E
ermghoti
New member
So, the genius Outlaws left me anonymous negative feedback:
And what prompted this limp wristed slap?
The fact that I have heard these tube amp vrs modeler sample wars before? The fact that DI is going to record cleaner than a mic in less-than-perfect conditions? The fact that while I and many others can hear the difference between a tube amp and a modeler, that the bigger difference is in the performer? That MP3's are totally unsuitable for critical listening? How much of a neophyte does one have to be to disagree with any of this paragraph?
Your illiterate IM-speak suggests that the 16 years I have played guitar is about as long as you have wasted air. You want to argue there is no difference betwen amps and modelers? Fine. You want to argue modelers are better than amps for some purposes? Go nuts. I may agree. You want to hit me with some bad rep? Be a man, instead of a little bitch.
You want to hide and throw shit at me for stating facts? Fuck yourself in the eye with your gay dad's diseased dick.
Anybody else: go read the only other post by me in this thread, and explain to me where I am out of line.
Cumfunnel said:
And what prompted this limp wristed slap?
The fact that I have heard these tube amp vrs modeler sample wars before? The fact that DI is going to record cleaner than a mic in less-than-perfect conditions? The fact that while I and many others can hear the difference between a tube amp and a modeler, that the bigger difference is in the performer? That MP3's are totally unsuitable for critical listening? How much of a neophyte does one have to be to disagree with any of this paragraph?
Your illiterate IM-speak suggests that the 16 years I have played guitar is about as long as you have wasted air. You want to argue there is no difference betwen amps and modelers? Fine. You want to argue modelers are better than amps for some purposes? Go nuts. I may agree. You want to hit me with some bad rep? Be a man, instead of a little bitch.
You want to hide and throw shit at me for stating facts? Fuck yourself in the eye with your gay dad's diseased dick.
Anybody else: go read the only other post by me in this thread, and explain to me where I am out of line.
E
ericlingus
New member
lol this thread is so hateful \m/
metalhead28
Hates Raymond
I just wanted to say.....I love alla youse guys!
Alotta love in this thread!
Alotta love in this thread!
E
ericlingus
New member
all this hate is inspiring me to write frostbitten black metal ! raaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
metalhead28
Hates Raymond
ericlingus said:
I heard you can get the best tone for that by sticking a POD in a freezer.
S
Superhuman
Shagaholic
Check out the Marshall 100FDFX - it's got great tone, some nice basic effects and a whopping 100 wats. Great value for the money.
cellardweller
New member
metalhead28 said:
This thread makes my no-no's tingle.
Where's the samples?
C'mon while I'm at work with a non-dialup connection!
cellardweller
New member
You must FIRST sacrifice a goat and chicken and smear the blood of both on the POD.metalhead28 said:
THEN you stick it in the freezer whilst incantating "satan's our pal, satan's our friend...he's just a cool guy and a cool dude ...!!!TUBES!!!".
You will then possess the power of 736 virgin Triple Recitifier's on steroids and crack.
IronFlippy
Dedicated To My Member
Well, it sounds best if you stick a POD in front of a tube amp and then record it in the far north. At least that's what I've heard. Ever wonder why there are so many metal bands from northern Europe? Because it's frosty up there!metalhead28 said:
cellardweller
New member
Reading your signature has me curious.IronFlippy said:
Does Chuck Norris play Black Metal?
It would have to be the most awesome black metal....
IronFlippy
Dedicated To My Member
Yea, but no one's ever heard him play. He just sort of goes on stage, says he's a metal band, and if anyone disagrees, they get roundhouse kicked. Needless to say, no one disagrees.cellardweller said:
metalhead28
Hates Raymond
Black metal must be recorded on a boom box, then played back into a trash can and recorded onto an answering machine. For a true kult sound you must then play that through a telephone and record it again onto a handheld tape recorder with a 27 year old tape.
There is no other way for true kult black metal.
By the way....I'm gonna do some samples but I probably won't do them until this weekend. I'm still working on a mix for another band.
There is no other way for true kult black metal.
By the way....I'm gonna do some samples but I probably won't do them until this weekend. I'm still working on a mix for another band.
cellardweller
New member
Chuck Norris
All he would have to do is say "black metal" and Satan himself would instantly manifest on stage to play lead guitar through 666 Triple Recitifier's on steroids and crack.
Man... what would happen if he said "death metal"?
All he would have to do is say "black metal" and Satan himself would instantly manifest on stage to play lead guitar through 666 Triple Recitifier's on steroids and crack.
Man... what would happen if he said "death metal"?
IronFlippy
Dedicated To My Member
I dunno, lots of death maybe. Who gave me the rep labeled "SWEET!"?
gbdweller
Structural Member
No rumble?
Too bad. I was looking forward to watching a good axe rumble. Even if it was just to hear how everyone gets their sound. Oh well. Guess I'll go put my POD in the snow and record some tones.
Does anyone have advise? Is yellow snow better or should I stick with the white? 
Too bad. I was looking forward to watching a good axe rumble. Even if it was just to hear how everyone gets their sound. Oh well. Guess I'll go put my POD in the snow and record some tones.
Does anyone have advise? Is yellow snow better or should I stick with the white?
M
mike2731
New member
I got a Peavey Triple XXX EFX 40 Watt Tube combo on sale for $499 from Musician's Friend not too long ago. That amp has tons of gain for Metal. Not sure if they still have them or not, but they would fit your style nicel.
