Marshall or Nady?

[MASTON]

Hi, this what I've got:
AMD 400, Soundblaster 1024, Cakewalk 9, ART MP Dual tube pre-amp, classical guitar, my voice.

This is what I want to do:
Record a bunch of songs I've written with the gear I've got. I'll be recording primarily vocals and classical guitar to begin with (and MIDI piano, african drums, electric guitar, bass guitar later on somewhere down the line)

This is what I need:
A decent condenser mic for as cheap a price as possible that'll record BOTH decent vocals and guitar.

After some research I've got it down to these three mics:
Marshall V67 £140 ($200)
Marshall MXL-603 £65 ($99) ?!?!?!
Nady SCM 1000 £100 ($150)
(I don't want an Octava 'cos I can't take a chance with Quality control)

This' what I know:
I haven't heard a single bad thing about the V67, Harvey Gerst (see http://members.tripod.com/~Jitteringjim/page4.html) picked it out as the best deal in the Marshall range, and eveyone on homerecording.com raves about it.
He also recommends the MXL-603 as very good and a great buy. Now this I don't understand. How can this only be $100 ?!?, I mean why isn't everyone snapping them up.
The Nady SCM-1000 also comes highly recommended by Lunkhead, though I haven't seen anyone else be quite so enthusiastic about it. Anyone out there got anything to say on the Nady.

What else? I want to keep the noise levels down as I'll be recording some quiet tracks (The Marshall is apparently very quiet) and I'd like a full warm sound. I have no experience of mics so I don't really know what I'm on with, is there a big sound difference between a small and large condenser ?

OK, that's about it.

Cheers

 

[Wallycleaver]

Nady makes wireless, marshall makes amps, not mic's. There is a slew of mics made in the same factory in china that a bunch of companies are slaping thier name on them. I'd go for a Rode nt 3. $150 I think, literally bitch slaps the nady and marshall mics. Also I hear the Apex mics are good, you'd have to check with the green hornet, but I think they are in the same price range. By save up a few more (insert your favorite currency here), you can get gear thats many times better!

 

[James HE]

Marshall Electronics= microphones and only microphones
Marshall= amplifiers
Not the same company, nor do they claim to be.

I haven't heard the Nady's, but their emphasis seems to be on "cheap" gear, even their wireless stuff. Marshall seems to have their emphasis on mics for "cheap". I'd pick a marshall microphone over a Nady anyday. A company that makes one thing cheaply is (to me) better than a company that makes everything cheaply (except maybe for Yahmaha )

The V67 is good. That one's tempting me. It may be what you are looking for MASTON. The 603's are small diphragm condensors, generally you'd be better off with a large diaphragm condensor for voice, small diaphragm condensors don't handle plosives as well, at least that has been my experience.

you say "I don't want Octava's cuz I can't take a change with quality control" !!! What! and you're considering Nady!!!

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a mic that will do both Classical guitar and voice well for not much money. Could you possibly go for two mics? Both a small and a large diphragm? Maybe a V67 and a 603. Or an V67 and a Nt-3?

-jhe

 

[Wallycleaver]

poo this is g rated movie!

 

[Harvey Gerst]

Nady makes wireless, marshall makes amps, not mic's. There is a slew of mics made in the same factory in china that a bunch of companies are slaping their name on them. I'd go for a Rode nt 3. $150 I think, literally bitch slaps the nady and marshall mics. Also I hear the Apex mics are good, you'd have to check with the green hornet, but I think they are in the same price range. By save up a few more (insert your favorite currency here), you can get gear thats many times better!

And guess where the Rode capsules are made? D'oh !!! Same place where the Manley Cardioid Reference mic capsules and the Marshalls mics are made. Have you actually listened to the Marshall mics? I did. Pretty thoroughly, too, I think.

About a year ago, I was a lot like you, blasting ALL chinese capsules for poor quality control and sub-standard performance, until someone asked me if I had actually heard the Marshall mics or any of the Chinese capsules. All I had heard were a few Rode mics and the sound varied between identical models, so I was blasting every Chinese mic, based on that.

Last year, I had the opportunity to actually test the entire Marshall line and quite a few of them turned out to be very superior in performance. All were consistant. I know that EveAnna Manley is VERY fussy about the quality of all Manley products, and she's using a Chinese capsule in the Manley Cardioid Reference Mic (which sells for around $3,000). It's a stunning sounding microphone.

It doesn't help anybody make an intelligent decision when you condemn something, based soley on the country of origin. You tend to paint with too broad a brush when you do that. Companies like Marshall aren't just slapping their name on the mics - they're investing in R&D to come up with their own unique mic lines. I've listened to the Rode, Nady, and Marshall mics, side by side, under quiet, controlled conditions, not in a noisy store; have you?

 

[JFogarty]

Harvey Gerst,
What do you think of the MXL1000s as drum overheads? Musiciansfriend has a deal on two of em for 150, along with a dynamic. I was thinking of getting this. Would those 1000s sound good for vocals? What about accoustic guitar, or micing guitar amps?

