Help me get started- Any pointers anyone??

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Shana

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OK so i decide i wanna record .I go out and buy a Boss Br8 , a mike , headphones, pickups for my guitar and have my piano tuned. I bought and returned four keyboards and each one proved worse than the next so i m skipping that for now and i dont have the money yet for a drum machine- and besides i would never be able to figure out how to use one- I have a great voice so i wanna record alot of vocals but the problem remains----WHERE DO I START?? I mean i have ideas in my head but i dont write music- tabs i can do- so how to i actually start recording? Peice by peice and then stick em together? should i make a rough copy to put the ideas down or aim for perfection right away? Please gimme some tips here!! Thanx
 
Shana,

Everyone has their own style. You will discover your style in the process of recording/writing. I always shoot for making the technical stuff fit the artistic way of doing things. That is, find out how you write songs/perform songs. If you usually come up with them while singing and playing guitar or piano then keep doing it like that. Once you figure that out, find ways to record yourself in your "natural" setting.

It seems that you're less atuned to overly technical methods, from your return of those keyboards. So, I'd suggest just setting up your mic and pressing record. Maybe record for 15-30 minutes at a time. Then after you're done, see what you got. From listening to your tape, you may want to raise the level of an instrument or your voice. If so, then move the mic to suit. Once you start recording, you'll have more technical questions then write back the bbs.

The best advice I would give is concentrate on the art first. Then make the recording process fit the art. It seems that your talents lie more strongly in that area.

Rev E
 
OK so I guess i shouldnt take it relaxed and see where it goes. Im so eager to hear my own music that im getting frustrated its not happening right away and none of my friends are involved in any type of recording so every time i have a little glitch i come running to the music store. Basically its not as easy as i thought it would be and i cant even IMAGINE trying to buy more equipment- mixers, and wahtever else people seem to have in their studios. I mean how much moe would i need as far as the actual recording is involved? Doesnt the portastudio have it all more or less? I mean i dont play electric guitar so i dont need distortion pedals right? Im using a digital recorder so im already ahead of those guys using analog and 4 tracks ... if only i knew how to prepare the music i wanted to record..like how can i transcribe the piano parts? Im so used to playing by ear but theres no way i can record wiithout the music in front of me....(sigh) I keep reading these messages from ppl for inspiration and so far so good. OK im carrying on. I'm a girl,, sue me :)
 
Hi Shana.....

I am a songwriter. I believe that is what you want to do. Or do you just want to play music and hear it yourself?

If you are a songwriter what type of music would you like to write?

If it is acoustic work the finish the song before the toys. I own the VS880 and VS1680. Not because it makes me inspired. Because it makes for a killer demo, AFTER I write the song. I use a hand held radio shack cassette recorder for writing.
Don't get discouraged from the get go.
If you love to write than write.Learn the recorder at your leisure.
If you just want to hear yourself, and don't care about the song, then by all means ...go girl!
Let us know what YOU would like to do first. K?
 
opps


[This message has been edited by Layth (edited 04-18-2000).]
 
I am a guitar player but can fake a little on a keyboard. Through advice in this forum I bought a Casio WK1300. It works great, has tremendous flexibility and has very good rhythm patterns that you can pump into your BR8.

Excellent advice in the prior posts.Don't let the technology frustrate and stiffle the creative stuff. Back away a little and it will all look a bit clearer to you.

Good luck!
 
Heres a thought, if you want to get into the technical stuff later record your songs with a click track. That way you will be able to sync drums, guitar midi-keyboards ect. later. just keep it on a seperate track and depending on what software you are using it should be easy to keep everything in time. I am not familar with the Br8 but if you are using the computer to record a click track should be easy. Tell us more about your setup.

Layth
 
Negotiator- Its funny you mentioned the wk-300 because i actually bought that one and returned it because it had no floppy disk. It was the easiest one to use though. As far as drum sounds are concerned all i need is the option to switch rhythms in middle of a song and record breaks as well (like when a song changes keys in middle , the rhythms generally "pauses" ) it has the 16 track mixer which is good and i guess as long as i keep batteries in it i can remove the plug without losing what is saved?? I not 100% sure though. So maybe I should go back to that casio. Although piano is really my forte i know a keyboard is super neccesary in any half-assed studio (like mine :)). OK so im gonna start writing down my songs and take it slow. The metronome is a great idea in the meantime though- I WILL SURVIVE...Ok great. Thanx ppl :) Oh and if anyone has time- what is an mp3 and how do i make one from zip disk?
 
