Monitor Headphones???

[Robertt8]

Howdy!

Here's the situation...I'm in a small appartment (with a roommate) I really can't have monitor speakers blasting...not to mention I can't afford them. What do you folks think about the monitor headphones that are on the market? Is somthing that would be a suitable substitute for me?

Thanks!

 

[atomictoyz]

Sony MDR 7506....AKG 270's are good for Apt usage. I had to use headphones for along time while living in an apartment. These are affordable..

Peace,
Dennis

 

[LooneyTunez]

This subject has been covered in a lot of other threads, so a search will yield some answers for you.

Generally speaking, headphones only work well for checking things that aren't as obvious in monitors, and should never be used as a substitute for monitors. You would end up with mixes that contain too much reverb and other effects, bass will end up being either too weak or too strong depending on the phones, vocals won't sit right in the mix, etc.

Like I said, do a search and I think you'll even find some examples of mixes done on headphones, and the poor results achieved by this.

 

[VOXVENDOR]

If you have to "Blast" a mix to mix it, your doing it all wrong...

I have lived in an apartment, and I also currently own a studio... I NEVER mix at a level that would be considered "blasting"... even when I was in my apartment...

Headphones are good for Joggers, Monitoring while tracking, Helicopter pilots, Checking panning placements (sometimes, but it is exagerated) and Keith Moon

Don't mix with them.. EVER!...

 

[zip]

I agree...

Other than maybe checking panning...

The so called "magic level" for mixing is about 80 to 85dB or so. This is not as loud as you think but remember - even 85dB can damage hearing over extended periods.

Some of the best in the biz... (Massenburg for one) mixes at 50 to 60dB for most of the work. But them again...he's GOOD.

The only time I ever go above 85dB is to quickly check the low end for boominess...

Go out to Radio Shack and spend $30 on a dB meter. You'll be glad you did! I found out I was mixing at 100dB! WAY...WAY TOO LOUD.

So I agree w/ Vox. Get some monitors and check your dB levels.

zip >>

 

[Cyrokk]

Another benefit of mixing at low volume is that it helps in minimizing the acoustical effects of the room you're listening in. Mix low, and only bump up to a louder volume towards the end of your session to ensure the proper amount of bass is utilized.

Cy

 

[Robertt8]

Okay, I get that I shouldn't use headphones to mix. I know that this has been brought up (probably) a million times, but out of this list....

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7...48782520/g=home/search?c=4072&sc=price&so=asc

...what do think think that I could get off there (for example) for under $300 that might to a decent job.

Also, why don't they bother making a pair of headphones with the same qualities as studio monitors. It seems that if they can do it for the big speakers they should be able to pull it off with the head phones.

Thanks!

 

[VOXVENDOR]

Well, Headphones aren't in front of you like normal speakers.... They are essentially beside you...

Very hard to get an accurate listen of how the music will translate into regular speakers....

Being so close to your head, the bass is exaggerated, the panning is exagerated...

I don't care if it's a $14,000 pair...And they have ,
"S T U D I O M O N I T O R S" printed on the box...

Headphones should never be used for mixing..

Joe

 

[zip]

Robert...

The best advice anyone here will give is to go listen to them yourself. Keep a few things in mind. True reference monitors have a flat frequency response by design...they will sound different than what you are used to.

THERE IS AN ADJUSTMENT PERIOD with whatever you buy. Listen to a ton of good reference CD's through them to get the feel of a good mix.

The smaller the monitor the harder it will be to get the low end right. Off that list I have the Event PS5's and I love them - but I really have to listen to the low end because of the 5.25" woofer.

Off that list I would consider the Event PS5, Event PS6 the JBL25P and the Yamaha MSP5. Look close at the prices..MONITOR means 1...you'll need two. Go to a shop and take a listen.

Another you way want to consider is the Behringer Truth. $400 a pair but they do have a nice big 8" woofer and they are modeled after the Mackie 824's.

All the monitors above are ACTIVE. This is my preference because you don't have to purchase a separate amp...and a few other reasons.

So - IMHO...save up $400 and buy the truths or the PS5's. Unless you want to spend more then there are more options...

Good luck,

zip >>

 

[sibleypeck]

Robertt8,
If you are dead-set on getting reference headphones for mixing, I recommend Beyer DT770 Pro (closed) or DT990 Pro (open), which you can get from Full Compass (www.fullcompass.com) for $140. I was dead-set on reference headphones myself, but the many reviews on this forum and elsewhere convinced me I was chasing a phantom. Please reconsider.
What VOXVENDOR and the others tell you is TRUE. If you research it thouroughly, you will find this out. The reason it is hard to accept is because there is so much more to mixing than at first one can imagine. Listen to some of VOX's mixes for a testament to his knowledge and ability.
I wanted to avoid using monitors due to limited space. I overcame this by placing the monitors on the floor, facing up, on small stands on either side of my chair.
If your concern is disturbing your neighbors, there may be no immediate solution.

 

[sibleypeck]

One thing I forgot to mention: The Beyers are 600-Ohm phones. I may be wrong, but I think you will need an amp of some sort to drive them to sufficient listening level.

 

[LooneyTunez]

Actually, a 600ohm load is pretty easy to drive for most headphone amps. You start needing beefier amps when you start driving loads like 24ohms (like the Sony 7506).

 

[Erland]

Currently trying to learn about this

I have been using headphones all along. Now I know! Time I learned more about Monitors

 

[sibleypeck]

LooneyTunez,

Did you mean to say 240 Ohms?

 

[Robertt8]

fostex PS-3.1?

I'm not worried about mixing at volumes too high. I think I just don't want to subject him to hearing the same damn song over and over and over.

Anyway...do you guys have any opinion of the fostex PS-3.1?

here's a link in case you don't know...

now this I might be able to afford.

 

[LooneyTunez]

Did you mean to say 240 Ohms?

No, I meant 24 ohms. The lower the impedance, the more current it draws. Just like with speakers (which is what headphones are), a 4 ohm speaker draws more current than an 8 ohm one.

 

[sibleypeck]

LooneyTunez,

The speaker that draws more current should sound louder, shouldn't it?
And, if a 4-Ohm speaker draws more current than an 8-Ohm one, it stands to reason that a 600-Ohm speaker draws less current than a 24-Ohm one.
So, why does a 24-Ohm set of headphones require a beefier amp than does a 600-Ohm set in order to make them sound as loud?

 

[sibleypeck]

Does anybody know the answer?

 

[zip]

Yeah...

Don't bother with headphones....

 

[Phloodpants]

not necessarily...

All else being equal, a 24 ohm headphone will be louder than a 600 ohm.

Assuming constant voltage, as impedence goes down, current draw goes up. Power in Watts = Volts x Amps, so you can see how that works.

But, and this is a BIG BUT, efficiency varies wildly with headphones, so the 600 ohm phones may very well play just as loudly as the 24 ohm'ers...

In fact, I think some manufacturers intentionally make their phones rather high impedence so as to sound good on the cheap-ass headphone amps that are found in most equipment these days. A cheap amp has trouble pushing any current, so a high impedence phone is friendlier.

The headphone amps in most gear these days are really horrible! They won't even spend 79 cents making it halfway decent! Don't even get me started on this topic!!