"New" Win XP box

[Sky Blue Lou]

So this is a spin-off of the Firewire/USB thread. If you have read that you know the intro The short version is the old box came back to life with a new power supply. XP is up and running, my 2 audio interfaces both work at least on the output side. I have a bunch of mp3s on the box and they play fine. So I fire up Reaper - bought and paid for 10 or more years ago - and get a series of error, fail to load components messages and a final "Reaper encountered a problem and has to close" message and done. There was on older Cubase crack on there previously along with a shitload of plugins, VSTIs and such. Part of the error message chain included "Can't find Cubase blah, blah" or various FX. I tried uninstalling and reinstalling Reaper several times but no joy. So anyway... I'm assuming the registry is fucked up and I'm gonna start over. (I have not given up on bringing my I/O stuff into Win10. Concurrent projects.)

The plan is to disconnect all the old drives, 6 of them ranging from 250 to 800 gb, put one clean reformatted 500 gb in there and load XP fresh. From there I will install the audio I/O units and then the most recent version of Reaper I have and see what happens. If it works I may or may not try loading some of the plug-ins I have on the old HDs. One thing for sure is EZ Drummer - I always liked that.

So call me Don Quixote but other than that whatcha think?

 

[Steenamaroo]

Sounds like a plan to me. No harm in having a fresh install if there's unknown or forgotten history with the old one.
May as well go for an SSD with the prices how they are but it's not essential.

You might find you can just have a browse through the various folders where Reaper is looking for plugins and remove anything you're unsure about
but there's no harm in starting from a fresh install if that's the way you want to go.

If you still have a valid XP key but have trouble with activation, you can still use the telephone service as far as I know.
I used it at some point this year to activate XP on an old netbook.

 

[R D Smith]

+1 for installing an SSD. It's the best bang for the buck to speed up a machine.

 

[TalismanRich]

+2 for the SSD. A TB SSD is around $50-75.

A friend gave me an old computer to wipe the drive after he bought a new one. It sat on a shelf for a couple of years. It was a Dell ordered in 2012 for over $1500. Pentium 4-2.66G with 256MB RAM and 120GB hard drive. I pulled the drive, got an new 500GB SSD, and upped the memory to 1.5GB. I installed XP on it just so that I could play some old games. I had to pull the CD burner, it wouldn't read anything. I had some old CD burners to get it running.

The SSD and extra memory made it a whole different machine. It boots fast, runs without any delays. I spent under $50 in parts. It works great for what I use if for (old games).

I haven't tried putting Reaper on it. Maybe I'll download a copy of V4 and give it a try, not that I'll use it for much in the way of recording, but just as a test.. My license is for V4 and 5 so I can even run it registered.

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

I hear what you guys say about SSDs but I already have 5 or more SATA drives that are perfectly useable and proven with the mobo and chipset I have now. (I'm also saving money in case the other project doesn't work and I am buying newer I/O hardware. I'll buy new everything if it comes to that.)

 

[TalismanRich]

I stuck one of these in the XP machine. It cost less that ordering a pizza!

Teamgroup Vulcan 500GB SSD

 

[Steenamaroo]

Yeah, fair enough. I guess there's no sense complicating things while you're figuring it all out.
The option's always there, though.
XP's still a great operating system and up until a few years ago compatible brand new hardware was still being made.

Of course there are considerations particularly with being online (probably wouldn't bother...) but for a specific purpose like dos/XP era gaming or a studio machine, there's no reason you can't have a fairly modern, very stable, XP build.

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

Of course there are considerations particularly with being online (probably wouldn't bother...) but for a specific purpose like dos/XP era gaming or a studio machine, there's no reason you can't have a fairly modern, very stable, XP build.

That's the goal!

 

[TalismanRich]

Just a bit of good news. While waiting for the towels to finish drying, I downloaded the 32bit version of Reaper 7.01 along with 5.99 and license file. I installed 7.01 and fired it up. Since I don't have any interface, I just used the Windows WAVE driver for audio. Version 7 ran just fine. I threw a file in and it came right up and played. I didn't bother putting on the v5.99 yet.

The crappy Windows sound system was giving an awesome 187ms latency!

You did install the 32bit version, not the X64 version, didn't you? XP need the 32bit version. I'm not sure what would happen if you tried running the x64 version.

The only real issue that I would see with an XP based system is the memory limitation. Isn't XP limited to something like 2GB per process? Its been years since I played with it, but I remember that being one of the improvements that Win7 was supposed to address by going to a 64bit OS.