Shana,

If you want to get into and enjoy recording, don't jump in headfirst. It would be crazy to strive for perfection when you first start out, simply because "true perfection just doesn’t exist", you also don't have the skills that can only be acquired with time or a multi million dollar budget.

Other equipment you can buy really just adds to your songs. The difference it can make is significant, but not a necessity, especially for home recordists.

A good place to start would be to just learn your equipment. I think one of the best ways to do this is, just record everything you do. When you are just mucking around record it; that’s normally when I find ideas that could be developed. The BR-8 takes 100 MB Zip disks i belive, and on standard mode is capable of recording 50 mins, so keep a few spare so you can come back and listen to your tracks a week later. As you are just experimenting with vocals or guitar, play with your microphone position. You can learn allot, when you are just listening back over what you have recorded. You will learn what sounds you like best and how to achieve them.

Also run parts of what you record through the BR-8's built-in FX, it will help you understand how all the FX work and what they do.

If you master your own equipment you will then be able to decide where you want to take your recording (and what it's lacking), and what extra equiptment you will need if any.

MP3's are an audio format. It is primarily used for songs over the Internet. To convert your saved music into MP3's you would probably need to run one of the outputs of you BR-8 into your computers sound card, and convert the signal using one of the various MP3 software packages.

Above all remember to have FUN!!! (don't let all the technical talk turn you off)
omnipotent
 
Shana,

If you want to get into and enjoy recording, don't jump in headfirst. It would be crazy to strive for perfection when you first start out, simply because "true perfection just doesn’t exist", you also don't have the skills that can only be acquired with time or a multi million dollar budget.

Other equipment you can buy really just adds to your songs. The difference it can make is significant, but not a necessity, especially for home recordists.

A good place to start would be to just learn your equipment. I think one of the best ways to do this is, just record everything you do. When you are just mucking around record it; that’s normally when I find ideas that could be developed. The BR-8 takes 100 MB Zip disks i belive, and on standard mode is capable of recording 50 mins, so keep a few spare so you can come back and listen to your tracks a week later. As you are just experimenting with vocals or guitar, play with your microphone position. You can learn allot, when you are just listening back over what you have recorded. You will learn what sounds you like best and how to achieve them.

Also run parts of what you record through the BR-8's built-in FX, it will help you understand how all the FX work and what they do.

If you master your own equipment you will then be able to decide where you want to take your recording (and what it's lacking), and what extra equiptment you will need if any.

MP3's are an audio format. It is primarily used for songs over the Internet. To convert your saved music into MP3's you would probably need to run one of the outputs of you BR-8 into your computers sound card, and convert the signal using one of the various MP3 software packages.

Above all remember to have FUN!!! (don't let all the technical talk turn you off) :)
omnipotent
 
Shana,

I do kinda like the click track. I use the canned beats on my keyboard to keep an even tempo. I just let it run, rather than programing any changes (of course i don't have to, my tunes are monotonous!!) come up with an arrangement and make a sort of map of the chord changes, how many phrases, etc.
(intro 4x---verse 1 4x....
Then I put down a guitar track and usually a scratch vocal. and start building from there eventually covering my canned drum track. My whole process stems from the fact that I can't play drums without a guitar to listen to, and I can't keep the guitar in time without drums. Its a bit time consuming, but i didn't see an alternative for myself.

Hope that's of some help-lzb
 
Spend all day in your room (or wherever your equipment is) and press every button on every piece of equipment you have. Then turn a knob somewhere and press every button again. You'll find out more than people can tell you.
 
Here's my 2 cents. Download the free demo of Cakewalk Pro Audio 9 and just play around with it. It does most everything the purchased version does except save and print. There are demo songs that will maybe help you visualize the way things are put together. You can also record your own and see how the parts fit together on the screen. Midi and analog/digital. You can play with the waveforms and timing and drumbeats, etc. You can save to tape or cd. You just won't be able to save the Cakewalk file. You can download midi files and play them through your keyboards sound module or record midi, or audio, from your keyboard. I think it's a good learning tool as well as a good recording tool for when you do start to do your own stuff. Anyway, it's a thought.
 
