Leaning towards C1 vs. V67G. Am I wasting $100?

[Bergen]

So I've been struggling about which mic I should ask for Christmas, and it's impractical for me to demo these, so I'm making this decision based upon reviews, postings here, and dry samples as well as mp3 mixes with these mics.

After initially reading the C1 reviews, I was set on upgrading to it from the MXL 990 I'm currently using. Then I read that the V67G and C1 sound very similar, and that several people think there would be no reason to buy the C1 since the V67G is $100 cheaper. I know you don't get the high pass filter or pad with the V67G(I can get the V67G shockmount for free), but these features don't justify the price difference for me. Then I listen to mp3 mixes with these mics, and I hear distinct differences. The vocal sound of waytf, emeric and other C1 users sound distinctly different from dtb and other V67G users. Here are my impressions.

V67G-like it on acoustic guitar. seems to coat the vocals with a "film" for lack of a better word. Acts like a buffer-will make certain vocal unpleasantries less apparent, but doesn't let the vocal shine. Seems better for less busy mixes where you don't necessarily want the voice to stand out. Some like it for thin, harsh female voices, and I would agree.

C1-allows the voice to float above the mix. voice seems closer and clearer. Gives a high-end sheen that gives it a distinctive professional sound. occassional sibilance issues with some singers, but it seems some sibilance in vocals has become fashionable in pop music today. A good complement for a deep, smooth male voice.

Am I totally off base here? Am I trying to read too much into already processed vocals.

I know I'm posting on an issue that is covered all too much on these boards, but I'm buying one of these in the next few days, and wanted to get some last minute feedback before going the more expensive route.

If anyone's interested, you can hear some vocal samples from a mic shootout I did to help advise me.

http://www.nowhereradio.com/bergen/singles

Thanks

 

[DJL]

Both mic's can sound good with the right voice... but no one knows which one would work best with your voice (maybe neither)... so you'll need to audition them both for yourself to find out. Good luck and have fun.

And remember, don't buy a mic without auditioning it first unless you can return it... or have extra money to throw away.

 

[Flatpicker]

DJL's correct. Until you've heard them, it's a crap shoot. We can tell you that a "Mr. Microphone" probably won’t work for you, but after that, take all opinions with a salt-block.

For example, I can quote knowledgeable people who love these mics and I can quote knowledgeable people who hate them. So who should you listen to? When you can answer that, tell me so I’ll know!

Have you checked out thelisteningsessions.com? I think it’s one of the greatest sources of microphone information on the web. And it’s free! Every mic I've tried in my home studio sounds really close to the way it does there.

 

[Bergen]

Flatpicker and DJL: Thanks for the input.

Flatpicker: I have checked out the listening sessions. The problem is on the website they have a male vocal on the C1 and an acoustic guitar on the V67G. I do like the C1 vocal best compared to the other mics on that same singer. I've heard some dry V67G samples on the bbs here, and I prefer the C1 based on that.

DJL: You're right, but it's not that easy. It's getting really hard to demo mics. Many places don't want to because of health code restrictions from selling demo'd mics as new. Others want you to rent them for demos. And very few places carry both these mics. I've seen you posting this message a lot lately, and its great advice that is harder to follow. And I'm in Southern California, which should have as many places to demo as anywhere.

 

[Bob Keelan]

Well the bad news is that until you get a mic into your own studio you are not going to be able to do a good evaluation. And I don't mean for a day or a weekend. I mean for weeks and months under all types of situations.

The good news is that there are some good quality mics at pretty reasonable prices these days. The 2 mics you are talking about are 2 of them.

Go with your gut and enjoy!

 

[Middleman]

The C1 is a more open but rather average sounding. I would use it for background vocals or a deep voice that needed some shine. On a lead vocal its very clean but rather unremarkable with occassional brittle highs. Does not stand out as easily in the mix however with multiple takes creates a nice image on lead or bkgd vocals. I quickly tired of the sound of it however and moved along to a better mic.

The V67G is what I would call a ballad mic. Very up front, warm and in your face, kind of dark. Not a rock or pop mic however in my experience. Its a one or two take mic, doesn't layer well across more than 2 tracks.

They do not sound similar at all, let me dispel that myth.

Also, I would not use either on acoustic guitar. The C1 is too brittle on the high notes, the V67G accents the lo mid which you generally do not want in an acoustic track unless it is solo.

I would steer you toward either a V69 tube or for a more versatile solution the V67 on vocals and at least 1 Oktava 012 for that acoustic. Another alternative would be the the AT 4040.

 

[darrin_h2000]

I like the Mxl 603s in an XY for my acoustic.

 

[Bergen]

So I try to take DJL's and Flatpicker's advice and step out from work to the Sam Ash 20 miles away since they only do their demos weekday afternoons when they're not busy. Well, I get called back for an urgent situation, and luckily I was only 10 minutes away so I didn't get in trouble. See, this demo stuff isn't easy.

Man, you guys are gonna get me fired!

 

[DJL]

Well then keep your job and just buy them both and sell the one you don't like... personally, I think you'd be better off saving up a little more money and audition some better mic's. Whatever you do, I wish you the best.

