how to record and mix 16 tracks? which audio interface?

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schnoops

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Hi folks, I need the help of the experts, and a rather quick answer ( If it's possible)

A friend of mine who's been recording analog for years wants to set up a DAW, because his tape machine went down this week end. He's got a few projects running out of date, and he needs to be up and running by the end of the week.

He was doing 16 analog tracks, live takes (no overdub, at most very rarely).

He wants to be able to record and playback 16 tracks, and add a few FX like comp/gate/EQ on every track, a couple of reverbs in send, plus some delay/flange/distortion here and there.

I pointed him out to a 2600+ athlon XP.

but then I'm in sort of a dilemma concerning the audio hardware:
- 2 delta 1010
- MoTU 24 IO
- Creamware pulsarII or LunaII+ 2*8 lines 24/96 IO racks
-RME cards (which one, I don't know for the moment)

which one is the best? I heard that running Two 1010 alongside can be hard depending on many configuration factors,

motu seems to be great, but has non MIDI or digital IO,

Creamware is expensive, seems less stable, harder to work with because of the virtual cabling, but has DSP under the hood, (however I read review saying that bouncing tracks with creamware FX was impossible under Qbase)

I told him he had two choices: a light CPU with extra DSP cards such as UAD1, Powecore or Pulsar,
or a bigger CPU (XP3200+) with only native VSTs...

do you think he can manage 16 tracks with decent gate/comp/eq/fx per track + 2-3 sends without the help of an extra DSP?

Thanks for your precious help dudes.... but be quick!
 
My opinion.
Delta 1010s are great! but there have been some issues with win XP being able to "see" both cards. I am using 2 under win98se no problem.
The MOTU would be the way to go but watch the chipset issue. Motu works best with Intel chipsets and few others. Go to their website to find best match.
RME makes wonderful interfaces if you can afford them, they are superior on sound and ins/outs features. They are also much more lenient on chipset issues.

Your Mixing issues are going to be mainly contingent on the software.I was having trouble with Cakewalk pro( and Sonar mixing 16 tracks of edited audio with effects. By changing to Samplitude (and nothing else) I was able to go as high as 30+ tracks with edits,EQ,compression and some master reverb without using more than 50% of my CPU.
It is all on how well the code was optimized for audio.If your friend is interested in MIDI stuff That is another issue. Samplitude is primarily a Audio only program until the new updates come out in the near future.
 
Thanks tmix!

I think he's going to deal mainly with audio, and maybe shift to midi later, as he's new to computer based audio.

I didn't know about the chipset issues with the MoTU products. SOS revewed the MoTU offer in october's issue, I'll check.

I didn't see anything in the RME line that would allow for 16 or 24 tracks in a single box. I'll check this further.

Thanks a lot!

Any other comments welcome!
 
tmix said:

Your Mixing issues are going to be mainly contingent on the software.I was having trouble with Cakewalk pro( and Sonar mixing 16 tracks of edited audio with effects. By changing to Samplitude (and nothing else) I was able to go as high as 30+ tracks with edits,EQ,compression and some master reverb without using more than 50% of my CPU.
It is all on how well the code was optimized for audio.If your friend is interested in MIDI stuff That is another issue. Samplitude is primarily a Audio only program until the new updates come out in the near future.
Click to expand...

What kind of system are you running? I've noticed with Sonar that the plugs that come with it take up much less CPU than something like Waves plugs. How many of those tracks do you actually have verb on?
 
At the time I was(am) running a 700mhz P3 with win 98se.
I was using the Cakewalk plugs plus the plugs from Sonic Foundry . Generally never running more than 2 aux busses with 2 Reverbs.Compression on a few tracks etc.
I literally am using the same plugs PLUS the native effects in Samplitude and it still runs as fast as I has stated.

There is no comparison to the CPU efficiency. Some programs are just better.
 
I want to add a 2nd Aardvark Q10 when fundage permits, to have 16 inputs.
 
I have been in the market for a 16 out soundcard for a long time. MOTU is the only card I have come across, which is beyond my price range. The only alternatives appear to be 4 to 8 out cards that you will have to buy in multiples. And even then you will have to consider the compatibility of the card to your system.

I thought my dreams came true when I purchased the RME digi9636, but I misread the documentation. Yes, the digi96 series can give you 16 outs and higher, but the cards only provide it if you attach expansion boards. The highest output expansion board for the card is an 8 out card supplement for $250. So you have to shell out $500 for two expansion cards to get 16 outputs. The total package sucks up three expansion slots, which isn't a big deal if you have the room. I will be spending $900 for all of this, but looking at my alternatives I still come out ahead in price and quality over stacking identical multiple out boxes. (I also needed ADAT sync, lightpipe, s/pdif and wanted clock i/o which steered me in this direction).

The plus side though is high card quality, plus they bundle it with Samplitude 6.0 which is multitracking and mastering software with the capacity to burn redbook cd's, almost like getting Cubase and Wavelab for free.

Cy
 
Cyrokk said:
I have been in the market for a 16 out soundcard for a long time. MOTU is the only card I have come across, which is beyond my price range. The only alternatives appear to be 4 to 8 out cards that you will have to buy in multiples. And even then you will have to consider the compatibility of the card to your system.

I thought my dreams came true when I purchased the RME digi9636, but I misread the documentation. Yes, the digi96 series can give you 16 outs and higher, but the cards only provide it if you attach expansion boards. The highest output expansion board for the card is an 8 out card supplement for $250. So you have to shell out $500 for two expansion cards to get 16 outputs. The total package sucks up three expansion slots, which isn't a big deal if you have the room. I will be spending $900 for all of this, but looking at my alternatives I still come out ahead in price and quality over stacking identical multiple out boxes. (I also needed ADAT sync, lightpipe, s/pdif and wanted clock i/o which steered me in this direction).

The plus side though is high card quality, plus they bundle it with Samplitude 6.0 which is multitracking and mastering software with the capacity to burn redbook cd's, almost like getting Cubase and Wavelab for free.

Cy
Click to expand...

dude, i keep telling ya...... microsoft wave recorder and sound blaster 16 are the way to go. You just need 8 of those cards to get your damn 16 i/o. who needs light pipe. :rolleyes: :D ;) :p :cool:
 
lmao :D
If I was in chat right now you would be hearing me whine about having to shell out more cash for these damn expansion cards.

Count your blessings.. :D
 
I don't want to sound like an idiot, but did you consider getting of these brand new Tascam FW-1884 FireWire interfaces plus an extension board? That'll be a complete 16 track mixing + MIDI bundle for less than 2grands.
 
Nobody seems to know these things:
http://www.staudio.com

DSP2000 and DSP3000 are breakout boxes for their DSP24 card, which can handle 10 in and out at a latency of 5ms, sometimes lower. I have one DSP2000 and have two more in the mail (up to four in one box)... at €444 a card you can't go wrong.

(so that's €1332 for 30 ins, 30 outs-of which 3x2 digital on coax, optical or AES/EBU, 3 midi ins and 6 midi outs)


...now let's hope my computer agrees with my plan on having 3 PCI-bus intensive cards :cool:

Herwig
 
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