 

[JFogarty]

By the way, I am apparently a fish that has somehow reach the rank of Seargent........

 

[Tom Hicks]

Hi Harvey
Can you give an overall comparison of Rode vs Marshall vs Nady?Just in terms of these entry level mikes.I read your review of the Marshalls.Do you think that their QC is maybe a little more consistant?Thanks.

Tom

p.s. I bought a NT1 recently after a taste test at the local Guitar Satan in Arlington.I had heard the "harsh top end" rap but my ears (with this mike in my system) just hear dry,detailed "air".I play live with piezos in the P.A. mains, so that is my standard for a harsh top end.

 

[Harvey Gerst]

Harvey Gerst,
What do you think of the MXL1000s as drum overheads? Musiciansfriend has a deal on two of em for 150, along with a dynamic. I was thinking of getting this. Would those 1000s sound good for vocals? What about accoustic guitar, or micing guitar amps?

If you take off the ball end of the MXL-1000, you have the same unit as a MXL-603S, which works very well as a drum overhead mic.

 

[lunkhead]

Somebody wrote: I'd go for a Rode nt 3. $150 I think, literally bitch slaps the nady and marshall mics.

Do you know this by experience or are you just assuming because of Nady's past reputation? I wouldn't have thought the Nady was good either until I tried it. A very quiet, full-sounding mic.

Lunkhead

 

[Harvey Gerst]

Hi Harvey
Can you give an overall comparison of Rode vs Marshall vs Nady?Just in terms of these entry level mikes.I read your review of the Marshalls.Do you think that their QC is maybe a little more consistant?Thanks.

Tom

p.s. I bought a NT1 recently after a taste test at the local Guitar Satan in Arlington.I had heard the "harsh top end" rap but my ears (with this mike in my system) just hear dry,detailed "air".I play live with piezos in the P.A. mains, so that is my standard for a harsh top end.

Yes, I think the Marshalls are far more consistent because of the extra QC measures they use.
I haven't heard all of the newer Rode mics or even mics from their latest batch, so I can't really comment on their current top end, except to say that the old NT-1 was "strident and harsh sounding", to me.

That harshness doesn't usually show up initially when you buy your first condensor mic. It's only after you become more accustomed to the sound of good mics, that you begin to hear the shrillness. At first, it justs sounds "clearer" and "more detailed" than the dynamic mics you're accustomed to.

 

[MASTON]

Hi, it's little me again. Thankyou all for your comments, especially James He & Harvey who're really answering my question.
Wasn't too sure about this bit though from one esteemed member:

'This question is like "Do I want the shit on a stick or the shit on a plate."
Shit is still shit!
Just my .02'

Maybe it's me, but I just can't seem to find the wisdom in this. I'm sure it's a really helpful, constructive comment, but I'm having trouble perceiving the message. Can anybody help me out here?

Anyway, back to reality and nicer smelling places.
I've been checking out the Marshall V67 in the UK and there's only one price in the whole country – get this: $375. I've seen it at abesmusic for $200, so I'll definitely be sending my money over to you boys.
Question no.1: Where's the best deal in the US for the Marshall (must do international sales as well, of course)

I've decided to add the Octava Mk319 to the equation. I can get it for $225 over here, though I'm sure I've seen it at $150 somewhere in some shop over there so:
Question no. 2: Where's the best deal in the US for the Octava (must do international sales as well, of course), and anyone got any experience recording vocals and guitar with it, love to know whay you reckon?

Now the Nady. I've still yet to hear anyone except Lunkhead (thankyou Lunkhead for your perseverance) recommend it so
Question no.3: Anybody got a Nady SCM-1000 they can say anything about, and
Question no.4 (you guessed it): Where's the best deal in the US for the Nady (must do international sales as well, of course)

I've decided I'd like the Marshall but looks like it's the most expensive, but if I can get a good deal I'll go for it.

And can I remind people that I'm only trying to make a demo (I'm using a Soundblaster remember) so I don't need expensive gear – just the best I can get with what I've got.

Till next time

Maston

 

[Harvey Gerst]

Hi, it's little me again. Thankyou all for your comments, especially James He & Harvey who're really answering my question.
Wasn't too sure about this bit though from one esteemed member:

'This question is like "Do I want the shit on a stick or the shit on a plate."
Shit is still shit!
Just my .02'

Maybe it's me, but I just can't seem to find the wisdom in this. I'm sure it's a really helpful, constructive comment, but I'm having trouble perceiving the message. Can anybody help me out here?

I didn't say it, so I'm not sure what it means either.

Anyway, back to reality and nicer smelling places.
I've been checking out the Marshall V67 in the UK and there's only one price in the whole country – get this: $375. I've seen it at abesmusic for $200, so I'll definitely be sending my money over to you boys.
Question no.1: Where's the best deal in the US for the Marshall (must do international sales as well, of course)?

