Help mic my drums!

[japeall]

Hey, ive been playing around with different tecniques and whatnot and i have limited equiptment so im trying to make the best of what ive got so i thought i'd throw this out there and see what you all say.

Heres what im using:
Software: protools le 6.0 with a G4 powerbook
Interface: mbox (i know..verrry limited)
Mics: a 4 piece shitty audio technic drum mic kit, sure 57, sure 58, sure 48, audix om2 (similar to a 58), and then i have like 2 or 3 more shittIER mics.

What ive been doing is running 8 mics (kick, snare, 2 racks, ride, 2 crashes) into a mixer and then that into an equalizer and into a effects processor to give it a little depth then into the mbox, for those of you unfamiliar with the mbox, it will only take 2 simultaneous imputs, so i do the left and right from from the mixer as the 2 imputs.

im not pleased with the sound of the kick mainly. none of the mics i have are good at low range, but im trying to make due without getting a kick mic, so ive been actually using the audix om2. ive tried a kick tunnel, and some different locations of the mic, but its not what i want. i want more punch, its for a punk band, so i need a strong kick.

also the overall fullness of the drum tracks are not where they could be i believe. annny help would be greatly appreciated. annnd when i get past this and eventually to vocals, i will ask more questions, i allways have problems with vocals. thanks!
j

 

[Dogbreath]

Tuning, room acoustics, mic placement...huge affect on drums. Drums, for me, have been the hardest to mic.
Where are you placing the mics? Placement is worth putting some time into. I noticed you didn't say anything about your overheads...that's where I get my main stereo drum sound and then mix in the close mics to taste...

Maybe you're getting phase cancellation. Have you checked that?
Got any clips of just the drums you could post? Just throwing out some thoughts...

 

[Dogbreath]

An afterthought on your kick, have you tried using 2 mics? I tried one in front pointed toward the beater and one on the outside of the reso skin off to one side about 2 inches from the skin. Course, you may just need a dedicated kick mic...........

 

[PhilGood]

I picked up on the fact that you referred to the basic mic pack and several others with the adjective "shitty".

Here's a clue: Good sounding drums + shitty mics = poor sound. You can't get a good sound with crap mics. You'll fight it the whole way! EQ destroys sound. It doesn't improve it.

With a good sounding kit, good room and good mics, you shouldn't need to do much of anything to make it sound good. All you should have to do is bring up the faders.

And I heartily disagree with putting the kick mic close to the batter head. My experience says that sound needs to develop before reaching the mic. The closer the mic is to ANY batter head, the worse the recording will be. You need a few inches for all toms and snare, and the kick mic should be just inside the front head by a couple inches.

 

[scrubs]

Might I suggest that you simplify things a little.

First off, submixing 8 mics into a 2 channel interface is very complex, especially with crappy equipment & limited experience, and requires alot of trial-and-error to get it right. Start with 3 or 4 mics (search the Recorderman Method or the Glyn Johns Method for positioning tips) and focus on getting a good sound with those. Spend plenty of time on the placement of each mic, recording tests of mic position until you get the sound you want.

Second, get the EQ and effects processor out of the chain. Again, you're only complicating matters. If you need to EQ a little on each channel with your mixer, do that (like if you want a very specific kick sound), but I would leave everything flat and just focus on mic positioning to get the sounds you want. You can tweak a little with software EQ after recording, if necessary.

 

[Dogbreath]

And I heartily disagree with putting the kick mic close to the batter head. My experience says that sound needs to develop before reaching the mic. The closer the mic is to ANY batter head, the worse the recording will be. You need a few inches for all toms and snare, and the kick mic should be just inside the front head by a couple inches.

It's still worth a shot. I set up just like that and got a great kick. Good oomph and just a skosh extra click that I was looking for. But I wasn't right up on the skin either. Couple of inches back.
If it works for ya, great...if not, try something different. Kinda what this games about, I think.

 

[PhilGood]

It's still worth a shot. I set up just like that and got a great kick. Good oomph and just a skosh extra click that I was looking for. But I wasn't right up on the skin either. Couple of inches back.
If it works for ya, great...if not, try something different. Kinda what this games about, I think.

Absotuley posilivily!!