Mics for acoustic guitars and vocals....

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Johnny Blaze

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Ok, so I need two microphones. Both condensor, or one condensor one ribbon, whatever. Combination has to be under $2k or like just above it ($2,100US). I need one that is fantastic for vocals, and that can be used on acoustic guitars and stringed instruments (cello, etc.), and I need one that is basically the "king" of acoustic guitar mic'ing...also needs to be able to be used on cellos and whatnot. I was thinking of a combination like...

Neumann TLM103
Royer R-121 ribbon

No? I plan on running both on any acoustic guitar I will be recording, both at once on the same guitar. Both going into a FMR Really Nice Compressor, and into a Digi002R. Input please. Thanks.

JBlaze
 
Johnny Blaze said:
Ok, so I need two microphones. Both condensor, or one condensor one ribbon, whatever. Combination has to be under $2k or like just above it ($2,100US). I need one that is fantastic for vocals, and that can be used on acoustic guitars and stringed instruments (cello, etc.), and I need one that is basically the "king" of acoustic guitar mic'ing...also needs to be able to be used on cellos and whatnot. I was thinking of a combination like...

Neumann TLM103
Royer R-121 ribbon

No? I plan on running both on any acoustic guitar I will be recording, both at once on the same guitar. Both going into a FMR Really Nice Compressor, and into a Digi002R. Input please. Thanks.

JBlaze
Click to expand...

It's hard to make suggestions without knowing how your voice sounds, the stytles of music you will be recording, and several other factors. Just to take a stab, though, here's some thoughts:

1) Microtech Gefell M930 and Schoeps CMC6/MK4
2) Soundelux U195 and pair Josephson C42
 
I agree that we will not be able to give you "fail-safe" recommendations that are guaranteed to be perfect for you.

My favorite guitar mic(s) are a pair of Schoeps CMC6 bodies with MK4 capsules. A pair used will be around $1500-$2000, about $2500 new. Maybe you could just do with one for about $800-$1000.

Right now my favorite vocal mic is a Lawson L47MP mkII, but those Soundelux mics are pretty dang awesome. Also the U87 gets a bad rap but it definitely doesn't suck and you could probably get a used one in good condition for about $1300 or so. All that might be a tad over your budget, but I think you could do some shopping for used stuff and come in somewhere around $2k or so.
 
Speaking of used, Tidepool Audio has a used MG M295 (one of the finest acoustic guitar mics on the planet) and a used UM92s (an incredible vocal mic, great on ac. gtr too).

I've purchased gear from Tom at Tidepool in the past. Straight shooter.

tidepoolaudio.com
 
For some unknown reason now, thinking about the MXL 603s and 960 just loses a bit of excitment when I looked at those Gefell mics. Hmmm, spending $300 on three mics or $2000 on two mics. Well, if I had $2000 to spend on mics, this would be a no brainer. Oh, how I wish I didn't have all of my money tied up in our properties.

Then again, who in the world would be able to show me how to use these properly? How could I get into a properly designed home studio? What about the rest of my chain?

So, it wouldn't just be the cost of the mics. I guess it would be a lot more. Ok, the MXL's aren't looking so bad again.

Whew!

Regards,
Mark
 
I don't know that a Royer R-121 would be anyone's first choice for acoustic guitar or vocals, or second choice, or even third, I could be wrong though. You really didn't specify what type of music this will be for. My answer would vary widely based on the type of music. Rock: maybe an AKG C451 and top-end tube LDC. Solo acoustic or some style where the acoustic guitar is THE focus instrument...sdelsolray's suggestion of either the Schoeps or the Josephsons would be great.

Also, you didn't mention anything about pres. Are you using the pres on the Digi 002? If so you may want to consider spending some money on a pre and the rest on one or two mics. These "what should I buy" questions pop up all the time, and there's nothing wrong with that, but usually someone says hey what about you're preamps (with good reason) and this time that someone is me. Good luck in your search.
 
Well, the music is all instrumental. The vocals that we have are just sung melodies, no lyrics. The music is very.....majestic sounding. The guitars do a lot of strumming and fingerpicking intertwined all the time. The guitars by themself have a folk-ish sound to the style every once in a while. If that helps.

For my pre, it is a toss-up between an EarthWorks 1022 zero distortion 2-channel pre, or an Avalon AD2022 2-channel tube pre....or possibly an Avalon vt737-sp since it has compression on it and all that. I keep getting the Soundelux U195 suggestion so I will check that out. Any other ideas?

JBlaze
 
Johnny Blaze said:
Well, the music is all instrumental. The vocals that we have are just sung melodies, no lyrics. The music is very.....majestic sounding. The guitars do a lot of strumming and fingerpicking intertwined all the time. The guitars by themself have a folk-ish sound to the style every once in a while. If that helps.

For my pre, it is a toss-up between an EarthWorks 1022 zero distortion 2-channel pre, or an Avalon AD2022 2-channel tube pre....or possibly an Avalon vt737-sp since it has compression on it and all that. I keep getting the Soundelux U195 suggestion so I will check that out. Any other ideas?

