Interesting Mic controversy

  • Thread starter Thread starter slobbermonster
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Han said:
It would be best when Alan puts DJL on his ignore list, this forum would be much better.
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Yeah ... or ... DJL puts Alan on his ignore list. Never gonna happen ... never gonna happen. :)
 
Slobbermonster, can you please re-title this thread "Everything That Is Wrong With HR.com"


Thanks
 
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slobbermonster said:
As far as mics, they aren't better because of cheap chinese crap and anyone who uses mics for a living will verify that. Mic makers are scrambling all the time trying to come with stuff that's as good as the old stuff.

The only thing the chinese makers have done is made mics cheaper, not better.
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I guess I disagree with that, and I DO use mics to make a living.

Yes, there's a lotta magic in the old U47's, U48's, U67's, ELA's and old ribbon mics, but all the rest of the "old stuff" was pretty much just that - old stuff. Most pro studios back then had EV664's and 666's, D12e's, and a bunch of other mics that "worked okay, but not great". Most of the equipment was noisy as hell.

A few years ago, I would have agreed with you completely about Chinese mics, based on my hearing the MXL 2001, the Rode NT1, and a few others - all of them had that screeching high end that I hate. But, so did the AKG C3000, the C1000, some of the Audio Technicas, and the 414BULS.

In the last four years, I've found about 5 or 6 Chinese mics that are a good addition to our mic locker, and they continue to work well, for us anyway. To say that "any mic made in China is bad" is just unrealistic. And untrue, IMO. The MXL V69ME, the V77, the SP T3, the ADK Hamburg or Vienna are serious tools that will sit quite well in a professional studio.

I sold my U47 many years ago (when I got out of the studio business for a few years). At today's prices, I can't afford another one, but the mics listed above get me pretty damn close to that sound, at least close enough to get groups signed to major labels and released "as is". That's all I can ask of any mic. I don't look at the label or country of origin when I record; I listen and choose whatever I think is appropriate for the job.
 
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Thanks Harvey.
Your willingness to take each piece of equipment as it comes without pre-judgement or blanket generalizations is one of the greatest assets on this (or any) BBS. Through reading your posts, I have gained a context and a vocabulary with which to better understand what I hear, what I want to hear, and how to accomplish attaining the sound which I want to create.
While I am still a complete newbie.....you've taught me to fish, and I'll be able to carry that gift with me through the rest of my life...and I am humbly grateful.
You've also showed me that there are select gems among the knockoffs that are both worthy and affordable....another great gift!!
.....FWIW :)
 
Why is it whenever Harvey posts another wonderful tidbit I find myself humming "Please don't go"?


"Please don't go!
Don't goooo
Don't go away!
Please don't go!
Don't goooo
I'm beggin' you to stay!"
 
DJL has a bug up his ass, the rest of you get really worked up about it, and then Alan threatens to sue him to shut him up. Wash, rinse, repeat.

You're all insane. All of you.
 
Harvey Gerst said:
I guess I disagree with that, and I DO use mics to make a living.

Yes, there's a lotta magic in the old U47's, U48's, U67's, ELA's and old ribbon mics, but all the rest of the "old stuff" was pretty much just that - old stuff. Most pro studios back then had EV664's and 666's, D12e's, and a bunch of other mics that "worked okay, but not great". Most of the equipment was noisy as hell.

A few years ago, I would have agreed with you completely about Chinese mics, based on my hearing the MXL 2001, the Rode NT1, and a few others - all of them had that screeching high end that I hate. But, so did the AKG C3000, the C1000, some of the Audio Technicas, and the 414BULS.

In the last four years, I've found about 5 or 6 Chinese mics that are a good addition to our mic locker, and they continue to work well, for us anyway. To say that "any mic made in China is bad" is just unrealistic. And untrue, IMO. The MXL V69ME, the V77, the SP T3, the ADK Hamburg or Vienna are serious tools that will sit quite well in a professional studio.

