New MXL Tube Condenser Mic???...

[kidvybes]

...MXL has just released a new large condenser tube mic labelled the MXL960 Mogami Edition...

http://mxlmics.com/condencer_mic/condenser_index.html

...it's being distributed exclusively by Musicians Friend at an introductory price of $199!...considering the positive responses to MXL's 2 other tube offerings (V77s...a Harvey Gerst fav, and the V69M...well liked on these forums) does anybody have any knowledge/experience with the mic?...it's the only one of the 3 MXL tube mics that doesn't have a transformer...is that a detriment to it's quality and performance?...demoing it in my friends studio showed it to be very smooth and well detailed, kinda like a less hyped V69M...more mellow and fat sounding (more coloration than the really natural sounding V77s)...I know MXL products get a lotta hype on these threads, but I gotta say, this one is really nice for the price...can someone explain the absence of a transformer in a tube design?...MXL's new V-Series mics which are about to be released are non-tube designs that supposedly capture accurately the sound of vintage tubes in a solid state design...hype or good science?...

 

[bleyrad]

can someone explain the absence of a transformer in a tube design?

it means they're probably using the second triode on the tube to do impedance conversion. just another way of doing things, really. probably better in some cases than having a cheap Chinese transformer, but worse than having a good (expensive) transformer

...MXL's new V-Series mics which are about to be released are non-tube designs that supposedly capture accurately the sound of vintage tubes in a solid state design...hype or good science?...

well... what's the electrical difference between "vintage tubes" and "tubes?" tubes are just another way of doing the gain and impedance conversions electrically. to say that all tube designs impart a specific sound is misleading. tubes have different characteristics than solid-state, yes, but it totally depends how they are implemented and what tube you use. how can you copy a generalization? how can you copy the sound of something that doesn't have one specific sound in the first place? it's marketing BS.
anyway, they are probably using a custom FET, which is not exactly uncommon in the mic industry. a FET is similar in design to a tube circuit - it's about as close as you can get without an actual tube. maybe adding a little harmonic distortion for giggles. these kinds of discussions are pretty pointless in terms of predicting how a mic will sound. we just have to wait and see.

 

[OneRoomStudios]

I don't know, but the "Order today, record like a pro!" tagline at the bottom of the MusiciansFriend page for the mics makes me want to hate it....

 

[scrubs]

I don't know, but the "Order today, record like a pro!" tagline at the bottom of the MusiciansFriend page for the mics makes me want to hate it....

Of course the usage of the term "like a pro" rather than "as a pro" relieves them of any false advertising liability.

 

[kragbax]

I don't know, but the "Order today, record like a pro!" tagline at the bottom of the MusiciansFriend page for the mics makes me want to hate it....

It's MF standard fare, saying something dopey on the bottom of their product pages. I don't have this mic, couldn't even find it on the MF site (looked the other day), at least not a Mogami Edition. Doing a search for MXL 960 I found only the regular one - $199 but doesn't mention Mogami at all. Is it the same mic?

I did pick up the V69m - just got it today. And I must say it sounds great - on my voice - to me. I had a AT3035 and the difference was night and day. I also owned a Shure KSM44 but on my voice it wasn't any better then the 3035. The V69 on the other hand just sounds much better. For the $199 I wouldn't mind trying the 960.

-Krag

 

[Flatpicker]

...it's the only one of the 3 MXL tube mics that doesn't have a transformer...

Where'd you get this? The V69 doesn't have a transformer, unless they changed the design since the last time I looked in one, and I doubt the V77 (no longer made) had one either.

I'm sure it's a re-packaged V69. It could have a few tweaks here and there, but probably same board, capsule, etc... The frequency chart and sound difference can be attributed to the different grille design which can do just about anything to the sound. The 960 body and grill is similar to the U47.

 

[Marik]

The 960 body and grill is similar to the U47.

Be carefull here, Tim. Some folks can get it as a U47 clone , if you remember a recent discussion on another forum

 

[Flatpicker]

Be carefull here, Tim. Some folks can get it as a U47 clone , if you remember a recent discussion on another forum

Yep. I tried to avoid that by using the term "similar".

 

[MadAudio]

I don't know, but the "Order today, record like a pro!" tagline at the bottom of the MusiciansFriend page for the mics makes me want to hate it....

Heh! I was looking through the Sweetwater catalog last night when this phrase jumped out at me: "Ultimately the way to judge a mic is by its sound." Really?

 

[Marik]

Yep. I tried to avoid that by using the term "similar".

Ha!!! Haven't you learnt yet, for some folks "similar" means a "clone"

 

[Flatpicker]

Ha!!! Haven't you learnt yet, for some folks "similar" means a "clone"

Oh yeah, I forgot!

"Similar". That's what that other thread you were referring to was about, wasn't it?

BTW, I was only referring to the body and grille. Other than how it might look to the casual observer, that Shanghai capsule has no similarities at all whatsoever!

 

[kidvybes]

Mogami, or not Mogami...that is the question

Kragbax...the 960 is a Mogami Edition (stamped on mic body), much the same as the V69 is...internal wiring and cables...though it sounds a bit different than the V69M...we A/B'd them in my friend's studio...he loves his V69M, but he said he found the 960 abit less hyped than the V69 (or V67 for that matter)...smoother.