JBlaze
Click to expand...

For "majestic" sounding music, you might want to consider a preamp that is more euphonic and hi-fi yet fairly uncolored. Coupled with accurate mics, you'd be in for a treat. I use a Pendulum Audio MDP-1a pre with Schoeps CMC6/MK4 mics for solo acoustic guitar. It's a stunning combination, worthy of consideration.
 
Ok I found the Pendulum Audio MDP-1 mic pre, looks good. Price is about the same as the AD2022 that I was thinking about. But I can't find a dealer online for Schoepp microphones, or even the company site. Any ideas?

JBlaze
 
Ok, I found a matched pair of Josephson C42 FET mics for $950 from Mercenary Audio. So I guess that and the Neumann TLM103? That would give me (essentially) three nice condensors. Of course having a matched pair would be outstanding for use on acoustic guitars. I'm sold. The matched Josephsons are in. SO TLM103 or what for the other one? Remember, I want to have it for vocals mainly but I want to also use it for guitars as well. Something open, flat, but a great "warm" sound. Ideas?

JBlaze
 
Johnny, in your search I would take the TL 103 off your list. For a "great, warm" sound that works equally well on vox and acoustic gtr, there are some excellent mics. The Peluso 2247 and ADK TT and CE - all off which are multi-pattern tube mics.

I'd also put an AEA R84 on your list to consider. The R-121 is a great mic for amps and drum apps. IMO, the R84 is a better mic for general use and acoustic instruments.

The "king" of SDC mics for acoustic gtr, IMO, would be the Schoeps CMC64 if you want natural and neutral - or the Microtech Gefell M295 if you want a bit of color with that famous Neumann "sheen". For "folkish" style the Schoeps are it. Would recommend the John Hardy M-1 mic preamp with the Schoeps.

I can't find a dealer online for Schoepp microphones, or even the company site.

http://www.schoeps.de/E-2004/navigator.html

Sound Pure is a Schoeps dealer.
 
Big Kenny said:
I use a Brauner Phantom C with excellent results. Gefell 930 gets great press. That Soundelux is a treat too. What about one of those Pelusos?
Click to expand...
You seem to own a lot of cool gear! But what else would I expect from a man who shares his initials with a fast food chain? :confused?
 
I think I will settle on the Pendulum Audio MDP-1 pre, looks great. For mics, I found a matched pair of Josephson C42 small diaphragm fet condensors for a great price, and I suppose my other mic will be a Soundelux U195. Comments?

JBlaze
 
I presently have a client in doing acoustic and vocals and we're using a pair of e22S mics on the guitar and a U195 for vocal. I'll post a clip if you're interested. I have no experience with the C42 for acoustic but maybe someone can speak to differences between the e22S and C42.

-kp-
 
Yeah please post it, I'm curious to hear it. What brand is the e22s? I have heard the U195 and I'm pretty much set on it being my vocal mic. Thanks.

JBlaze
 
Johnny Blaze said:
I think I will settle on the Pendulum Audio MDP-1 pre, looks great. For mics, I found a matched pair of Josephson C42 small diaphragm fet condensors for a great price, and I suppose my other mic will be a Soundelux U195. Comments?

JBlaze
Click to expand...

You can't go wrong with the Pendulum. Talk to Greg, the owner and designer. You need to decide on the MDP-1a, -1b or -1c, which al vary depending on the input transformer.

The Josephson C42 pair and Soundeux U195 are great mics. The C42s are creamy and pleasant. The U195 is wonderful too. Keep in mind that both of these mics have a HF rise. You might want to give Dot a call about the newer Peluso small diaphragm mics. A more flat response, plus interchangeable capsules. Likely more neutral from what I've read.

Good choices. Let us know what you actually get, as well as your thoughts on how it sounds.
 
Johnny Blaze said:
Yeah please post it, I'm curious to hear it. What brand is the e22s? I have heard the U195 and I'm pretty much set on it being my vocal mic.
Click to expand...
the e22S is a Josephson, just like C42. the e22S is a side addressed SDC. since I have never worked with a C42 I can't compare, but I would think the C42 and e22S are similar. that's the reason for my reply and I'm using a U195 for this guy... who sounds a lot like Ian Anderson of Jethro Tull. I'll post a clip today...
 
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Taking Leap of Faith

Well, I haven't recorded anything...ever. But, I'm putting together my own "studio" to record the songs I've written. The mics are for VOX and ACT GTR. After reading just about as much as humanly possible and talking with A LOT of people, I decided to go with the Peluso mics.

I have no idea when I'll be skilled enough to actually post a link to a sample, but I'll figure it out sooner than later if all goes well and I get a little help from the folks around here.

The benefit will be more for home recording idiots such as myself who don't have an actual studio. My recording will be done in a simple room. I'm hoping that I don't have to put in any acoutic treatments because the House Boss would change the locks. So, either my recording will sound good in a plain room, or it won't. No epiphany for anyone I'm sure, and I know noone will spend sleepless nights waiting for a few samples. But, I'll share them as soon as I can.

Regards,
Mark
 
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