As for the tube vs. modeler debate. There are a couple things to keep in mind. 1 is a modeler by definition is trying to emulate the sound of a driven tube amp in it's driven tones. The technology in itself would pretty much prohibit it from being "better" than what it is modeling. That said, there is a HUGE difference in "tube amps". I think some people may be arguing apples and oranges here. Remember, not all tube amps are made for hi-gain sounds. Different amps will contain different numbers of gain stages. Not everyone wants a hi-gain sound, so not every tube amp is made to do so. So yes, a modeler is going to sound better than a 1 gain stage tube amp, since that amp won't be able to capture a metal sound. However, the modeler will not sound heavier than a tube amp made for the appropriate style of play.
As for the tube vs. modeler debate. There are a couple things to keep in mind. 1 is a modeler by definition is trying to emulate the sound of a driven tube amp in it's driven tones. The technology in itself would pretty much prohibit it from being "better" than what it is modeling. That said, there is a HUGE difference in "tube amps". I think some people may be arguing apples and oranges here. Remember, not all tube amps are made for hi-gain sounds. Different amps will contain different numbers of gain stages. Not everyone wants a hi-gain sound, so not every tube amp is made to do so. So yes, a modeler is going to sound better than a 1 gain stage tube amp, since that amp won't be able to capture a metal sound. However, the modeler will not sound heavier than a tube amp made for the appropriate style of play.
cellardweller
New member
Ahh man, you're the guy who got the last one!mike2731 said:
Seriously, I was looking at them, but I read some bad things at cacophony central about them overheating or having other problems.
So how do you like it, and how long have you had it?
I think I'm leaning toward the 60 watt version, though I may still consider the 40 watt (even though that "special" is no longer valid),
K
kludge
New member
Seems to me you need to be a bit more specific than "metal" when talking about getting heavy guitar tones. The term has become synonymous with "maximum gain", when in fact some of the heaviest guitar tones on record weren't high gain at all.
There's also a lot of confuzzlement between our image of a live metal rig (Marshalls and Boogies on 4x12 cabs), versus what really got used to record the studio sound. Jimmy Page is the classic example... everyone thinks of Les Pauls and walls of Marshalls (his live rig) when they think of his sound, but he mostly used Telecasters and little Supro combo amps in the studio. And what sounds heavier than Led Zeppelin?
Another problem with super-high-gain is it magnifies your technique issues, little squeaks and touches. It also kills dynamics, which add drama. And it kills the tonal envelope of sustained notes. Honestly, with a few exceptions (early Metallica, for example), I think of super-high-gain tones as "kid music", for guitarists unable to tell the difference between HEAVY and merely distorted.
A better approach would be to cite some specific, well-known recorded examples of good "metal" tone and look into their techniques. A better-yet approach would be to work hard on developing a deeply personal sound.
And remember, it's not just the amp... it's also the guitar, the mic technique, and most importantly, YOUR HANDS!!! A master guitarist can sound heavier on a child's acoustic than a wanker can with a detuned ESP and a wall of Soldanos.
There's also a lot of confuzzlement between our image of a live metal rig (Marshalls and Boogies on 4x12 cabs), versus what really got used to record the studio sound. Jimmy Page is the classic example... everyone thinks of Les Pauls and walls of Marshalls (his live rig) when they think of his sound, but he mostly used Telecasters and little Supro combo amps in the studio. And what sounds heavier than Led Zeppelin?
Another problem with super-high-gain is it magnifies your technique issues, little squeaks and touches. It also kills dynamics, which add drama. And it kills the tonal envelope of sustained notes. Honestly, with a few exceptions (early Metallica, for example), I think of super-high-gain tones as "kid music", for guitarists unable to tell the difference between HEAVY and merely distorted.
A better approach would be to cite some specific, well-known recorded examples of good "metal" tone and look into their techniques. A better-yet approach would be to work hard on developing a deeply personal sound.
And remember, it's not just the amp... it's also the guitar, the mic technique, and most importantly, YOUR HANDS!!! A master guitarist can sound heavier on a child's acoustic than a wanker can with a detuned ESP and a wall of Soldanos.
K
kludge
New member
As for modelers versus tube amps... heck, they both work. I had a Vox Valvetronix for a bit, and it was remarkably good, especially for those "metal" tones. But my little Trace-Elliot 15w tube amp knocked it silly when it came to tonal complexity and richness at medium-high gains at similar volumes. That's the sort of zone I play in, so I'd mic the Velocette rather than using the modeler for any serious recording. But that doesn't mean modelers are bad... it just means they don't work for ME.
Another thing to consider is multi-sourcing, mixing multiple amps (or even external devices) for your tone. Last weekend, I was recording some lap steel in a better studio than mine. It was amped through a Savage Rohr (like a small Marshallesque combo) at not-quite-clipping - fat but not crunchy. The tone was good but the shape of the notes wasn't right. So we split the signal and ran it in parallel through a Distressor compressor into the board. THAT was the tone! The compressor gave me the right attack and decay behavior, and the amp gave me the fat harmonics. You could do the same sort of thing by mixing an amp with a modeler, or miking two amps together (say, one with a tight bottom and one with nice fizz). You can even EQ them to get the best from each signal.
Lots of work, that, but if you want tone of your own, that's how to do it.
Another thing to consider is multi-sourcing, mixing multiple amps (or even external devices) for your tone. Last weekend, I was recording some lap steel in a better studio than mine. It was amped through a Savage Rohr (like a small Marshallesque combo) at not-quite-clipping - fat but not crunchy. The tone was good but the shape of the notes wasn't right. So we split the signal and ran it in parallel through a Distressor compressor into the board. THAT was the tone! The compressor gave me the right attack and decay behavior, and the amp gave me the fat harmonics. You could do the same sort of thing by mixing an amp with a modeler, or miking two amps together (say, one with a tight bottom and one with nice fizz). You can even EQ them to get the best from each signal.
Lots of work, that, but if you want tone of your own, that's how to do it.