I sold my U47 many years ago (when I got out of the studio business for a few years). At today's prices, I can't afford another one, but the mics listed above get me pretty damn close to that sound, at least close enough to get groups signed to major labels and released "as is". That's all I can ask of any mic. I don't look at the label or country of origin when I record; I listen and choose whatever I think is appropriate for the job.
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Agreed. Back in the late 70's, the same things were being said about Japanese cars. Now I drive a '97 Honda with 100,000 miles on it that has never broken down, stranded me, or even failed to start even once. Even the body is in near perfect shape, with nary a rust spot.

Times change, and we need to be open-minded enough to recognize that when it happens. I have a couple of crap chinese mics, and more than a couple of really good ones. The good ones I either found by listening to pros like yourself, or simply by using my ears as I did when I bought my M-Audio mics. Open ears and an open mind are a better guide than blanket statements...IMO of course.
 
I'm with you Harvey, I havent found too many Chinese mics that are very good. It really doesn't matter where they are made, they could be made in Wisconsin and if they sound like the bulk of what is coming out of China it would still suck.

My point, was concerning mic technology improving from the chinese and the importers and to this date that hasn't happened
 
Chris F said:
Agreed. Back in the late 70's, the same things were being said about Japanese cars.
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And post WWII, Japanese cameras. Where are Zeiss, Leitz, Exakta and Voigtlander? Cannon, Olympus, Nikon, and Minolta.

All these new Iraqi mics that are coming out are pure crap. Give me the tried and true Chinese. :)
 
and the pros still use Hasselblad
 
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crazydoc said:
And post WWII, Japanese cameras. Where are Zeiss, Leitz, Exakta and Voigtlander? Cannon, Olympus, Nikon, and Minolta.
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Zeiss & Leitz still bulld high-quality cameras - and Neumann & Gefell still build awesome mics ;)
 
Giganova said:
Zeiss & Leitz still bulld high-quality cameras - and Neumann & Gefell still build awesome mics ;)
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And 99% of us can't afford them. And as always, it's the eye behind the viewfinder that makes the picture, not the camera, just as it's the sound going into the equipment that makes the music, not the mic. (A mixed metaphor, I know. :))

The point was that the Japanese cameras are now, and have been for some time, considered to be at the same "pro" level that German cameras had been. The Chinese mics may be going in the same direction.
 
slobbermonster said:
and the pros still use Hasselblad
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A lot of us also used Bronicas for 2-1/4 shots, or Minoltas instead of Rolliflex's for twin lens stuff.

(Yeah, I did that too, but I also did product photography, so 4x5 and 8x10 cameras were my preferred weapons of choice.)
 
slobbermonster said:
and the pros still use Hasselblad
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I work in a photo studio not for portraits but commercial photograpy. We use blads as well as Nikkor lenses on digital backs(horseman). For the most part the Nikkor lenses get used the most. . On the other hand Hasselblad and AGFA and most other film based companies are a dying breed. You see an awful lot of Nikon D70's out there these days. At any rate blanket statements are bad no matter what you are reffering to. Gear snobbery is not a benefit in any way. I'd say use your ears.
 
I sold off my Bronica SQ-Am a couple of years ago and put the proceeds into mics, etc. At least I know who owns it and can always borrow it back if needed, although at this stage, that seems unlikely.

:cool:
 
The point I was trying to make was: did I lose any jobs because I had a Bronica and a Nikon and a Minolta, rather than a Hassleblad and a Leica and a Rolliflex? Of course not. And in product photography, my two large format Cambos worked just fine, and I didn't lust after a Sinar or Linhof (well, maybe just a little).

The one place I found where a Lieca was much better (for me) than a Nikon was doing auto racing photography.
 
The thread is like a good soap opera, we are now having discussions about cameras instead of microphones.

I am starting to get hooked.... :D

Peace
 
slobbermonster said:
I'm with you Harvey, I havent found too many Chinese mics that are very good. It really doesn't matter where they are made, they could be made in Wisconsin and if they sound like the bulk of what is coming out of China it would still suck.
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...?????????????????????????????????...say what?...
 
The whole point is that if it's a decent tool that can do the job, I don't care where it was made, be it a camera, or a piece of audio equipment. People looked at my finished pictures, not at the equipment I used to take the picture.

And to continue the parallel, Edward Weston or Ansel Adams could take a cheap large format camera and beat me every time - even if I had a ton of Sinars, Linhofs, and Schneider or Rodenstock lenses.
 
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