 

[ecc83]

I think the absolute memory limit for XP32 was 3.5G but it was set at 2G by default and there was a "switch" you needed to find to free up the extra memory. Now, WRT fitting an SSD, that might help the memory issue since they are so fast they could act as a big, fast swap file?

BTW Msft did bring out a 64 bit version of XP but by all accounts it was bloody awful!

Dave.

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

I stuck one of these in the XP machine. It cost less that ordering a pizza!

Teamgroup Vulcan 500GB SSD

Thanks for that. The plan is that if the first part works using the stuff I already have then I will clone everything over to SSD and probably set up a RAID mirror for safety. The mobo can do several RAID variations. Speaking of cloning - what do you guys use? I've used Easeus to do in the past.

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

Just a bit of good news....

You did install the 32bit version, not the X64 version, didn't you?

The only real issue that I would see with an XP based system is the memory limitation.

Very cool.

I don't remember the particulars of version and bits - I will update when I start in. Something happened along the way - I don't know what - but everything worked and I could reliably record 12 tracks simultaneously and play back with FX and misc processing when the band was together prior to 2010. I'll be perfectly happy to get back to that. With maybe a few tweaks... lol.

BTW - Thanks for the input, gents. It is much appreciated and makes the task more like fun!

 

[TalismanRich]

I just used the cloning software that came with my Samsung Evo drive when I upgraded my main system. It was a piece of cake. There's also Clonezilla which is freely available.

How To Clone Your SSD or Hard Drive

Migrate your system to a faster drive using Clonezilla.

www.tomshardware.com

 

[TalismanRich]

I think the absolute memory limit for XP32 was 3.5G but it was set at 2G by default and there was a "switch" you needed to find to free up the extra memory. Now, WRT fitting an SSD, that might help the memory issue since they are so fast they could act as a big, fast swap file?

BTW Msft did bring out a 64 bit version of XP but by all accounts it was bloody awful!

Dave.

The max memory for a 32bit OS is 4GB but yes, MS only allowed 3.5GB to be addressed. At the time, it was a HUGE amount of memory. Today, the average cell phone uses more than that!

Version	Limit on X86	Limit on X64	Limit on IA64
Windows XP	4 GB	128 GB	128 GB (not supported)

In that respect, there are some very real advantages to upgrading to Win 10. It's unlikely that any system with XP will meet the requirements for Win 11 (TrustedProtectionModule 2.0)

Microsoft put limitations on different versions of Win 7, 8 and 10

Version	Limit on X86	Limit on X64
Windows 7 Ultimate	4 GB	192 GB
Windows 7 Enterprise	4 GB	192 GB
Windows 7 Professional	4 GB	192 GB
Windows 7 Home Premium	4 GB	16 GB
Windows 7 Home Basic	4 GB	8 GB
Windows 7 Starter	2 GB	N/A

Version	Limit on X86	Limit on X64
Windows 8 Enterprise	4 GB	512 GB
Windows 8 Professional	4 GB	512 GB
Windows 8	4 GB	128 GB

Version	Limit on X86	Limit on X64
Windows 10 Enterprise	4 GB	6 TB
Windows 10 Education	4 GB	2 TB
Windows 10 Pro for Workstations	4 GB	6 TB
Windows 10 Pro	4 GB	2 TB
Windows 10 Home	4 GB	128 GB

Win 11 has the same specs as Win 10.

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

I will be looking at those things when and if I build a completely new system. (Honestly all this talk is taking me back to my geeky days and making me want to just 'cause...lol. But I digress.)

Here's what I am thinking for the "New XP" project:

The existing box has an Intel mobo with a quad core chip, 4 gb memory, firewire, usb, 5 or 6 SATA channels and 1 IDE. I have the original C drive as disk 0 on the IDE channel. I'm gonna ditch that and put everything on the SATA channels. 1st drive will be OS, drivers and install files. I will put all the Apps - Reaper, VSTis and such on a second drive (In the days of slower drives and less memory that was the hot setup, right?)

Do a custom install of XP with minimal features installed. No internet stuff, games, accessories and lots of other bloat.
Load the I/O drivers and install the hardware (PCI Delta 66 card).
Install Reaper and test.
If everything works add VSTs and stuff one at a time and test.

Am I missing anything here? It's been a long time since I've done any of this stuff.

