Pop-filter to record closer to soundhole?

[fatstrat]

Thanks for all the responses everyone.

I like getting that "click" sound of the pick hitting the strings, which is another reason why I like miking near the soundhole.

After recording a couple of short clips, one at the soundhole, and the other right at the edge of it, I think I like the latter better. The soundhole does sound boomy. But for really, really soft playing I still think it sounds the best, even after recording & listening to these clips.

Anyway, I uploaded a couple of MP3s of just messing around with some chords at each mic position.

Soundhole:

Neckjoint:

Both have a little boom going on. But the 2nd one allows me to play a little louder before it starts to sound like ass.

I can guess everyone will think the 2nd one sounds better. But I'd still like to hear your opinions, and suggestions on improving the sound.

Edit:

If anyone is interested, the signal chain was: Behringer ECM8000 -> DMP3 -> Audiophile 24/96 -> Reaper at 44.1/24-bit, no FX just normalized when converting to MP3.

There is more boom than I'd like I probably should have spent a little more time setting the mic up like I usually do but oh well.

2nd one.

How many mics do you have? Why not try micing from both positions and then mixing the two to get that happy medium?

 

[TexRoadkill]

Why do you refuse to mic the neck like everyone is suggesting? You will actually get more pick and definition there. I like micing up around the 3rd to 7th fret. If you need more body a mic up by the players head pointed down can get more low end. If the room sounds good a mic a few feet away can sound great also.

 

[Robert D]

As Punkin mentioned, omni mics are the way to get in close to a guitar without proximity effect. This is going to be doubly important if the sound you want is coming from the soundhole. An omni cap on one of my Mk-012s does this nicely, on the rare occasion I actually want it that rich.

 

[danny.guitar]

fatstrat - I always have bad luck with stereo miking (if that's what you mean). Also, using 2 omni mics doesn't produce much of a stereo image. Recording 1 take, then another afterwards usually produces that "chorusy" sound that I don't like. No matter how tight my playing/timing is, it's always there.

Tex - I do mic the neck (around 3rd-7th) fret sometimes for lead playing, but it really just produces a thin sound.

 

[Daisy]

Any time you mic something that close, it's going to sound unnatural in some way shape or form.

Whether it's the 12th fret or whether it's the sound hole ... I just don't generally tend to take my head and shove it right up on the guitar while someone is trying to play it.

It's more than a little uncomfortable for one. Not to mention distracting to the player. Puts my face in danger of getting pelted if the player really starts strumming hard. And it always just seems to wind up sounding like ... well, like the clips you just posted.

There's a reason why I like a little breathing room between myself and the player. And it's pretty much the same reason why I like a little breathing room between the mic and the guitar when I record. There seems to be a strong inverse correlation between how well an accoustic track sounds and how far away the mic is.

The only trick is that, well, you kinda' have to have a really good sounding room ... or a really dead and heavily treated one. If you really get in to the intimacy and detail of close-mic'ing ... then you really need to start with a room that's almost anechoic, and you need to back that mic off by about 4-5 feet or so. Even with those Behringer thingies ... if you're tracking in a dead enough room, you shouldn't lose any detail by backing it up like that.

If your room sucks or if it's too lively for that kind of intimate style of playing ... then you're pretty much painting yourself in to a corner and limiting yourself to different forms of close-mic'ing -- all of which are going to be a compromise of some sort. The clips you posted ... sound like a close-mic'ed guitar. That's what a close mic'ed guitar sounds like, and if it sounded any different, then I'd think something was wrong. Kind of like if you stuck a mic in front of a duck, and it sounded like a horse.

.

 

[danny.guitar]

I think the 2nd clip sounds good. I agree that sometimes it sounds like the guitar needs room to "breathe" but in this untreated room, backing off even more than 1ft, you lose all the detail and the room starts to influence the sound.

I have 3 absorber panels setup behind the mic in a /---\ kind of shape which helps, but not as much as I'd like.

 

[robin watson]

Any time you mic something that close, it's going to sound unnatural in some way shape or form.

Whether it's the 12th fret or whether it's the sound hole ... I just don't generally tend to take my head and shove it right up on the guitar while someone is trying to play it.

It's more than a little uncomfortable for one. Not to mention distracting to the player. Puts my face in danger of getting pelted if the player really starts strumming hard. And it always just seems to wind up sounding like ... well, like the clips you just posted.

There's a reason why I like a little breathing room between myself and the player. And it's pretty much the same reason why I like a little breathing room between the mic and the guitar when I record. There seems to be a strong inverse correlation between how well an accoustic track sounds and how far away the mic is.

The only trick is that, well, you kinda' have to have a really good sounding room ... or a really dead and heavily treated one. If you really get in to the intimacy and detail of close-mic'ing ... then you really need to start with a room that's almost anechoic, and you need to back that mic off by about 4-5 feet or so. Even with those Behringer thingies ... if you're tracking in a dead enough room, you shouldn't lose any detail by backing it up like that.

If your room sucks or if it's too lively for that kind of intimate style of playing ... then you're pretty much painting yourself in to a corner and limiting yourself to different forms of close-mic'ing -- all of which are going to be a compromise of some sort. The clips you posted ... sound like a close-mic'ed guitar. That's what a close mic'ed guitar sounds like, and if it sounded any different, then I'd think something was wrong. Kind of like if you stuck a mic in front of a duck, and it sounded like a horse.

.

Agreed: it's all about the room when it comes to achieving good acoustic guitar sound, which requires a bit of distance between guitar and mic. Stick your ear up again the soundhole of a strummed guitar and it actually sounds horrible there; like a close snare mic sounds like it does, because that's what it sounds like at that location. I only wish I had that kind of room myself.

I'm even looking at trying the new Fishman Aura line of pedals, particularly the one for classical guitar. That's how sad I am..

R

 

[giraffe]

yea, i too think that the neckjoint sounds a little better.
no surprise really.

remember, your pick is as much a function of your overall tone as mic placement.

sounds like your using a thin, which is good for the "click" but not so good for the "boom"

try others, and get used to when/where you'll want to use them.

for me:
thin for backup strumming, something that has to sit in a mix, usually to add to something else.

med more for a prominent rythm part.

heavy more for picked parts, or a "hard" rythm sound.
ymmv.

 

[IronFlippy]

I've gotten good sounds by putting the mic between the sound hole and where the neck is attached to the body, around 6 inches away. I then rotate it along the length of the neck until I get a good compromise between the bass that the sound hole gives and the treble that the strings themselves give. If necessary, I'll then angle it vertically to get more or less of the treble/bass strings. I've been using an Audio Technica ATM31 SDC electret mic, which has a cardioid pattern.