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randyfromde
New member
That's great chessrock, but I have no idea what you are talking about :-/
sonicpaint
New member
Some have come real close.
The fastest way to do it is with an Parametric EQ. If your using CoolEdit Pro 2 it does have one, even the 1.2 version has one. Use a Q of about 1.30 and reduce the Frequency of 250hz about 3-4db. I know this works and if for some reason you can't get it send me the file and I'll do it for you.
I wouldn't use compression at all because it'll strip the dynamics and tone of the guitar if done incorrectly.
sonicpaint
The fastest way to do it is with an Parametric EQ. If your using CoolEdit Pro 2 it does have one, even the 1.2 version has one. Use a Q of about 1.30 and reduce the Frequency of 250hz about 3-4db. I know this works and if for some reason you can't get it send me the file and I'll do it for you.
I wouldn't use compression at all because it'll strip the dynamics and tone of the guitar if done incorrectly.
sonicpaint
C
chessrock
Banned
randyfromde said:
A multiband compressor acts like a normal compressor, but only on specified frequencies without affecting the others.
So if you find out what general frequency range is jumping out every time you hit the A string, you set the multiband comp to act on that band.
If you highlight every instance the A string goes all wacko, and take down the offending band using EQ, then you're essentially doing what the multiband com is doing . . . only you're doing it manually (and the hard way, for the most part).
sonicpaint
New member
Multi band compression?
Multi-band compression will produce a dull sound and ruin the crispness of the guitar. As far as compression and EQ doing the same thing? I have to disagree with you there. Compression controls the dynamic range. In the case of the multi-band compressor, it controls the dynamic range in any given frequency that is chosen. It's not the same thing when both produce different artifacts in the program material in relation to the setting and frequencies that are adjusted or the dynamic range being reduced.
Though this can be done with a compressor, it takes someone who is very familiar with a compressor to achieve this, not to mention the settings being much different then your regular settings. In most cases the setting that are need to be applied can't even be done on most studio compressors due do missing options that are needed to achieve this. Some of you will understand what I mean by this and some of you won't. Those who don't should try to learn more about compression. I'm saying this in a nice way, so I don't want people flying of the handle about this comment.
sonicpaint
Multi-band compression will produce a dull sound and ruin the crispness of the guitar. As far as compression and EQ doing the same thing? I have to disagree with you there. Compression controls the dynamic range. In the case of the multi-band compressor, it controls the dynamic range in any given frequency that is chosen. It's not the same thing when both produce different artifacts in the program material in relation to the setting and frequencies that are adjusted or the dynamic range being reduced.
Though this can be done with a compressor, it takes someone who is very familiar with a compressor to achieve this, not to mention the settings being much different then your regular settings. In most cases the setting that are need to be applied can't even be done on most studio compressors due do missing options that are needed to achieve this. Some of you will understand what I mean by this and some of you won't. Those who don't should try to learn more about compression. I'm saying this in a nice way, so I don't want people flying of the handle about this comment.
sonicpaint
C
chessrock
Banned
Re: Multi band compression?
. . . If you're an idiot and don't know how to use it properly.
I sure hope you do, because it's not true, and it's not what I said, Skippy. A hammer and a can opener don't do the same thing, either. But if you beat a nail hard enough with a can opener, I'm sure you'd eventually drive the nail in.
I'm merely suggesting to our friend who started this thread that he may want to use the hammer instead, since it will accomplish the same task, only quicker and easier.
Yea, and every time a given frequency range crosses a particular threshold (has too much energy), the multiband comp reduces it by a specified ratio. In the case of using an EQ plugin, you're basically taking on the role of human multiband compressor by manually seeking out/listening for when that frequency range has too much energy (crosses your personal threshold) . . . then using an EQ plug to reduce it.
In one case, you're doing all the work . . . and in the other, you're letting the multiband comp do it for you.
I guess it depends on how much time you have on your hands, but I'd rather go in to save energy mode if/when I can.
sonicpaint said:
. . . If you're an idiot and don't know how to use it properly.
I sure hope you do, because it's not true, and it's not what I said, Skippy. A hammer and a can opener don't do the same thing, either. But if you beat a nail hard enough with a can opener, I'm sure you'd eventually drive the nail in.