 

[Steenamaroo]

Yeah, that all sounds good.
You're right - The idea of separating things out on to different drives really goes back to the limitations of mechanical drives.
Not really an issue if/when you go SSD but for now the plan sounds good.
Certainly ditching IDE is a big

I wouldn't worry much about what features are installed. The games and applications that are optional aren't likely to make any big difference,
but there are guides out there on disabling unneeded services, like RDP and that kind of thing.
Again, probably not really essential. Take a look if you're bored or run into problems.

If you're going for a full reinstall you might want to hunt around and try to find something with the latest service packs built into the installer,
rather than trying to upgrade later.
No doubt the various patches and installers are out there, somewhere, but you won't be getting them through windows update.

 

[Steenamaroo]

Thanks for that. The plan is that if the first part works using the stuff I already have then I will clone everything over to SSD and probably set up a RAID mirror for safety. The mobo can do several RAID variations. Speaking of cloning - what do you guys use? I've used Easeus to do in the past.

I've used Macrium reflect without issues on XP/7/10.
I've done a fair bit of cloning over the years for backups, particularly when upgrading OS.
The hardware is still a Q9550 on an old P45 motherboard.

That's pretty old in computer terms but it still does what I need it to do so until there's smoke coming out that's what I'll run!

 

[Pinky]

EaseUS isn't free anymore to do cloning.

Clonezilla is about all I know for free, or the Samsung utility available for use with one of their new SSDs. I personally use older paid versions of Acronis on my system for backups, which can be used for full bare metal recovery and cloning.

I'll second the SSD suggestion, platter drives fail much faster and IMO are a dead tech for all purposes other than backups needing large capacity. I have two NVMe in my primary PC, backing up to a large usb connected platter backup drive. It wouldn't be worth the time to get everything up and running to only have the platter drive decide today is a good day to die. Save that hassle and need for RAID in the near term and just buy a $50 SSD. It's likely the SSD will outlive some other component in a machine so old it's running XP.

 

[Sky Blue Lou]

So the project has taken an interesting turn.

I found a couple XP install discs but no product keys - stickers on the boxes I chucked long ago. No matter - used a key finder to get the key off my existing version. So a cold fresh install failed - got an IRQL error and passed on chasing it. Next step was run an upgrade on the existing install. Worked like a charm, loaded right on there without entering product key or anything. Yay. Stopped dead at activation. Yeah good luck with that - evidently phone activation is discontinued now and that was the end of that (after a 25 minute wait on hold and finally a young Indian lady saying "So sorry. Try a local technician.") Time for Plan B...

I had a couple Win 7 copies (with product keys!) at my shop. (More background - I own a small heating oil delivery biz. 4 trucks, 8 employees and 5 desktops and 4 laptops to keep in line. I've generated quite a computer boneyard over the years but most of it has been binned.) Anyway the XP copies didn't work so maybe Win7. Hell yeah! Fresh install and activation via phone app and let's see if the Delta 66 and Audiofire will install. Well sonuvabitch they did! I are back in business!! I also managed to round up a couple more 2 gb sticks of DDR2 so I was able to take the box from the 4 gig XP limit to the 8 gig limit for the mobo. I also fired up a copy of Reaper off a thumb drive.

So next step is to load a licensed copy of Reaper and then plugins and such. My most recent copy of Reaper is version 2.something so I'll probably just check their site and get a new one. I do not mind paying for that. I still have to try to light up the inputs on the Audiofire and stick a mic in front of an amp but I'm liking my results so far. I don't think I'll bother trying to take this stuff all the way to Win10 just yet but the idea of Linux intrigues me. I've seen lots of mentions in passing and I am no fan of the MS monster. If it will run on and with legacy hardware I may well be a convert.

So here I'm is now. Any comments or suggestions are much appreciated.

 

[Steenamaroo]

That's great to hear.
If Windows 7 works for you then that's cool - Run with that.
If you do want to get XP running, though, the phone activation should still work as far as I know.
It's all automated...you don't actually speak to anyone, although I do recall somehow ending up in the wrong menu myself and talking to a lovely indian chap who was confused as hell.
Second time around I got the right menu and the code I needed.
Might be worth a second go, armed with that knowledge?
If that fails someone did make a keygen this year. You give it the string from the activation page and it returns the string that the phone service would have given you.
It's not a crack/patch/hack - It's a key generator that you can use then delete.

Personally I wouldn't bother with the linux route unless you've got some experience there already.
It's entirely possible to have a perfect linux daw setup - I'm not suggesting otherwise but, believe it or not, windows is a much simpler approach.