Phil Spector Wall of sound

[walters]

So like Crossfading the channels or tracks together like submixing?
But Bleeding has phase also and distances because mics are on axis
and heights and distances how to recreate this in post production?
Multi-Track bleed through audio tracks how do i do it right ?
So i Control the bleeding of the all the 24 tracks bleeding into one another
i have 24 tracks down right now but i want to be able to bleeding them
all together bleeding is feedbacking and phasing into the next mic it reaches
near first how do i do this please?

 

[corban]

Good sir, please forget about bleeding. It is a bad thing. It is not a mixing technique. It just happens when you record more than one person at a time and other instruments get into one instrument's mic. If you have fifty people recording at the same time in a gorgeous sounding room, then some bleed will happen and it MIGHT sound like the wall of sound, but the important thing there there is that fifty people are recording at the same time. Most of the wall of sound you are looking for was created via careful arrangements, and multi-tracking, and echo chamber. Plus the specific high end recording equipment from the sixties that few people will ever have the privilege of seeing again.

Rather than trying to replicate Spector's sound, maybe consider finding your own sound. Come up with a technique that is yours and make that your specific sound.

 

[tubesrawsom]

1) what is recording?

2) what am i asking?

3) how do i shut me up?

4) how do i do it?

keep asking dumb questions man they rule!!!

 

[ecktronic]

What is generation loss. and this is a serious question by the way!
Is it just when you loose quality by bouncing tracks on analogue tape?

 

[grn]

yes... it's the loss of quality from bouncing tracks on analogue all to one track so you can record more tracks. now we have unlimited tracks theoretically... obviously computers can only do so much now, but still... no need for generation loss to occur. also no need for bleeding or a wall of sound.

walters... that last post you made, made absolutely no sense to me. I have no idea what you're talking about anymore. just try to speak like an average person without getting into the technical jargon of recording and tell us what you're trying to do. do not use the term bleeding.

 

[corban]

I've never seen such a fixation on things that are so obviously not beneficial. I want to get Generation loss in Digital? How do I emulate bleed in post-production? Might as well be asking how do I introduce a lot of noise into my signal? How do I record the rumble of passing airplanes into my guitar tracks? How can I properly ruin my ribbon mics? How do I set fire to my studio, while discontinuing my fire insurance? These are the kinds of questions that have never been asked, and therefore need to be asked.

 

[A Reel Person]

The big paradox of Phil Spector's "Wall of Sound", is that...

he did it all on 3-tracks.

 

[walters]

I bounced on my digital machine recorder and it didn't do any generation
loss what is generation loss is it a filter? the quality how do i re-create
a quality loss in digital? and why does bouncing or making a copy on a
analog tape give generation loss? when i make copys on digital i don't
get generation loss why is that? how do i re-create when i copy my digital
tracks or make copys of my mixdowns it can give me a generation loss like
analog tape does?
Why does analog tape when making a copy give a quality generation loss?
What makes analog tape do this?
So what really is generation loss?

 

[XLR]

When I was a kid (60's) and heard songs that had been Specter'd they sounded fantastic through my AM transistor radio and crap record player. Sounded much fuller, brighter, etc., than most other music. I know I had really bad listening gear but my point is that most people at the time may have listened on systems much worse than the typical listener today, even considering mp3's and earbuds.

So ... I think for many listeners the "sonic needs" (to get a pleasing sound from their listening systems) are pretty different now than when the Wall of Sound came about.

Or is my idea full of sh**?

Tim

 

[A Reel Person]

Okay, picture this:...

Digital recording is like hitting yourself in the head with a rock.

Analog generational loss is like watching a VHS video of yourself hitting your head with a rock.

 

[walters]

Analog generation loss gives that warm very warm sound to it because
the loss of highs and gives the S/N up more noise floor level and loss of
frequencys and adds compression with analog generation loss. When i use
to record on a analog tape deck i use to always use the 5th generation
because it sound more warmer and saturated in the tape

 

[corban]

Yikes. There is no generation loss in digital because there is nowhere to lose anything, unless you're converting back to analog. Digital is all ones and zeros, every time you copy it's just copying the series of ones and zeros.

I think you've hit it there, Tim. Some techniques that were fresh and new and fit the needs at the time no longer serve a useful purpose except as nostalgia.

 

[chessrock]

I bounced on my digital machine recorder and it didn't do any generation
loss what is generation loss is it a filter? the quality how do i re-create
a quality loss in digital? and why does bouncing or making a copy on a
analog tape give generation loss? when i make copys on digital i don't
get generation loss why is that? how do i re-create when i copy my digital
tracks or make copys of my mixdowns it can give me a generation loss like
analog tape does?
Why does analog tape when making a copy give a quality generation loss?
What makes analog tape do this?
So what really is generation loss?

Why do birds ... suddenly appear?
(Every time you are near)

Why do stars fall down from the sky
Every time you walk by?

 

[walters]

Yea i know about how digital is Ones and Zero when you copy
but why does Analog give a generation loss from the tape why ?
What makes the Tape give a generation loss ?
and how to re-create that in digital pro tools?

 

[chessrock]

why does Analog give a generation loss from the tape why ?

Because it's not a perfect recording medium. It will always add a certain amount of noise, and will have other minor imperfections such as wow and flutter ... aside from the fact that it's never going to be an exact reproduction of the sound source.

how to re-create that in digital pro tools?

You can't. Give it up.

 

[corban]

I'm sure there are plug-ins you can use to simulate tape, I've never used them. Then again, I'm not obsessed with doing stupid things.

Or... take your digital signal. Send it to a tape machine. Send it back to your computer. Repeat this five times to get "5th generation." Repeat it ten times if you really want to degenerate your signal. Repeat 100 times if you just want to hear noise on your recordings.

 

[walters]

Well thats what i been doing is sending it out to my tape machine
5 time or 7times for digital to get it to sound more warmer and add
compress and generation loss


But why does tape give a geneation loss when copying ?

 

[corban]

Your question was already answered, here:

Because it's not a perfect recording medium. It will always add a certain amount of noise, and will have other minor imperfections such as wow and flutter ... aside from the fact that it's never going to be an exact reproduction of the sound source.

 

[chessrock]

Well thats what i been doing is sending it out to my tape machine 5 time or 7times for digital to get it to sound more warmer and add
compress and generation loss ...

Walters ... I think I've located the source of your problem.

What you need to do is send it out and back 12 more times. By the 12th generation, you will technically have a "warm" signal.

That's pretty much the way it works.

 

[tubesrawsom]

you need a fresh hot bucket of shit to get tht classic warm sound