I'm merely suggesting to our friend who started this thread that he may want to use the hammer instead, since it will accomplish the same task, only quicker and easier.
Yea, and every time a given frequency range crosses a particular threshold (has too much energy), the multiband comp reduces it by a specified ratio. In the case of using an EQ plugin, you're basically taking on the role of human multiband compressor by manually seeking out/listening for when that frequency range has too much energy (crosses your personal threshold) . . . then using an EQ plug to reduce it.
In one case, you're doing all the work . . . and in the other, you're letting the multiband comp do it for you.
I guess it depends on how much time you have on your hands, but I'd rather go in to save energy mode if/when I can.
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sonicpaint
New member
A little pissed off are we?
First of all bone head don't refer to me as skippy! Next, I know how to use a compressor very well thank you, most likely better than you. That's what wrong with people like you, always taking the the lazy way of doing things. Compression does produce a dull sound no matter what you seem to think. It also reduces the openness and natural sound of any given material. A compressor has it's place but it's not the first tool you should turn to to fix a problem such as in boomy guitar sound.
What is it with you, no one can have a different opinion then yours with out you getting all child like?
Why don't you have a poll asking people if the compression is where people would turn when it comes to what is being discussed? I'm confident that you'd be disappointed in the results. A good hint can be seen in the responses that have been posted already.
Your a jerk,
sonicpaint
First of all bone head don't refer to me as skippy! Next, I know how to use a compressor very well thank you, most likely better than you. That's what wrong with people like you, always taking the the lazy way of doing things. Compression does produce a dull sound no matter what you seem to think. It also reduces the openness and natural sound of any given material. A compressor has it's place but it's not the first tool you should turn to to fix a problem such as in boomy guitar sound.
What is it with you, no one can have a different opinion then yours with out you getting all child like?
Why don't you have a poll asking people if the compression is where people would turn when it comes to what is being discussed? I'm confident that you'd be disappointed in the results. A good hint can be seen in the responses that have been posted already.
Your a jerk,
sonicpaint
C
chessrock
Banned
Look, Peanut Brain . . .
I'm not talking about compression. I'm talking about multi-band compression, numbnuts. multiband, multiband, mulbiband.
If you're so much better at this stuff than a guy like me, why is it that you seem to have so much trouble with that? And why is it that such a compression whiz can't even figure out how to use one without making everything sound dull?
Go and post your own peabrained polls based on your delusions of what I didn't even say or imply in the first place. I'm getting testy because I'm taking time out of my day to help some people out and tell them what tool is most commonly used for this phenomenon being discussed. I'm actually trying to further the learning process. And I don't like it when guys come along and undo it all by spurting out misinformation.
I'm not talking about compression. I'm talking about multi-band compression, numbnuts. multiband, multiband, mulbiband.
If you're so much better at this stuff than a guy like me, why is it that you seem to have so much trouble with that? And why is it that such a compression whiz can't even figure out how to use one without making everything sound dull?
Go and post your own peabrained polls based on your delusions of what I didn't even say or imply in the first place. I'm getting testy because I'm taking time out of my day to help some people out and tell them what tool is most commonly used for this phenomenon being discussed. I'm actually trying to further the learning process. And I don't like it when guys come along and undo it all by spurting out misinformation.
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randyfromde
New member
Chessrock-
Where would I get a multi-band compressor? Outboard or software? Finally, do you think I'd be better off upgrading my preamp (instead of Behringer mixer) before getting a MB compressor? By that I mean, which would give me a "bigger bang for the buck" so to speak?
Thanks everybody for your help!
Where would I get a multi-band compressor? Outboard or software? Finally, do you think I'd be better off upgrading my preamp (instead of Behringer mixer) before getting a MB compressor? By that I mean, which would give me a "bigger bang for the buck" so to speak?
Thanks everybody for your help!
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Han
New member
Guys, time to chill.
The brother who started the thread has a problem which is not solved by bashing each other.
A compressor can work great if used like it should. A multiband can work even better.
If you compress an acoustic guitar too heavy, it will sound dull indeed.
A better way will be multing, add the compressed signal to the uncompressed.
I also feel for the EQ in the compressor, like de-essing, but now called de-booming.
The best way to get a great sound still is recording a great sound by using a great mic and clever placement.
Remember, the best compression no compressor at all.
The brother who started the thread has a problem which is not solved by bashing each other.