Flatpicker...I don't have a V69M to open up (but I will check my friend's next time I'm in the studio) but I do have a V77s and it does have a transformer...I just sent it back to MXL for repair (it was cutting out once heated)...we replaced the tube but that didn't solve the problem...the MXL tech said the transformer might be the issue...
...as far as being a "repackaged V69M", that wouldn't be unusual for MXL, except for the fact that they generally discontinue the former version when re-introducing the new designation...the V69M continues in the product lineup...also, as I stated before, the 2 mics don't sound the same (grill styles are similar but not exact) damn! there's that "similar" word again!...and the pricepoint is $100. lower...

My brief experience with the mic suggests it's another value-priced tube microphone from a company that has had an excellent history of delivering "best-bang-for-the-buck" products...another flavor for the mic closet.

 

[OneArmedScissor]

Kragbax...the 960 is a Mogami Edition (stamped on mic body), much the same as the V69 is...internal wiring and cables...though it sounds a bit different than the V69M...we A/B'd them in my friend's studio...he loves his V69M, but he said he found the 960 abit less hyped than the V69 (or V67 for that matter)...smoother.

Thank you, that is very nice to know. They appear to have been relabeling quite a few mics and selling them through MF for cheaper with not much changed. I was hoping that was the same case here because $200 is quite a deal. I think I'll have to check it out.

Could you please not post in italics, though? It's fine to use a different font, but that is just distracting and weird.

 

[Flatpicker]

...but I do have a V77s and it does have a transformer...

Thanks for the info - I always wondered about that mic. I just always assumed (that word get's me in trouble, too... ) it was transformer-less.

 

[Flatpicker]

...we A/B'd them in my friend's studio...he loves his V69M, but he said he found the 960 abit less hyped than the V69 (or V67 for that matter)...smoother...

Was either one his over-all favorite or did he like them both the same?

 

[kidvybes]

Flatpicker's got a point there...

Here's the link verifying the transformer design in the V77s:

http://www.proaudioreview.com/par/october00/Marshall-Web.shtml

"Internally, the V77 uses a 6072 tube followed by a transformer-balanced output. Wires from the circuit board are soldered directly to the pins of the tube; no socket is used. This cost-cutting measure won't affect microphone performance during the life of the tube, but it will make replacing the 6072 difficult."

OK...I did some more research...the MXL V69M does NOT have a transformer (like the MXL 960)...the only retailer selling the 960 is Musicians Friend, who also does NOT sell the V69M anymore (things adding up now?)...the specs are very similar between both mics as well as the Mogami factor (same tube also)...as Flatpicker pointed out, the difference in the grill and body styles might account for slightly different frequency response...in side by side comparisons, the 960 sounded just a bit less prominant in the high end (more smooth, not hyped)...MXL used to give repackaged mics to Mars Music (the 2003 was repackaged as the V93, for instance)...so he may be right in assuming that MXL is giving MF an exclusive on the repackaged V69M (MXL960)...pretty interesting considering there's a $100. savings on the 960...I'll continue to compare tracks since we use both in the studio and I'll update this thread...in the meantime, I strongly recommend grabbing a 960 now before the price goes up...$199. for a nice (MXL, albeit not Neumann quality) tube mic is still a steal!

 

[Buck62]

Kragbax...the 960 is a Mogami Edition (stamped on mic body), much the same as the V69 is...internal wiring and cables...though it sounds a bit different than the V69M...we A/B'd them in my friend's studio...he loves his V69M, but he said he found the 960 abit less hyped than the V69 (or V67 for that matter)...smoother.

Flatpicker...I don't have a V69M to open up (but I will check my friend's next time I'm in the studio) but I do have a V77s and it does have a transformer...I just sent it back to MXL for repair (it was cutting out once heated)...we replaced the tube but that didn't solve the problem...the MXL tech said the transformer might be the issue...
...as far as being a "repackaged V69M", that wouldn't be unusual for MXL, except for the fact that they generally discontinue the former version when re-introducing the new designation...the V69M continues in the product lineup...also, as I stated before, the 2 mics don't sound the same (grill styles are similar but not exact) damn! there's that "similar" word again!...and the pricepoint is $100. lower...

My brief experience with the mic suggests it's another value-priced tube microphone from a company that has had an excellent history of delivering "best-bang-for-the-buck" products...another flavor for the mic closet.

Dude, that bold comic-sans font has got to go!

I can't read more than one sentence without getting a migraine.

 

[Innovations]

Here is my guess at what is happening. Musician's Friend, the onlide subsidiary of Guitar Center, is purchasing these in containerload quantities and having them shipped directly from the factory to them. That gets you a huge price efficiency that a physical store, with rents, and inventory costs and distribution, and salesperson's commissions, couldn't match. So I imagine that MXL could provide V69Ms direct in containerload quantities at a similar price to MF but the stores would be livid about it. So they change the component mix slightly and give it a different name so that the retailers would not feel pressured to reduce prices to an unprofitable level.

 

[OneArmedScissor]

the only retailer selling the 960 is Musicians Friend, who also does NOT sell the V69M anymore (things adding up now?)

Thanks for changing your font. That's much easier on the eyes.

For some reason, MF doesn't sell any normal MXL mics by themselves anymore. They have a different version of pretty much every one now. That's kind of weird. They obviously have some kind of deal going with eachother, but it is still strange that they would redo every single mic.

 

[whyseye]

I think Innovations has probably hit the nail on the head.