Mono Mix (further understanding)

M

mactreouser

New member
Hi,
* Should I Mix in MONO at first?
* Stereo Effects Plugins should apply during Mono Mix (if Mono Mix should be the first stage) or during Stereo Mode?
 
Don't get confused by what you see in you DAW as stereo tracks.
DAWs for some STUPID reason by default record everything to a "stereo" track....but guess what, it's NOT a stereo track, it's actual dual mono.
If you send one mic signal to a DAW track, that's a mono track, even if what you see looks like a "stereo" track.

OK...that out of the way...
Let's assume you have 4 tracks....guitar, bass vocals...and an actual real stereo L/R drum track (like a drum track done with just a stereo pair of OH mics).

You want to leave the stereo drum track panned center....but the other three you pan where you want them.
Lets say...vocal center, guitar left and bass right.
That's a stereo mix.

If you did a mono mix...everything would end up in the center.

So with that in mind...you decide if you want do mix in stereo, which is the norm...or mono.
Makes sense...?
 
I assume what you are really asking is should you mix in mono first to get levels and EQ correct. Some people do that, then pan everything after. Others do the panning at the initial mixing stage. Some people check their mixes in mono, others don't. Whatever works for you
 
If you can get everything clear & distinct whilst working in mono, you will be AMAZED at the separation you get by the time you do pan things out
 
Jonesey9 said:
If you can get everything clear & distinct whilst working in mono, you will be AMAZED at the separation you get by the time you do pan things out
Click to expand...

That's an oversimplification. It's quite possible to have a good mix in mono that changes in unwanted ways when panned. If you have phase discrepancies in your overheads, for instance, you could get a tone you like in mono that, when panned, changes to something you don't like.
 
Mixing in mono is just a workflow device that helps some people create a good mix. You will have to try it to see if you are one of those people.

Personally, it doesn't work for me. But the styles of music I mix and my mixing style doesnt lend itself to this sort of thing.
 
miroslav said:
Don't get confused by what you see in you DAW as stereo tracks.
DAWs for some STUPID reason by default record everything to a "stereo" track....but guess what, it's NOT a stereo track, it's actual dual mono.
If you send one mic signal to a DAW track, that's a mono track, even if what you see looks like a "stereo" track.
Click to expand...

Well , maybe some do, but t least Reaper doesn't. If you record a mono track, it looks like a mono track.
 
Jonesey9 said:
If you can get everything clear & distinct whilst working in mono, you will be AMAZED at the separation you get by the time you do pan things out
Click to expand...

That 'amazement' is just a consequence of changing modes. It's nothing special in its own right. It's a bit like wearing a blindfold, then taking it off . . . wow.

Personally, I never mix in mono. I mix with my stereo landscape in mind . . . the 'virtual stage' on which I place my musicians. Sometimes I check a mono mix. Most of the time I don't.
 
Funny. In an interview with CLA, he talks about only mixing in stereo, never mono. Something about 'we're living in the 21st century'.
:D

However. I'll periodically check stuff in mono. Just gives you a different reference.

In Protools (and probably other daws),
All mixes start out in mono. Pan pots are by default at 12 o'clock. Set levels then start panning to taste.
Whatever works for you is good.
:D
 
gecko zzed said:
Well , maybe some do, but t least Reaper doesn't. If you record a mono track, it looks like a mono track.
Click to expand...

They all look like a mono tracks if you select mono when setting up to record the tracks...but there are DAWs where the default is set to stereo, and you have to choose mono...and I think many people just leave it, thinking that way they are recording "stereo" tracks.

gecko zzed said:
Personally, I never mix in mono. I mix with my stereo landscape in mind . . . the 'virtual stage' on which I place my musicians. Sometimes I check a mono mix. Most of the time I don't.
Click to expand...

Yeah...me too.
I never found anything special about setting up your mix in mono...and then fanning out to stereo. Whenever I've tried that based on some folks "amazement"...it was always a PITA, because I then had to go back to every track and make adjustments for the stereo mix, so I don't see how your tracks can just stay as they are from the mono mix when panning out to stereo.

Sure, you might get a different perspective, but it's really not as simple as mix in mono, pan to stereo, done.
 
