My raw drum clip!

  • Thread starter Thread starter skiz
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skiz

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Hey guys,

up until now ive mainly been using samples instead of the sounds of my actual kit. I want to change that up now and get a bit more knowledge on recording and mixing acoustic drums etc..

I know that one needs to get the BEST raw sound in. my problem is, honestly, im not 100% sure what to look for in a great raw sound! i suppose this comes down to a lot of artificial sounding drums of modern rock recordings.

But any way, here is a clip of my raw drums. No processing was done at all, other than phase reversing a few tracks to make sure everything is in phase. No levels have really been set either, this is just how it came out.

what do you think? what do you like and what could i definitely do without? any tips?

thanks a lot guys!

http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=15388
 
That sounds 100% like a rhythm machine...

I don´t know if you mean that you´re using your drum samples in some kind of midi sequence; but that´s not a real drummer... Sorry, bro.
 
im not quite sure i understand what you mean julian...?

that was me playing the drums. It was a live recording. No midi or anything. Its part of The Hollow by a perfect circle. I know im nowhere near josh freese but it was still me playing my kit. I just want to know if im on the right track to getting good raw sound from my setup..

mayb i didnt really understand your post but being told im "not a real drummer" isnt really cool or what i was hoping for out of this..
 
Skiz, don´t get me wrong... Sorry if i was rude.

What I was trying to say is that that take sounds really quantized... In fact, if you listen to the hihats, there´s absolutly no dynamics... It sounds like a sample to me ears.

Maybe you tweaked the take a little to much?
 
as i said in my OP i have done absolutely no tweaking what so ever to this take other than a couple of phase reversals to make sure everything is in phase.

granted i dont know the song very well and was just messing around to get a bit of recording done to upload, i dont really think it sounds that mechanical..

but thats completely besides the point.. what i was asking here is what do you guys think of the raw SOUND of my drums. Mike technique tuning room placement etc.. not how mechanical i play or anything else really.
 
the sound is nice. i dig it. good playing too. love that song. enjoy playing it aswell.
overall i like the sound. esp if thats completely raw. you could do a lot with it!
 
ok well i dont know if you're trying to take the piss pandamonk but i assure you that was me playing...

must i re-record a new take of something with more dynamics and stuff to prove it?

all i wanted to know is how my drums sound raw! sheesh
 
skiz said:
ok well i dont know if you're trying to take the piss pandamonk but i assure you that was me playing...

must i re-record a new take of something with more dynamics and stuff to prove it?

all i wanted to know is how my drums sound raw! sheesh
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They sound completely fake. It's not just the lack of dynamics. It may be you playing, but if so, i suspect it's a e-drumkit

Post a video of you playing a real kit, with mics, and if it still sounds the same i may be more inclined to believe you, although you could still be using drum replacement software.

Other evidence i may accept is if you post just the overheads.
 
Ok then... Here is the track with JUST the 2 over heads as per your request

http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=15399

I still dont understand how you think its an e-kit.

what the fuck would the point be of me coming on here asking if i am heading in the right direction with my raw sound, and then try trick everyone by actually uploading an e-kit. really wht would i have to gain by doing something like that?

i know that shit in = shit out so im hoping to get the best raw sound to make the rest of the process easier..

Any other information incase you care:

Im playing on a gretsch catalina birch kit, 2 marshal MXL 604 overheads - spaced pair, audix I-5's on the snare top, rack tom and floor tom. Shure beta52 on the kick. some sennheiser vocal mic for the snare bottom cause its the only other mic i have. I have 2 crash cymbals, Sabian B8 pieces of shit, My hi hats are zildjian A new beat 14'' and my ride cymbal is a Sabian Metal-X ride. This all runs into my Firepod and into Cubase SX 3.

i still think this is the dumbest thing ive ever had to prove to some one...
 
Man, what do you want me to say?

Those snare triplets sound (TO ME) really quantized...
The overheads prove nothing to me.

If that´s you playing, don´t take it personal; I just wanted to let you know what I thought.

The kit sounds good, with some compression it would make a nice drum track!
 
julian i know exactly what you mean and exactly what part of the track you're talking about

but if you listen to the original song by A Perfect Circle, that is exactly how josh freese plays them. I guess mayb it doesnt make much sense out of context but if you listen to the track its intentional.. So yes the triplets were meant to be like that. (its right around the part where the vocals go "time to bring the fire down... bridel all this indescresion...)

i know you're not insulting me or anything i just dont understand why i have to argue with someone like pandamonk thats its not an e-kit..

Using an e-kit would just be completely stupid because im trying to learn how to accurately capture an acoustic kit well in my home studio..
 
skiz said:
Ok then... Here is the track with JUST the 2 over heads as per your request

http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=15399

I still dont understand how you think its an e-kit.

what the fuck would the point be of me coming on here asking if i am heading in the right direction with my raw sound, and then try trick everyone by actually uploading an e-kit. really wht would i have to gain by doing something like that?

i know that shit in = shit out so im hoping to get the best raw sound to make the rest of the process easier..

Any other information incase you care:

Im playing on a gretsch catalina birch kit, 2 marshal MXL 604 overheads - spaced pair, audix I-5's on the snare top, rack tom and floor tom. Shure beta52 on the kick. some sennheiser vocal mic for the snare bottom cause its the only other mic i have. I have 2 crash cymbals, Sabian B8 pieces of shit, My hi hats are zildjian A new beat 14'' and my ride cymbal is a Sabian Metal-X ride. This all runs into my Firepod and into Cubase SX 3.

i still think this is the dumbest thing ive ever had to prove to some one...
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I apologize.

