 244 and 246 decks I service are still being used a year after I serviced them and so are all my other repairs. You have to do the head base grease, take the cam gears off and get all the old grease out and replace it with Lubriplate 105. I have never had any unit come back due to that grease. The Japanese grease probably being a cheap low grade stuff has been known for failure across many companies from Teac to Sony and all the rest that used it. It does not survive past 20 years well. This post is just to let you know that a fix is out there if you know where to find it.

 

[Dreverb]

I just posted this in other threat, but could be helpful:
I found that this pinch rollers could work in the 244:


Outer Diameter 13 mm
Axis hole Mass 2.00mm
Width of the axle 7,5 mm
Width of the rubber 6.5 mm


and for idler tire


outside 18mm
inside 12 mm
width 3mm
height 3mm

 

[fat_fleet]

The OP was asking about recording a stereo pair of tracks on a 244. In that scenario, the pan controls do affect how each of the channel strips lays its signal across a stereo pair of tracks. This comes in handy for things like drum kits where you want to pan multiple mic channels into a stereo presentation of the kit or miking an acoustic piano or guitar with multiple mics to a set of stereo tracks with each mic panned to a desired stereo presentation. Further, if you read page 27 of the 244 operation manual, all of what I just outlined will be fully confirmed...Scout's honor!

Wow, truly bizarre. I've never seen that on a Tascam Porta or any recording device really. Seems totally counter-intuitive as it would subvert any panning done during mixing.

So just to get this straight, I could arm tracks 1 and 2 and have live input to both, but if I set both pan knobs 100% LEFT prior to tracking, both tracks will be recorded to track 1 and nothing would be recorded to track 2, despite it being armed with a live signal routed to it??

 

[fat_fleet]

Wow, reading the manual now. This is a very cool piece of gear, but weird. I guess it's basically running a small mixer into two tracks.
I dunno. I still think it's sketchy.

 

[The Ghost of FM]

Wow, reading the manual now. This is a very cool piece of gear, but weird. I guess it's basically running a small mixer into two tracks.
I dunno. I still think it's sketchy.

There's nothing sketchy about it. Its a flexible mixer that allows for creative control. It also demands that in order to make the best use of those controls that you understand the tools that are provided.

Think of a painter with a nice canvas, a sturdy easel, a pallet of paint and a handful of brushes and knives to work that paint. Without any training, you'll likely end up with a horrible result that looks like a 4 year old child's effort. With training, you might just end up with the next Mona Lisa.



Cheers!

 

[4tracker]

Wow, truly bizarre. I've never seen that on a Tascam Porta or any recording device really. Seems totally counter-intuitive as it would subvert any panning done during mixing.

Exactly, which is why I asked. I hadn't recorded on it for a few months and forgot the quirks.

It's an awesome machine.

 

[4tracker]

So another question about the 244. I want to use my small condenser mics on it. I found a roundabout way to do this. I run the condenser into an external rolls phantom power unit, then the output of that is a xlr to 1/4" that goes into the back of the 244. Is this safe to do? Is there any impedance problem? I don't see any reason it wouldn't be safe, but I'd like to hear some thoughts.

I ask because last night my mic signal was randomly surging from normal gain to high gain (though maybe I moved my guitar closer to the mic by accident, will have to try again tonight). I don't want to blow up the channel strip.

 

[4tracker]

So just to get this straight, I could arm tracks 1 and 2 and have live input to both, but if I set both pan knobs 100% LEFT prior to tracking, both tracks will be recorded to track 1 and nothing would be recorded to track 2, despite it being armed with a live signal routed to it??

No, there's an arm for track 1 and 2, and you can only move it left or right. Then you have to move the arm left to "sync". So you can't record to both unless you select the 4 channel recording option, which will record to all tracks.

Otherwise, if you want to record two tracks in stereo at once, you have to move the 1-2 arm left and the 3-4 arm to the right. To listen to the playback you use the CUE volume knobs. If you want to actually mix on the machine you need to use "remix" and then change the arm at the top to "tape". Then you can EQ and listen to the mix. I usually do that after I know I have a good take, but otherwise I just use the cue controls to listen back.

 

[A Reel Person]

Wow, truly bizarre.

No, it's not.

I've never seen that on a Tascam Porta or any recording device really.

In the last 15-or-so years.

Seems totally counter-intuitive

Only to those who cut their teeth on input-to-track architecture, the dumbed down design format found in digital, where supposedly "input-side" mixing is irrelevant due to theoretically unlimited track count. (i.e., fix-it-in-the-mix philosophy). In input-to-track architecture, inputs usually correspond to their numbered recording track, and/or one input may only be assigned to one track at a time. That's the rule in the majority of digital based recording setups, Porta or otherwise.

as it would subvert any panning done during mixing.

No, it doesn't.

So just to get this straight, I could arm tracks 1 and 2 and have live input to both, but if I set both pan knobs 100% LEFT prior to tracking, both tracks will be recorded to track 1 and nothing would be recorded to track 2, despite it being armed with a live signal routed to it??

This is basically correct, with a caveat, that being a failure to recognize the difference between channels and tracks.

Inputs, EQ, Aux Sends and Pan are part of the mixer subsystem, which in the case of the 244 mixes from 4-inputs to 2-(output) channels, aka 2-busses, aka stereo-L/R. The L/R mix from the mixer side feeds the 2-simul recording capablility of the 4-track recorder side of the Portastudio architecture.

In your this scenario, both Input Channels are assigned (thru Pan) to Track 1.

The 244 mixer is a 4x2 (stereo) mixer, albeit a good one in a small fomat. It mixes from 4 inputs (Tape/or Mic-Lineto 2 Busses. That's all it does.
Buss Left from the mixer feeds only Tape Tracks 1 and 3.
Buss Right from the mixer feeds only Tape Tracks 2 and 4.
You may have Channels 1 and 2 plugged with inputs, and you may have Tracks 1 and 2 armed to record, but if you pan Mixer Channels 1 and 2 hard left, they essentially feed ONLY Tape Track 1.

The mixer channel does not equal the tape track in this architecture, but they work together inside the box.
A combination of which tape tracks are armed to record and Pan settings on the mixer will determine which tracks get recorded.
Once the 4 tracks are laid out on tape, the Pan controls in the final mix determine the spread L-R of the 4 tape tracks to the outside world.

I hope this info offers clarity and not confusion to the design and operation of the vintage 244, which is generally regarded as a fine unit.

Much unlike digital, tho'...

 

[A Reel Person]

Sorry,...

No, there's an arm for track 1 and 2, and you can only move it left or right. Then you have to move the arm left to "sync". So you can't record to both unless you select the 4 channel recording option, which will record to all tracks.

This is patently wrong. [EDIT: however, the 4-simul setting does record to all 4 tracks simultaneously.]

Otherwise, if you want to record two tracks in stereo at once, you have to move the 1-2 arm left and the 3-4 arm to the right.

Also completely wrong.

To listen to the playback you use the CUE volume knobs. If you want to actually mix on the machine you need to use "remix" and then change the arm at the top to "tape". Then you can EQ and listen to the mix. I usually do that after I know I have a good take, but otherwise I just use the cue controls to listen back.

However, this section is exactly correct!

Thank you!

 

[A Reel Person]

Saw some things here &...

I thought I could try to help straighten out the facts.
I'm not in a flame war with anyone here.

More like giving tips and props to you for focusing on the 244.
An advanced and worthy device from an entirely other age of recording.

Separate the concepts between a 4x2 mixer and 4-track recorder in one box,
where it matters completely how the inputs are mixed to interface with the tracks.
A concept that's apparently lost on today's recordists. It's very 20th Century.