I'm with (Jonesey?).

If you can get everything sounding decent in mono, you're going to be golden. How many times have you heard recordings that sound great in stereo and then in mono, the guitars disappear?

Not that people are probably going to listen in mono -- That said, mixes that sound good in mono arguably just sound better when the elements are panned out.

Now, you're not going to get rid of all cancellation -- "stereo" after all, is the difference between left and right. But if sounds "play together well" in mono, they *will* play together well in stereo. The opposite is not necessarily (even remotely in many cases) true.
 
I have found mono works well for setting the balance, but like everyone is saying it's not that important anymore, it's just a tool for helping you hear issues, and you don't necessarily need an auratone or mixcube either, I just sum it to mono and listen on one speaker, the 'grot box' speakers really aren't something I like listening on, they just aren't accurate at all, it's a dated technique nowadays, I tried it and it didn't work for me at all, so I sold my mixcube to return to my usual neumann kh120a stereo setup, it is all I need.
 
mactreouser said:
Jonesey,
That's what I heard about! Is this means, do all MIX in MONO before PAN and Effects?
Click to expand...
How can you even start to mix without all of the elements - including your stereo effects - present?

I usually end up with most of my pans roughed in and any stereo effects set up by the end of tracking cause I'm mixing along the way. Then I will often click the mono button on Reaper's master track and work like that for most of the "hard labor" portion of the process. Usually when I switch it back to stereo it just sounds wider, but very occasionally I'll end up tweaking something.

The idea that mono-comparability is unnecessary today is a fallacy. It's not about a single speaker on an AM radio anymore, but there are a lot of those single-speaker Bluetooth things out there, and the stereo ones are so small that only a mouse could get the real stereo image. In fact, whatever system might be in a room, it's extremely rare for any of your listeners to actually be parked right in the sweet spot. Things collapse to mono fast as you back away from the speakers, or even just sit perpendicular to the speakers. The only folks you can count on to get anywhere near a decent stereo image are the earbud kids. And half of them don't actually wear both buds at the same time very often. But mixing for headphones/earbuds requires a bit more consideration than mixing for speakers...
 
Simple reality...there are dozens and dozens of playback systems/options available to listeners.
The notion that mixing in mono and panning in stereo is going to help satisfy all of them is the fallacy.

Mix for what you hear, how you hear it and how you want to hear it...on the best monitoring system you can put together, in the best possible space that you have for that purpose...
...and leave the rest to the listeners.

Worrying how some guy with one ear bud in and the other hanging out of his ears is going to hear your mix...is a total waste of time, IMO....it's like worrying if you mix will sound as good to the driver as it will to the passenger sitting in the back seat on the right side.

I mean...what tails do you want to chase? :)

Think about your production goals...not what possible playback scenarios are out there that you have to plan for.
 
Mono does help BUT, in Reaper, you have to either ensure plug ins are mono or adjust them to mono or turn them off.
Clicking the mono button on the master buss doesn't turn everything to mono.
I like mixing in mono - to a final mono product so I enjoy mixing in mono prior to panning for a stereo end result.
it depends, as said, on work flow, preferences and your ears. As my ears aren't great I find that mono is the way to go for me.
 
rayc said:
Clicking the mono button on the master buss doesn't turn everything to mono.
Click to expand...
???
It sums the L and R channel and spits that mix out on both. Assuming you're actually monitoring through the Master, it works just fine.
 
rayc said:
...in Reaper, you have to either ensure plug ins are mono or adjust them to mono or turn them off.
Clicking the mono button on the master buss doesn't turn everything to mono.
Click to expand...

Hmm...that's a bit odd....?

If all the tracks and FX buses are being mixed down through the master buss...why doesn't the master bus Mono switch affect everything going through it?
How do the FX come out in stereo through the master bus when it's set to Mono...?
IOW...where are the FX going trhough in order to remain in stereo...?

In my DAW, the master buss Mono switch makes everything mono that is going through it.
 
I'm just telling you what I found. Everything was mono except stereo VSTFX. I've done it many times and the result was the same whether it was a dedicated mono mix or a mono stage in mixing.
 
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