 

[chessrock]

Between the two, I think the C1 is a lot more useful of a mic. Maybe the v67 would be good in a very sparse, barren mix . . . maybe something with just accoustic and/or piano and vocals.

 

[TexRoadkill]

If you are only getting one I would pick an MXL V93/2003 over both of those. I like the C1 but it has a very distinct tone. The V93 is a bit more neutral IMO plus it has the pad and HP filter like the C1 (v67 does not). You can usually get them for around $150.

 

[billisa]

It's getting really hard to demo mics. Many places don't want to because of health code restrictions from selling demo'd mics as new.

I'm aware of the difficulties of demo-ing mics, but I would find out if in fact there are ANY health code statutes involving microphones in your state. I've heard, in most states, that's total nonsense. Ground Round was saying for a while that making a "rare" hamburger violated state law (in CT). It doesn't. They stopped saying that, not because the law changed, but because enough smart people told them they didn't like to be lied to as a matter of store policy.

I would do the same with an outfit like Guitar Center, or any other using state law to constrict your options as a consumer. Find out if there's actually a state law. If not, then when someone tells you there is, get the manager and tell him/her you don't like to be deliberately misled and that you will be informing the state atty. general to indicate the state is being used as tool to hoodwink unsuspecting customers... Then write a letter to the state atty. general and CC a copy to the store in question.

Or, just leave the store (but at least tell them you don't like being lied to).

I would also say this. Given the overwhelmingly positive response on the Studio Projects B1's C1's and the MXL V67G's, I think even sound unheard, you'd find a good use for any of these mics, and would not be sorry you bought one. I might insist on hearing a $500+ mic. I'm not at all sorry I didn't insist on first auditioning my B1's. I've used lots of mega-buck mics in many different studios over the years. The B1's are great. And for the money they are phenomenal.

 

[laptoppop]

I have both and use both. For example, with my latest recording session I ended up using the C1 for the male lead vocal, and the 67 for a female backup singer - great sounds for each that mixed well.

If I only got to have one, I'd probably choose the C1, but it wouldn't be an easy choice.

-lee-

 

[Bergen]

Well anyway, I did finally end up getting to Sam Ash when I wasn't needed at work and demo'd the v67g up against my mxl 990. First off, the salespeople were all kind of intimidated and wowed by the appearance of the 990. They thought it was going to squash the v67g "cause it looked like a TLM 103". I thought that was funny. As soon as I put the headphones on, I knew this was a waste of time. This was a big room with other people in it so I could hear other voices and room noise. The difference between these mics on headphones in this room was subtle, and I know the real differences are more than subtle. However, I did pick up one useful tidbit: the proximity effect of the v67g is not a good thing for my voice. I thought the headphone speakers were going to blow when I was up on it 2 inches away at 30 degrees like Harvey recommends. So I'm going with the C1 and learned the following.

-don't bother demoing mics unless you have a private decent sounding room
-since this may be hard to come by at music stores, DJL gave good advice in buying 2 or 3 mics you are considering and returning the ones you don't want. I came across an online dealer that sells both sp and mxl mics that had a 10-day return policy. If this wasn't going to be a gift, this is probably what I would have done.

Anyway, thanks for all the input.

 

[DJL]

<snip>

However, I did pick up one useful tidbit: the proximity effect of the v67g is not a good thing for my voice.

<snip>

If this wasn't going to be a gift, this is probably what I would have done.

Hummm... your voice or a gift?

 

[Bergen]

Well DJL, after reading your post about 10 times, I think I see what you're saying. I knew the comparison in the store wasn't going to be great. And if I had been buying the mics myself I wouldn't have done this, I would have bought 2 and returned one. But the mic comparison was almost useless; if it hadn't been for the dramatic proximity effect on the v67g, I would have learned nothing.

And remember, I said this didn't work on "my voice". I didn't say the v67g sucks and the C1 rules. I'm basically echoing what everyone has been saying. I wonder if you would have had the same reply if I hadn't decided on the "797 audio" studio projects C1?

 

[DJL]

You missed the point... if your buying a mic as a gift for someone else they're the one who needs to audition the mic not you. Is the mic for you, or is it a gift for someone else?

 

[memriloc]

DJL...Read the first line of this thread man....

 

[DJL]

"Leaning towards C1 vs. V67G. Am I wasting $100?"

Or

"So I've been struggling about which mic I should ask for Christmas, and it's impractical for me to demo these, so I'm making this decision based upon reviews, postings here, and dry samples as well as mp3 mixes with these mics."

Maybe he should just flip a coin.

 

[Bergen]

Ok, fair enough. I suppose I could have been clearer. My wife will be getting one of these mics for me for Christmas. It's not cool to ask for two gifts when you plan to return one. Though I haven't auditioned the C1 personally, I've heard both dry and mixed samples of this mic from vocalists with similar voices and styles to mine, and I like what I hear. If you want to check out the vocal demo link I put up at the start of this thread and recommend another mic in the under $200 price range for my voice, I'll take it under consideration.