The snare, especially on the triplets, does sound really fake though. I say that because a snare fill/roll sounds completely different to a repeated sample snare and yours sounds like the sample snare.

Also your hihats and cymbals sound really like midi cymbals, especially the way they are panned(hats and 1st crash almost completely in left, and 2nd crash almost completely right).

The kick sounds just like a midi kick, and toms just like midi toms.

Sorry, it just sounds fake to me. Even the overheads don't sound real, although midi drums don't have "overheads".

You snare seems panned very slightly left in the overheads. I though I noticed that in the original, but blamed it on my pc speakers in a shitty room. But I can hear it more clearly in the OHs.

Sorry again, and I hope I hadn't offended. :o
 
skiz said:
i know you're not insulting me or anything i just dont understand why i have to argue with someone like pandamonk thats its not an e-kit..

Using an e-kit would just be completely stupid because im trying to learn how to accurately capture an acoustic kit well in my home studio..
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I wasn't trying to cause an argument, i just thought you were some idiot trying to catch us out. People do that when comparing mics, preamps, etc. So i thought you might have been the same.

Sorry :o
 
i agree that the crashes sound sort of midi but imo thats just because they are B8's and dont sound like nice crashes.. they do kind of almost sound like the crashes you get on a keyboard.

as to the hi hat and small crash being completely left and the other completely right all i can say is that i used a very wide spaced pair set up. The last time i recorded live drums i used the recorder man set up and some one told me that my overheads almost sounded mono because there was not enough separation. So i tried splitting them far apart this time. Ill have to tweak them to get my snare sitting in the middle i guess

do you think perhaps my toms sound too fake because i mic'd them too far from the skin? cause i tried to mic a bit further off the skin than i used to. or is it the same in the overheads and possibly just the way they've been tuned?

no worries tho, just wanna get some advice on what i should try work on before i actually start laying down the tracks that im going to keep.
 
you can use the recorderman method and get a wider stereo image without being too wide.

you can angle the mics slightly and still have the snare and kick in the center of the stereo image, but end up with a wider cymbal sound.

also, you don't have to pan your overheads hard left and right.

I sometimes get in a hurry during sessions and just use a spaced pair instead of spending the time (and it can take a while) getting the kick and snare in the center with the R.M. method while still getting a wide'ish stereo image of the cymbals.

I always end up regretting it. I hate when the snare has more weight on one side than the other.

if you're going to use a spaced pair though, you can just raise the hat side mic so that the snare is quieter and hopefully closer to the volume it is in the ride side overhead.

The drums sound good though. It seems like with the right eq and compression you could have a pretty dang good drum recording.

I agree that the snare roll does sound drum machine like though.
 
skiz said:
i agree that the crashes sound sort of midi but imo thats just because they are B8's and dont sound like nice crashes.. they do kind of almost sound like the crashes you get on a keyboard.

as to the hi hat and small crash being completely left and the other completely right all i can say is that i used a very wide spaced pair set up. The last time i recorded live drums i used the recorder man set up and some one told me that my overheads almost sounded mono because there was not enough separation. So i tried splitting them far apart this time. Ill have to tweak them to get my snare sitting in the middle i guess

do you think perhaps my toms sound too fake because i mic'd them too far from the skin? cause i tried to mic a bit further off the skin than i used to. or is it the same in the overheads and possibly just the way they've been tuned?

no worries tho, just wanna get some advice on what i should try work on before i actually start laying down the tracks that im going to keep.
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The toms might only have sounded fake to me 'cause i expected them to after hearing the rest. Listening back, they don't sound terrible, just quite dull. The kick also sounds quite dead to me(too much in it).

Is the small crash a 14"? Sounds quite nasty. I have 14" and 15" crashes and feel they sound fuller and larger than that. The other crash is decent though.

When did you last change your heads? In fact, what heads do you have on your drums? Are they really dampened?
 
skiz said:
do you think perhaps my toms sound too fake because i mic'd them too far from the skin? cause i tried to mic a bit further off the skin than i used to. or is it the same in the overheads and possibly just the way they've been tuned?

no worries tho, just wanna get some advice on what i should try work on before i actually start laying down the tracks that im going to keep.
Click to expand...

I think it's the tom tuning, but in a mix with guitars (especially heavy distorted guitars), bass and vocals those toms will probably sound good.

When the other instruments are there, you'll lose some of that triggered sound that the snare seems to have too.
 
donkeystyle said:
I think it's the tom tuning, but in a mix with guitars (especially heavy distorted guitars), bass and vocals those toms will probably sound good.

When the other instruments are there, you'll lose some of that triggered sound that the snare seems to have too.
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I agree :D
 
yeah the smaller crash is a 14'' hey. hate playing them after playing my zildjian A customs... only problem is i got the A customs before developing a better cymbal technique and they are PROPER fucked... so i have to make do with what i have :( want to get istanbuls tho..

yeah the kick is stuffed with a pretty big pillow. Perhaps i should take that out and put a thinner one in? mayb have it barely touching the batter?

Admittedly my skins are a little old but not dead. Im using remo emperor for batter and remo ambassador for reso. Perhaps tuning them a little tighter will liven them up?

thanks for the comments guys, really appreciate it.

i am pretty keen on using a spaced pare donkey, perhaps i should move them a little closer in? im not very good at balancing snare =[ not quite sure why. probably due to my less than ideal monitoring situation
 
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