Probably Abe's Music or Filiment Audio or 8th Street Music.

I've decided to add the Octava Mk319 to the equation. I can get it for $225 over here, though I'm sure I've seen it at $150 somewhere in some shop over there so:
Question no. 2: Where's the best deal in the US for the Octava (must do international sales as well, of course), and anyone got any experience recording vocals and guitar with it, love to know whay you reckon?

I wasn't "thrilled" with the sound of the 319, but a lot of people seem to like them, so go figure. Guitar Center is the exclusive US dealer for Oktava and I think they're on sale for under $200 (maybe $150).

Now the Nady. I've still yet to hear anyone except Lunkhead (thankyou Lunkhead for your perseverance) recommend it so
Question no.3: Anybody got a Nady SCM-1000 they can say anything about, and
Question no.4 (you guessed it): Where's the best deal in the US for the Nady (must do international sales as well, of course)

The Nady SCM-1000 is an ok mic, nothing spectacular to me in Cardioid mode, pretty good in Omni (except for an on-axis rise in the high end), and Figure 8 mode was useless from the backside. But for a multi-pattern for $150, I don't know anything else around that comes close. I don't know who sells the Nadys.

I've decided I'd like the Marshall but looks like it's the most expensive, but if I can get a good deal I'll go for it.

And can I remind people that I'm only trying to make a demo (I'm using a Soundblaster remember) so I don't need expensive gear – just the best I can get with what I've got.

Till next time

Maston

I'd go with the V67G as the best sounding of the bunch. Remember that whichever mic you choose, they will all need a source for 48 volt phantom power.

 

[kristian]

weakest link in the chain.

To tell you the truth, your soundblaster will ruin any mic you use. I read this thread and I was almost going to comment on mics, but first you ahve to realise that the soundblaster just will not cut sound. I thought i could run the line-in on my SB Live! an have fine results since im not using the cheap mic pre. but thats not true, you lose high end most noticeably. I mean serious loss of high end. On top of that, your mics will sound like poopoo running through 16 bit conversion. Im not trying to rain on the parade but ANY mic will only be at 1/2 its potential here, and the more expensive the mic gets, you wont be able to tell that it is the same quality.

My thoughts, you have to be able to find a 2channel in sound card in LOOT used or something. for cheap, even an old 16 bit echo card will be 100 times better. really i bet for 200 pounds you could do a new(used) soundcard and maybe even a used mic as well. If you check out used gear you can save yourself huge amounts of money.

 

[lunkhead]

Musicians Friend online catalog is the only place I've seen the SCM1000 sold.

Lunk

 

[GT]

Hey Harvey,

Have you had a chance to check out the Neumann 103? The Neumann mystic, and the looks of that mic, make me want one bad.

Are Neumanns all there cracked up to be, or just hype?

 

[Harvey Gerst]

Hey Harvey,

Have you had a chance to check out the Neumann 103? The Neumann mystic, and the looks of that mic, make me want one bad.

Are Neumanns all there cracked up to be, or just hype?

It's the mic I compare all the others to. I got one out of the first batch of Neumann TLM-103s to come into the country. VERY low noise, VERY big sounding. It's no hype.

 

[MASTON]

Kristian - Yeah, I know the SB's gonna kill it a lot, but yous gotta make do havent' ya. I looked in LOOT the other day but couldn't see much. How much would an old used echo card be then, d you reckon. I know what you mean about used gear cos I got my ART dual channel for £75, and it's £250 new in the UK.
I do intend to upgrade at some point, sos I intend to have a decent mic when I do, that's the logic.
Please add your bit on the mic question.

Harvey Gerst. Thanks for that.
What's Cardioid mode, Omni, and Figure 8 mode, though.

Maston

 

[Gidge]

MASTON, ill aplogize on behalf of the member that made the "shit comment"....it was totally uncalled for.....

 

[Gidge]

Well, Im recording into a Delta Audiophile.....I wont get near the quality of a 2" Studer through an SSL board....but this is HOME RECORDING.com and my equipment pacifies (but not satisfies cause Ill always want more) my needs...all he asked for was "A decent condenser mic for as cheap a price as possible that'll record BOTH decent vocals and guitar" and in the price range he was looking for it can be done....so what he has a soundblaster card....maybe he'll upgrade later.....if someone would ask whether it would make more of a difference to get a better soundcard or microphone id say microphone in a second.....ive heard good things done with cheapo sound cards....that card is going to introduce some noise into his recordings but it could have been said in a nicer way.....

C7, I didnt feel that you needed someone to apologize for you...If I did I would of said "C7 you need to apologize"....I felt the need to aplogize for you...Since Im living in this free country, Ill just go ahead and do it....

As far as paying your bills, you've already posted how much money you make (probably the only person here who has done so), so I think you either a)make enough to pay them your damn self or b)have a crack habit you cant support....I think along with you issues you have to deal with on self image, insecurity, and letting go of the past, you may want to speak to your counselor about these money issues....