help -- violin, acoustic, and drums

[the pete]

okay, i need some advice here. i've been working on this project with some friends, we've got violin, acoustic and drums. we're ready to start recording and i have some questions... i can mic up drums and i've got the idea for acoustic (about 1-2 feet away from the 21st fret?) but i'm kind of stuck on violin... for mics, i have:

2 sm81's
r0de nt1A
oktava mk319
sm57
beta 52

does anybody have any ideas on how i would mic a violin with these?

thanks
-pete

 

[Treeline]

It's not clear how you're setting up these instruments; there may be a lot of bleed between mics. On the other hand, if you're doing a live recording, the bleed might end up being an asset.

A violin is a pretty powerful instrument. With the mics you have, I'd experiment a lot with placement, but try starting out with the Oktava about four feet in front of the violin, positioned upside down and hanging about a foot over it. If you get too close you'll get overtaken by bow noise. This will pick up ambient sounds, like percussion, so you might be doing a bit of A / B experimenting. Maybe have the violinist facing the drummer and as far away as is workable. Putting a baffle / isolator gobo thing around the drums, or using foam to build a baffle behind the violin mic, might help as well.

Good luck!

 

[jmorris]

(about 1-2 feet away from the 21st fret?)
Kind of far away isnt it?

 

[mshilarious]

I've used a pair of SM81s on violin, coincident or near-coincident, about three feet away, head high, aimed at bridge. If you want more of a edgy sound, raise the mics higher, but most people don't want that. I haven't used the Oktava, but if you don't need stereo, that is another option. From what I know of Rode (which isn't much), I suspect that would be too bright. The SM57 I would avoid for this application, and the B52 would be kind of silly.

 

[the pete]

thanks guys.
i actualy just found out that we may do this live(at a venue or coffee shop). IF we do, (i have a firepod) so thats eight tracks to work with? do you guys think thats at all feasible? if we did this live i would probably want to use the 81's as overhead right? a 57 on the snare and the B52 on the kick. this leaves the violin and the acoustic. the one thing is, the violin and acoutic are both electric. i didnt mention it before because if we were to do a studio recording, i'd immagine we would definatly get a better sound mic'ing everthing.

 

[gecko zzed]

If you are recording live, there are a couple of possibilities.

1 Go simple: just use the 81s as a stereo pair in front of the band, and record a single, live stereo track.

2 Go complex: try and mike everything. you could go with what you've already figured out, maybe then using nt1a on guitar and whatever else on violin. I would think about not using a snare mike, just using overheads and kick. I would also consider a single overhead on the kit. that leaves an 81 free for fiddle

Generally, the sound you get from acoustic instrument pickups is not good. Okay for live mixing, but not for recording.

If they are playing live, will this be an acoustic set, or will there be a PA?

 

[the pete]

If you are recording live, there are a couple of possibilities.

1 Go simple: just use the 81s as a stereo pair in front of the band, and record a single, live stereo track.

2 Go complex: try and mike everything. you could go with what you've already figured out, maybe then using nt1a on guitar and whatever else on violin. I would think about not using a snare mike, just using overheads and kick. I would also consider a single overhead on the kit. that leaves an 81 free for fiddle

Generally, the sound you get from acoustic instrument pickups is not good. Okay for live mixing, but not for recording.

If they are playing live, will this be an acoustic set, or will there be a PA?

it'd be an acoustic set

 

[gecko zzed]

Being an acoustic set means you don't have to contend with whatever would be used to drive a PA.

Ultimately, the choice of method is yours. However, at the back of my mind I have this thought that so often we make things more complicated than they need to be, and my leaning is to go for the simple option.

Rather than leaving everything to chance, though, I would be inclined towards setting up a recording rehearsal so that you could figure out how it would work and what would be the most effective way of capturing the sound.

 

[brendandwyer]

i agree, set up a well placed stereo scheme at the live set. Run some tests at soundcheck (if you get one) and if you need to spotlight an instrument, bring in a mic on that instrument, but make sure to leave some room, because you're going for a live sound at that point.