A compressor can work great if used like it should. A multiband can work even better.
If you compress an acoustic guitar too heavy, it will sound dull indeed.
A better way will be multing, add the compressed signal to the uncompressed.
I also feel for the EQ in the compressor, like de-essing, but now called de-booming.
The best way to get a great sound still is recording a great sound by using a great mic and clever placement.
Remember, the best compression no compressor at all.
C
chessrock
Banned
The deal with a multiband comp is it will work specifically on that frequency range that you specify (where the A string mostly lies) while leaving the rest of the audio unaffected. The result is you don't get the squashing or any of the other negative artifacts usually associated with a compressor . . . because it's really not a compressor per se.
It's like having a little guy at the EQ knob who senses whenever that A string is hit, and automatically makes the EQ adjustment when it's pops out with too much force. . . and then returns everything to normal after when it dies out.
A much, much more elegant and transparent method of dealing with the problem, since it's more of a frequency specific kind of thing. It's just like a de-esser, as Han mentioned . . . in fact, that's basically what most de-essers are.
It's like having a little guy at the EQ knob who senses whenever that A string is hit, and automatically makes the EQ adjustment when it's pops out with too much force. . . and then returns everything to normal after when it dies out.
A much, much more elegant and transparent method of dealing with the problem, since it's more of a frequency specific kind of thing. It's just like a de-esser, as Han mentioned . . . in fact, that's basically what most de-essers are.
C
chessrock
Banned
BTW . . .
Waves C4 is a popular multiband comp plugin.
Another one I like is the Sonic Foundary multiband dynamics plug that comes with Sound Forge and Vegas. It works on very narrow bands, so it's great for the real surgical kind of stuff (hint: I like to use it on the bass guitar at the kick and snare ranges so as to keep it from clashing with the drums sometimes).
I believe ultrafunk has one, as well, and if you're on a budget, those are some outstanding plugins to have.
Waves C4 is a popular multiband comp plugin.
Another one I like is the Sonic Foundary multiband dynamics plug that comes with Sound Forge and Vegas. It works on very narrow bands, so it's great for the real surgical kind of stuff (hint: I like to use it on the bass guitar at the kick and snare ranges so as to keep it from clashing with the drums sometimes).
I believe ultrafunk has one, as well, and if you're on a budget, those are some outstanding plugins to have.
Middleman
Professional Amateur
Yes they do and it is a kickass multiband IMHO.
sonicpaint
New member
Your names are hurting my feelings.
Your name calling (that you started I might add) is getting old. Your a child and your second post in response to mine just confirmed it. I know what multiband compression is and can use it very effectively and multiband compression is still compression.
As far as you taking time out of your day to further the learning? You think your the only one, look around you that's what we all are trying to do isn't it? I simply disagreed with you and you started with the name calling. So who started this?
Chessrock you said that I misunderstood and that you didn't say that EQ and compression where not the same thing. Then you go and say this.
If you are not saying that EQ and Compression are not the same then how can "a little guy at the EQ knob turn down the A string" when it's hit during the use of a compressor? Them being different, this wouldn't be possible now would it? Talk about counter-dicking yourself.
I've already explained that the settings would be different and it takes someone very familiar with compression to do that, so if you would learn how to read you'd see that. I also didn't say I was a whiz, those are your words not mine.
I agree with Han when he said "Remember, the best compression no compressor at all." That's why I was suggesting avoiding compression in the first place.
sonicpaint
Your name calling (that you started I might add) is getting old. Your a child and your second post in response to mine just confirmed it. I know what multiband compression is and can use it very effectively and multiband compression is still compression.
As far as you taking time out of your day to further the learning? You think your the only one, look around you that's what we all are trying to do isn't it? I simply disagreed with you and you started with the name calling. So who started this?
Chessrock you said that I misunderstood and that you didn't say that EQ and compression where not the same thing. Then you go and say this.
If you are not saying that EQ and Compression are not the same then how can "a little guy at the EQ knob turn down the A string" when it's hit during the use of a compressor? Them being different, this wouldn't be possible now would it? Talk about counter-dicking yourself.
I've already explained that the settings would be different and it takes someone very familiar with compression to do that, so if you would learn how to read you'd see that. I also didn't say I was a whiz, those are your words not mine.
