stand alone or handheld?

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all i primarily do is vocals. ive been thinking of getting a condenser and a m-audio usb mobile pre due to unsatisfied boxy recorded vocals. for a condenser mic would you recomend a stand alone studio projects b1 or something like a shure beta sm87 handheld? i like to hold my mic when i sing to get into it more, but will definitely go for a stand alone one if they offer significant quality improvements.
 
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I seem to remember something about Jim Morrison insisting on holding the mic, and that they gave him a mic to hold, but put a LDC up in front of him to do the actual micing. There's some pretty good hand held condensers these days with good internal shockmounting to reduce handleing noise, and of course it could even be that your voice and the music you sing to would sound best with a dynamic. But by and large, the lions share of vocal tracks are recorded with side address large diaphram condensers, and not just cuz they look cool.

-RD
 
i seem to loose my energy when i just stand in front of a mic to sing. does anyone have any experience or opinions on the specific models i mentioned?

the studio projects b-1 or the shure beta87 .


i want to get the beta87 regardless if it costs 100 bucks more because it's handheld, but its frequency response is slightly less and i dont believe it is large diaphragm. also i want to avoid having a stand alone microphone that needs a large stand to take up space in my room where a handheld wouldnt have that problem. are they both good for recording purposes? which one generally sounds better?
 
If you're using this for yourself you really need to audition the mic before just buying it. I'd also consider the Beta 58.
 
i do not have a store within 100 miles of where i live that has mics to audition that i know of . i went to the closest music store (45 miles away) and you can test everything except their mics unfortunately.
 
The Beta 87 is a fine mic, good for live use too. However you're gonna want to learn how to put it on a mic stand to sing in the studio. If you move around too much, you create problems with levels, plosives, bass response, etc. If you still insist on using a handheld mic to record, I'd look into an omni pattern mic that will suffer a bit less in response, like the EV 635a, Shure SM63, Beyer M58.
 
If you are just going to use it for vocals the freq response of the 87 is all you need.
If I remember right the 87 goes from 50 to 18k? You cant sing that low or that high so its a mute point.
 
the frequency response is actualy 50-20 according to the shure website, although some music store websites list it as 50-18....and zzounds actually lists it as both 50-18 and 50-20 on the same page. and when i record i dont really move too much, i just prefer holding the mic. sooo, back to the main question..which one generally has better sound? or will they both be good condenser improvements with not much difference between the two?
 
riznich said:
or will they both be good condenser improvements with not much difference between the two?
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Side address condensers are not comfortably handheld. Get the 87.
 
riznich said:
all i primarily do is vocals. ive been thinking of getting a condenser and a m-audio usb mobile pre due to unsatisfied boxy recorded vocals. for a condenser mic would you recomend a stand alone studio projects b1 or something like a shure beta sm87 handheld? i like to hold my mic when i sing to get into it more, but will definitely go for a stand alone one if they offer significant quality improvements.
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In my experience, boxy sounding vocals can be due in large part to the room you recorded in. Get a better mic, but consider the room also.
 
what type of room would be descent for recording in and what type of room should i avoid? would something like a 12x12 carpeted bedroom be better, or a kitchen with tile floor, or a carpeted open basement area? i really dont want to spend money treating a room at all.
 
mshilarious said:
Side address condensers are not comfortably handheld. Get the 87.
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thanks, i was considering getting one of those and just trying to record with it handheld...but like you said it doesnt look comfortable and sturdy as one made specificaly for being handheld. the only reason i would get a large diaphragm stand alone condenser (ie studio projects b-1) would be if they offer a significant boost in sound quality over one such as the beta 87. thats why i posted this question. to see the general sound quality difference between the 2. if they're both good condensers i'd rather shell out the extra 100 bucks for the handheld sturdiness and name of shure.
 
riznich said:
thanks, i was considering getting one of those and just trying to record with it handheld...but like you said it doesnt look comfortable and sturdy as one made specificaly for being handheld. the only reason i would get a large diaphragm stand alone condenser (ie studio projects b-1) would be if they offer a significant boost in sound quality over one such as the beta 87. thats why i posted this question. to see the general sound quality difference between the 2. if they're both good condensers i'd rather shell out the extra 100 bucks for the handheld sturdiness and name of shure.
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For the money of the 87, an easy comparison would be the Shure KSM27, which is about $50 more. The 27 is a superior studio mic (quieter, more sensitive, cardioid, large diaphragm for what that's worth); the 87 is a very good mic, definitely solid for recording, but has features that are intended for live use, like the suspension and built-in pop filter. These are things you will need if you record handheld.

Until you use a studio condenser like the 27 or SP, I don't think you realize how sensitive these mics are. If you move your finger on the case, they will pick it up. They don't have much in terms of pop filters, so you'd have to rig something up (usually they are used with stand-mounted pop filters).

This is why I first recommended learning to use a stand, and failing that, buying the 87. I don't know that it's a better mic than the B1 (never used that). I'm nearly certain it's a better mic for you.
 
riznich said:
what type of room would be descent for recording in and what type of room should i avoid? would something like a 12x12 carpeted bedroom be better, or a kitchen with tile floor, or a carpeted open basement area? i really dont want to spend money treating a room at all.
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You may not have to. Use your ears to find the best room.

Avoid tiny little boxy rooms like closets. Avoid big rooms with little furniture and lots of echo. Avoid small bathrooms with lots of echo, unless you are looking for that sound.

Larger well furnished rooms work best for me, with the back side of the mic facing the more open reflective side of the room, and the address side facing the singer. I actually found my sweet spot to be halfway in between two largish rooms.

Also keep the mic up close. The closer the mic, the less gain needed, the less gain, the less room sound you pick up with a cardioid mic. You'll need a pop screen.
 
Herm said:
...its a mute point...
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The word is "moot", not "mute".

Sorry. I'm not usually a grammar cop, but this one is a pet peeve of mine.

As for the mic, any of the Shure handhelds might do the trick. Bono has cut many a vocal with an SM58 or Beta58. Plenty of rock guys use 57's or 58's in the studio. If you want a super-deluxe handheld, you could try the Neumann KSM-105.
 
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