Guitar recording tips

[kcearl]

Im trying to record my acoustic twelve string, unfortunately I live downtown in a very noisy apartment block so Im trying to us a rim mounted (ooh err) pickup directly into Sonar via a mixer and and a toneport DI..

Problem is I loose so much of the lush sound of the guitar and was wondering if anyone had any tips to get some of that sound back??

On the software side I have GR3 and Pod farm platinum...on the hardware side I have a POD 2.0 and a X V-Amp..plus various plugs

I also have a small amp, a condenser and dynamic mics but it is constantly noisy in here with construction and my locality to a hospital... so they seem out of the picture.

Sorry if this is long winded any help or suggestions greatly appreciated

 

[gcapel]

I am affraid your going to have the same problems using the same pickup with other processing (which is all attack and no over all sound of the guitar). The only real thing I could suggest is the LR Baggs stuff. But nothing will replace the ambiants of mic'ing.

 

[kcearl]

I was afraid of that...at the moment I can only record vocals on a Sunday afternoon here...guess I'll have to fit the guitar in as well..

are there any artificial effects I could use to recreate the ambients? its not in the forefront of the mix so Id maybe get away with it??

 

[mixsit]

Even if you just section off a small mic area with fiberglass faced batts or whatever it would at least knock down the noise. Then a blend of the two?

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

If you have an interior bathroom with no outside wall or window, you could try recording in there to get a very lively sound and minimize noise leakage from outside. If it's too lively, which many bathrooms can be, just hanging a heavy blanket over the shower rod and/or a few strategically placed stuffed pillows can deaden it just enough to give you a good mix of lively and dead.

Additionally, you can try a homemade microphone isolator. I think there are probably plans for those in the Studio Building forum. the general idea is to build a box that's padded on the inside, but has an open face facing towards the subject you wish to record. This would allow the guitar sound and *some* room sound to come in the front while blocking most of the leakage from coming in from any of the sides.

G.

 

[kcearl]

My bathroom is like a shoebox..and as with most one bed apartments here blocking of a section of the living room isnt really going to happen...but thanks for all the suggestions..I had an incling that there was no software options around this...nor really could there be..it is a 12 string and their sound should be impossible to replicate

I move in December so maybe I can make my own space there

but Im going to try the pillows, blanket bathroom idea anyway if I can (at least its cheap )...seems such a shame not to use the instrument

keep 'em coming if there's anything else..

again thanks everyone

 

[mixsit]

I.. The only real thing I could suggest is the LR Baggs stuff..

Would that be the dual systems- internal mic + p/u? It's a step in the right direction perhaps.

 

[kcearl]

Would that be the dual systems- internal mic + p/u? It's a step in the right direction perhaps.

interesting....


Im putting it through the preamps on Pod Fram with a little EQ, analog chorus and delay and at least its stopped sounding like a banjo...so there may be some hope...

 

[tvaillan]

We're on the same boat.

First post since feb 2004 btw.

Maybe this will help. Maybe it won't.

I have this nice Yamaha acoustic and although it plays so well, the internal pickup doesn't do it justice. It was so frutrating.

I tried effects, and was happy-ish with the sound, until i realized that effects didn't really do any good in the long run. A good acoustic track has to sound good dry. You add effects to suit the mix, not the recording deficiencies.

Found that even a single large condenser (not necessarily expensive) did a better job a few feet away than the pickup.

UNFORTUNATELY the environmental noise became an issue. So came-out mic stands covered with blankets and pillows , acoustic foam .. and all that FUN stuff. That did the trick until the day I wanted a nice acoustic intro all by itself. My guitar didn't have the stereo width required for really nice sound.

I finally bought two pencil condenser mics (i'll leave the positioning to you), and used a 3 mic setup. (Kept my large condenser a few feet away to pickup the center and room) Not necessary.

UNFORTUNATELY 3 mics are more sensitive than 1. Now noise is an issue again. My setup can pick-up the cat scratching his behind two rooms away.

(and i don't like compressors and noise gates for recording acoustic.)

Moral of my story is that if you're mixing in your acoustic guitar with existing instruments and your acoustic isn't the main focus, then you might be able to get away with a single mic and all those pillows and blankets. If you're really really good, you might even be able to double-track your acoustic. This never worked for me.

If your music relies heavily on the depth of your acoustic and your compositions are un-cluttered, then honestly you're looking at at least 2 microphones and some major noise problems in a noisy room.

So you're moving in december ey?

Oh and my solution:

Record your parts with what you have, take it easy on the effects, but PROMISE yourself that you'll try again later with microphones when your situation allows it.

 

[kcearl]

First post since feb 2004 btw.

Maybe this will help. Maybe it won't.

I have this nice Yamaha acoustic and although it plays so well, the internal pickup doesn't do it justice. It was so frutrating.

I tried effects, and was happy-ish with the sound, until i realized that effects didn't really do any good in the long run. A good acoustic track has to sound good dry. You add effects to suit the mix, not the recording deficiencies.

Found that even a single large condenser (not necessarily expensive) did a better job a few feet away than the pickup.

UNFORTUNATELY the environmental noise became an issue. So came-out mic stands covered with blankets and pillows , acoustic foam .. and all that FUN stuff. That did the trick until the day I wanted a nice acoustic intro all by itself. My guitar didn't have the stereo width required for really nice sound.

I finally bought two pencil condenser mics (i'll leave the positioning to you), and used a 3 mic setup. (Kept my large condenser a few feet away to pickup the center and room) Not necessary.

UNFORTUNATELY 3 mics are more sensitive than 1. Now noise is an issue again. My setup can pick-up the cat scratching his behind two rooms away.

(and i don't like compressors and noise gates for recording acoustic.)

Moral of my story is that if you're mixing in your acoustic guitar with existing instruments and your acoustic isn't the main focus, then you might be able to get away with a single mic and all those pillows and blankets. If you're really really good, you might even be able to double-track your acoustic. This never worked for me.

If your music relies heavily on the depth of your acoustic and your compositions are un-cluttered, then honestly you're looking at at least 2 microphones and some major noise problems in a noisy room.

So you're moving in december ey?

Oh and my solution:

Record your parts with what you have, take it easy on the effects, but PROMISE yourself that you'll try again later with microphones when your situation allows it.

It all seems to lead back to the same solution...there's no way im going to get away with mics at the moment...got a condo in the midst of going up across the street, thats without the hospitals helicopters, sirens (Toronto Sick Kids..busiest in Canada??)

Got the place to myself tonight so Im actually going to try recording late to see if i can get away with it...shame, just bought the pickup after dragging the 12 string across from the UK last week..

Yup leaving the great Canuckstan after two an a half years here...the winters finally broke the wife....me Im a boarder, I love it, six months wasn't enough!!

 

[hemeltz]

It's been a while since this has been posted on, but maybe you'll get the message. I would try recording two tracks: One with the pickup and one with a microphone. If you can't do two seperate tracks one would suffice, it would just take a lot of adjusting beforehand to get the right sound. Once recorded, you might be able to mix the two tracks together with volume on the mic lower to minimize background noise, and a thin pickup track to hide it. Then with some creative EQ you might be able to get a good balance between the depth of the guitar (from the condenser) and the flatness of the pickup to hopefully gain back some, if not all, of the lost 12 string sound.
Just thinking off the top of my head. Good luck!
BTW I'm a boarder too. Enjoy the riding while you can!
Harry