I agree with Han when he said "Remember, the best compression no compressor at all." That's why I was suggesting avoiding compression in the first place.
sonicpaint
R
randyfromde
New member
I realize that no compression would be ideal, but it's only the 'A' string for that certain Am chord. I like the tone for the rest of the chords song, so I just need to tame the A string (or find a new tone!)
But anyway, thank you all for your help! I'll keep my eye out for multi-band compression, and use the other EQ suggestions in the meantime.
But anyway, thank you all for your help! I'll keep my eye out for multi-band compression, and use the other EQ suggestions in the meantime.
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chessrock
Banned
Re: Your names are hurting my feelings.
A compressor is like having a little green man at the fader. A multiband compressor is like having a little green man at the EQ. Get it?
sonicpaint said:
A compressor is like having a little green man at the fader. A multiband compressor is like having a little green man at the EQ. Get it?
jake-owa
Banned
I think a different mic would be the best option.
Get yourself a nice sd condensor and try that.
...and chesscock, "taking time out of my day"...that's hillarious!
Get yourself a nice sd condensor and try that.
...and chesscock, "taking time out of my day"...that's hillarious!
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Han
New member
Re: Re: Your names are hurting my feelings.
You're close, but multiband compression is still compression, iaw it works with levels, not with EQ.
It works somewhat like a de-esser, compression in a small band of the spectrum.
You could say a multiband compressor can work as a de-esser, de-mudder and de-boomer at the same time.
But it still makes loud sound less loud (in most occasions).
Cheers, Han
chessrock said:
You're close, but multiband compression is still compression, iaw it works with levels, not with EQ.
It works somewhat like a de-esser, compression in a small band of the spectrum.
You could say a multiband compressor can work as a de-esser, de-mudder and de-boomer at the same time.
But it still makes loud sound less loud (in most occasions).
Cheers, Han
C
chessrock
Banned
Well, Jesus.
Looks like you guys don't need my help after all.
We got ourselves a bunch of freakin' audio geniuses, here.
Why the hell are we arguing over minute technicalities? Yes, multiband compression is still compression, but can we at least agree it's different enough so as to warrant recognizing it as a different thing with different uses and effects from what we normally associate with a typical compressor?
A mountain lion and a house cat are both felines, for example. But if someone asked you which one you'd rather have as a pet, would you say "Doesn't matter. A cat's a cat?"
Same general classification, but two very different things.
Looks like you guys don't need my help after all.
We got ourselves a bunch of freakin' audio geniuses, here.
Why the hell are we arguing over minute technicalities?
Yes, multiband compression is still compression, but can we at least agree it's different enough so as to warrant recognizing it as a different thing with different uses and effects from what we normally associate with a typical compressor?A mountain lion and a house cat are both felines, for example. But if someone asked you which one you'd rather have as a pet, would you say "Doesn't matter. A cat's a cat?"
Same general classification, but two very different things.
riley357
HR MUSE
How many angels can I fit on the head of a pin with multiband compression as opposed to "regular" compression???
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randyfromde
New member
It looks like this thread has gone to hell :-/
"I think a different mic would be the best option.
Get yourself a nice sd condensor and try that."
I'm using 2 Oktava MK-012 SD condensor mics. Seems like everyone else can get a decent sound (me too, except for the booming A open string from the guitar), so I am going to stick with them.
I'm not quite sure why everyone is beating up on chessrock....his idea sounds very elegant to me. I guess they are just flames from a fire before my time ;-)
I know exactly what frequency is the problem, so whether I use EQ or compression, I'm only trying to tame that one frequency, not change anything else. It seems as though they'd both work to some extent, but I wouldn't know yet since I don't have multi-band compression capabilities.
"I think a different mic would be the best option.
Get yourself a nice sd condensor and try that."
I'm using 2 Oktava MK-012 SD condensor mics. Seems like everyone else can get a decent sound (me too, except for the booming A open string from the guitar), so I am going to stick with them.
I'm not quite sure why everyone is beating up on chessrock....his idea sounds very elegant to me. I guess they are just flames from a fire before my time ;-)
I know exactly what frequency is the problem, so whether I use EQ or compression, I'm only trying to tame that one frequency, not change anything else. It seems as though they'd both work to some extent, but I wouldn't know yet since I don't have multi-band compression capabilities.
