Taco Night

[K-dub]

Hey Dub.

I think you had a point on frequency masking. I think the problem is small, but it's still a valid point.

And keep in mind the huge amount of respect I have for your opinions when you read this. But I just think you're wrong on phase issues.

First and most important - I don't hear any phase issues.

The two guitar parts are panned 100% L and R. They're double tracked - not copied/pasted/delayed-on-one-side. So they share 0% of the stereo spread, leaving them no room for cancellation/phasey-ness (does anyone sum to mono and check for phase anymore? I don't. anyway...). Phase tends to happen more prominently with cleaner tones and at lower frequencies. The guitars here are quite distorted and have a somewhat small amount of low frequency content.

So even theoretically there is only a small chance at phase issues. And again, most importantly, I'm not hearing them.

I'll bet I could cut the mid-2Ks from the guitars, automate it so the cut only happens when the vocal is present in the verse, and address your original point on frequency masking.

But phase? I don't think it's an issue.

And I've made way too big of a deal out of this. Sorry.

Oh - you're right. It doesn't sound overly phased. That's because it's not. Your ears are not deceiving you by not hearing it. It's not drowning in phase issues. I said that's the result of two wide sources that are too much alike (with the difference YOU correctly noted). That said, there IS phase here, but it is not stand out noticeable - where one would hear the "phase wash". It's more the other thing: Wide Mono.

You would benefit by retracking the part - not double tracking. Use a different timbre entirely. THEN you will clear out the center for the pocket. You can play essentially the same part - just use a completely different tone.

 

[Trojka]

There are no phase issues whatsoever. If it's double tracked, the waveforms are entirely different and there can't be any issues with phase. Even with the same guitar, same distortion pedal and same amp (sim), but played twice. In fact: you can take the same DI guitar track, run it through two different amp (sims) and they will have entirely different waveforms. Phase issues only occur when copying tracks, or when you use multi mic setups. Or of course running the exact same signal through different devices and one has - polarity while the other has +.

Two identical tracks, quite out of phase. They are clearly the same, but shifted a few ms:

Same DI track, ran through two different amps and mics (but with a similar sound): the waves are significantly different and there can't be any phase issues.

There are reasons why you'd want to play a different guitar part on the left than on the right, or choose a different guitar, but that's about arrangement and mix, not phase.

 

[K-dub]

There are no phase issues whatsoever. If it's double tracked, the waveforms are entirely different and there can't be any issues with phase. Even with the same guitar, same distortion pedal and same amp (sim), but played twice. In fact: you can take the same DI guitar track, run it through two different amp (sims) and they will have entirely different waveforms. Phase issues only occur when copying tracks, or when you use multi mic setups. Or of course running the exact same signal through different devices and one has - polarity while the other has +.

Two identical tracks, quite out of phase. They are clearly the same, but shifted a few ms:

View attachment 149764

Same DI track, ran through two different amps and mics (but with a similar sound): the waves are significantly different and there can't be any phase issues.

View attachment 149765

There are reasons why you'd want to play a different guitar part on the left than on the right, or choose a different guitar, but that's about arrangement and mix, not phase.

This is correct.