Hi Shana,

When I am having trouble remembering the exact timing and chord changes in my songs I sometimes make bar lines on a piece of paper and then use little slashes to indicate the number of beats per chord. And I write little notes like "back to section A" or whatever to help me get the timing right.

Another thing you can try is to memorize small sections of your songs and get so that you can play them the same way every time.

Another thing that is fun is to press record and record your piano and voice at the same time and go through the whole song. Billy Joel always records his vocals while he is playing his piano.

Above all - have fun cause it is fun. The money I spent on my little four-track was some of the best dough I've ever spent.

Tucci
 
Shana,
Check out the MR-76 a 64-voice performance/composition keyboard by Ensoniq or its successor, ZR-76. It has 76 hammer action keys, 16 track sequencer, disk drive, drum machine, various patches, and effects.
Best keyboard I have ever bought. Good Luck!
 
Ok I'm gonna check out that keyboard and keep you posted. I record guitar and vocals together often and if i position the mike so that its tilted up torwards my face it picks up the vocals real well and leaves the guitar more subtle. I'm gonna have to get another mike if i want to ty this with piano-(its easier to sing with guitar then with piano though) I'm in the process of buying a computer and in the meantime if i download one more thing on to this ol' thing it definitely will explode :) As soon as i do i will heed your advice, monty. I checked out fasoft.com. Does anyone know about that because the impression im getting is that one can record using their computer only. So why do i need the br8 at all? one more thing- im buying a computer- do i need to buy anything specific to start recording with it? From what i see i can download all kinds of things online so i dont need to buy software or anything right? Lambo- How much does that keyboard cost? ?(Cha-ching!)
Thanx people
 
You will need a sound card. A lot of computers will come with a soundblaster card or similar which will let you get your feet wet. After about 3 days of that you will want a multitrack sound card. There's several to choose from. The higher the khz, the more hard disk space you will use. Some people hear the difference between 48khz and 98khz. CD quality is 44khz. You be the judge. Don't get a Macintosh computer. Naturally, the bigger and faster your PC is the better will be the overall recording experience. Some of the guys here use N-track software for recording. There's a free demo on the web. Fasoft I have no experience with. Maybe it's good, don't know. Cool Edit Pro must have a demo also. I think it came with my Gadgetlabs sound card but I'm a Cakewalk fan so I never used it. As you can tell, there is no shortage of advice here. Maybe it helps if you're a woman, so keep asking the questions and check out the homepage. Lots of easy to understand magazines and books on the subject are available. You go girl...grasshopper.
 
Or you could just write the song and see if it stands on it's own merit....The record it if it does.

What a concept.

That's the way us old guys do it.

That's my opinion.
 
I see i have a lot of smart/experienced people here so im gonna move on to another issue. Now that ive started recording (thanx to all of you of course) ive discovered this problem if you will. I obviously cant record a whole song in one sitting so whats the best way to record different sections of the song at different times? Different tracks? Cut and paste? I dont like when the song sounds glues together. How can i make the sections (intro, chorus) flow into eachother-remember, im recording all on one track . (Ex. main guitar which plays thru the whole song)
Ok- im all ears :)
 
What I do is record the drum track first. even If it's not the drums I'm going to use for the song, I just get the beat down because it's easiest to play other parts from the beat. From there, I lay down the bass, guitar, vocals, whatever on a seperate track while listening to the recorded drums.

You spent a whole lot of money on having 8 tracks, use them! If you have all your instruments on seperate tracks, it makes it possible to effectivly mix down your song. Choose which instrument is "driving" the song and record it first. Then you just play everything on other tracks while listening to the tracks you've put down.

As far as computers go, I'd say if you have the BR8, you DON'T need to get a multitrack card. All you need is a soundcard suitible for mixing down onto, favorably one with digital inputs. I use an MD8 to record, then mix down onto a cheapy Gateway soundard. It sound fine to me, and that's all that really matters.

I hope that helps.

-Nilbog

Oh yeah, and welcome to the first known female member to this BBS! :)
 
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