set up/ intonation

[daav]

What a great read, amazing what a little question will stir up.

Just to keep everyone abreast, I have gone from deciding to do the set up myself, to having a professional take care of it, to having a professional play the damn thing as well, better safe than sorry!

j/k but really thanks for the all the opinions.

Daav

 

[goldtopchas]

You'll get a great-playing guitar back from the pro. (I also do this for a living.)
But I know where you're coming from...I too am a chronic DIY'er. I can't stand paying for something that I think I can do myself!! OK...I'm a little cheap too! If you do get the info, practice set-up work, and get good at it,you'll be able to set-up you're guitar perfectly for your needs.
After all... action , intonation, relief, ...these are all subject to change from player to player.(Do you play hard or soft?, have a habit of fretting hard, change string guages once in a while?, fingerpick and flatpick on the same guitar?)

 

[Light]

I'd still like to know how much of an error is audible.

Well, I can hear just about anything in simultanious notes, but there is a difference between what you can hear, and what you will notice.

The issue with intonation is to do with how it relates to the rest of the fingerboard. If you are off at the twelfth fret, you will be even further off at other frets, particularly as you move up the fingerboard.

And in that reguard, nothing but a strobe will get you there.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi

 

[apl]

...particularly as you move up the fingerboard.

People play up there? I thought those frets were just decoration.

 

[ggunn]

Well, I can hear just about anything in simultanious notes, but there is a difference between what you can hear, and what you will notice.

The issue with intonation is to do with how it relates to the rest of the fingerboard. If you are off at the twelfth fret, you will be even further off at other frets, particularly as you move up the fingerboard.

And in that reguard, nothing but a strobe will get you there.

I hope I don't make you angry, but two things:

First, that's not evidence, that's anecdotal. And second, you have a vested interest in making the point that intonation can not be set correctly or well enough except with the equipment you have and the service you sell. If you could tell me to play some interval and listen for something specific that would point out the inaccuracy of a quartz tuner relative to a strobe, then maybe we'd have something.

I understand the physics involved pretty well, and I do not question that a strobe tuner is a very accurate instrument. My partner in a band used to have one that we used for tuning up for every session, and when he got hard up for cash he sold it to someone else for $100 without giving me first refusal. That was 25 years ago, my ex-partner is dead, and I'm STILL pissed off about it.

Anyway, what I am going to do is put new strings on my '61 Strat and set the intonation as best I can by ear and with a quartz tuner, and play it for a while. Then I will again put new strings on it and take it to a reputable shop and get it set up (I need some nut work done anyway). If I can't tell the diff in intonation then at least I have proven to myself that at least for me, paying someone else to set it is a waste of money. YMMV.

 

[Micter]

I would never pay someone for a set up! EVER! It's too easy. Realistically if no fret work is necessary it'll take an hour at the most.

.008 relief at the 7th fret is what I shoot for. Intonation is as sinple as remembering to lengthen the string if it's sharp and visa versa.

Fret work takes some tome to learn but it isn't as hard as people make it seem.

 

[zed32]

do pro set-up shops frown upon setting up guitars that are down-tuned? i have one guitar that is in an alternate tuning that i use when i feel like playing metal or stuff like that...do you think it would be a hassle to get it set up by a pro, or should i try and do it myself? oh and don't worry i can still play standard tuning, those are the guitars i play most often.

 

[travelin travis]

although I think a strobe tuner would help to get accurate results in setting intonation, how come every time i take a guitar to a pro, the intonation is slightly out again as soon as the "new" wears off of the strings?

 

[mandocaster]

Intonation is a compromise. I usually tweak action heght and intonation for a week or two after I make a truss rod adjustment. Even so, there is no such thing as perfect compensation. Even with a good nut height and accurate intonation at the 12th fret you will have varying intonation up and down the neck.

Even if a guitar is somehow made to play perfectly in tune with itself (impossible,as far as I know) it will still be using equal temperament, which will sound distinctly out of tune.

It doesn't bother me usually, but sometimes it can be maddening.

 

[crazydoc]

Just to keep everyone abreast, I have gone from deciding to do the set up myself, to having a professional take care of it, to having a professional play the damn thing as well, better safe than sorry!

HAHAHAHAHA

This says it all - great line.

After all, most of us are amateurs, and we do what we can do to the best of our capabilities. I would never pay someone to work on my instruments, because I play them and work on them for pleasure. I repair them, mod them, rebuild them, and sometimes fuck them up because I enjoy it.

However, if I depended on the playability of an instrument to make my living, or recorded seriously/professionally, or had a valuable vintage instrument, I would have that instrument optimized and maintained by a pro.

 

[Armistice]

Maton acoustic guitars are made so that the only way you can adjust the truss rod is to take the strap button off the base and stick a particularly long specialist tool (presumably just a very long allen key) through the body of the guitar to the truss rod.

Stops us amateurs destroying their guitars... which probably isn't a bad thing. That said, if I have to get an acoustic set up more than once every three years or so, then it's not a very good guitar, so I don't mind. Except for the hassle of taking it to an authorised dealer who have the tool...

Another factor in set up is how the guitar is played and what it's used for. I set up my own electrics and have a friend who plays with a much heavier left hand than me and he can't make my guitars sound in tune..

Cheers