fretless bass - does it pay off?

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smirky

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I consider buying a fretless bass. my questions are: does it JUST make sense to play fretless if you are perfect in playing on frets? can you use the fretless more than once in ten songs or is it just suitable for very few songs?
any recommendations in case I buy one?
thanks, smirky
 
they do different jobs

Now I'm a guitar player but I've played both fretless electric as well as "standup" contrabass on occasion.
Now my accoustic guitar does a different job from an electric or a classical or a dobro etc.
Modern pop rarely uses fretless, though it is fairly common in jazz.So the "need" probably wouldn't be there.But if you got the bucks to add one to your arsenal of axes anyway,well, they are cool!
Tom
 
It truely depends on what sound you are looking for. I have been playing fetless for some time now, and I use it exclusively, for all different genres of music.

Fretless *typically* has a much warmer tone than a fretted, and tends to have a *buzz* to the notes, almost like a natural distortion if you will. It is also a much more demanding instrument to play, due largely to the fact that it is played more by feel and ear than sight and touch. Accurate placement of fingers is no longer as crucial, as is your ability to bring a given note into tune before anyone notices. You also tend to use a lot more slides in your playing... giving it a kind of warm, lazy feel.

Your ears then become the most important part to your playing, and you will find yourself defending them in the same way you would your hands. I found myself listening to music differently, and I am now much better at picking out notes by ear. I used to have to look at my hands when I played fretted, and I realized when I picked up frettless that it was going to be of no help.

Bottom line, it all comes down to what sound you want, and how hard you are willing to work to achieve it. With enough practice, and familiarity with your specific instrument you *can* fool people into thinking it is fretted, [but] why would you want too? :)

One more thing, less blisters: using flatwound or nylon wrapped strings is quite silky on the fingers, and is the only way to go, unless you want to sand your frettboard every week! :)

If you have any more questions, I'll assist the best I can.

To hear examples of fretless bass with metal music, and performed quite amazingly, check out Ahgora, and Cynic (the album Focus is all fretless bass. And Sean Reinert is one kick ass drummer :) )

Good luck!
 
Ive played both for many years and "Rocinante" makes lots of good points about playing one.
You Play it and play it untill it becomes natural.

I would get one as a SECOND BASS. I think there is a lot
more versitility in a fretted, using your EQ. etc.
Slap Pop to a smooth warm sound.

Defenitly if your in a cover band go fretted.
 
Fretless

As long as you try to make the fretless sound that way...too many people try to sound like they are playing a fretted instrument.Steve Bailey once said that after he played a session with a fretless that another session player
said,"you made it sound as though it wasn't even fretless!"
While this was meant as a compliment on his technique and intonation,Steve realized that he had polished the fretless sound right out of the instrument.
 
I walked into Mars Music in the spring of 1999 and there was a fretless Yamahe RBX260 4 string bass for $199.The last thing on my mind that day was buying a fretless bass,but the thing looked pretty good so I picked it up.I had never tried to play a fretless before that day,and a half hour later I realized I was having fun,so I bought it.There are certain types of songs and moods that it really is perfect for.This particular model has the fret lines on the fingerboard,which I would recommend for all neophytes like me.I find I prefer the sound of roundwound strings on it,but alas,the rosewood board is already showing signs of the strings tearing it up,so I'll probably get some epoxy or something put on it soon.I don't care for thesound of flatwounds much,but that's a personal thing.Mwah!
 
Haven't hear much fretless but...

Check out what Mick Karn does with a fretless. It sounds like a completely different instrument than ordinary fretted bass... :)
 
DEAR GOD! NO!!! NOT EPOXY!!!!!!!!!

Virtual.ray: Fender makes a special set of round wound strings for fretless, they are wrapped in very fine black nylon tape. This results in a round-wound sound, without chewing the shit out of your fretboard. That's what I use, and I must say I am quite pleased with their tone.

If your neck is chewed up, then you'll need to refinish it (this should be done about every 6 months,, depending on frequency of play and amount of "chewedness" of the fret board) With the tip if your finger, apply a small amount of Minwax Tung Oil to a small area of the fretboard, then with a small section (about 1.5" square) of at LEAST 300 grit sand paper (the black kind), gently *sand* the area where you applied the oil, in a circular motion. The best is to start at the nut,and repeat all the way toward the bridge. NEVER SAND DRY! Always with TUNG OIL by MINWAX, I have never used any other kind, and the luthier who built my bass, told me only to use that, so I stick by it.

This will clean up imperfections, and re-oil the fretboard.

hope this helps. :)
 
I am a guitar player, who plays exclusively fretless bass occasionally to fill in on gigs. I've never had a complaint that the fretless didn't sound appropriate for the pop/rock stuff that the bands I filled in for played. However, some people can't get beyond the fact that the instrument is fretless, and so I quit one band who kept insisting that I get a fretted bass. In high school I played some upright bass in jazz band as well as fretted and fretless bass, and fell in love with the fluidity of the fretless' playability. It takes less effort to play, and there is none of that annoying fret buzz. But, just as a warning...there exists a bias against the instrument among the uninitiated.
 
I play funk/jazz which a lot of the times I like to run scales,syncopated riffs and thumb slaps. Using a fretless allows one to run up and down the neck (providing one knows proper finger placement) effortlessly and smoothly. Using the thumb slap on a fretless is also beneficial as you won't encounter that fret "buzz" sound when using that particular percussive technique.
Basically what ever you're comfortable with go for it, though I have known others who purchased them simply 'cause it "looks good"!
 
Rocinante,thanks for the tip on the strings,I'll check 'em out.I'm confused,however,about your warning not to use epoxy.I definetely remember reading that Jaco Pastorius used boat epoxy on the fingerboard of his Jazz bass once he took the frets out.What's bad about it,and what is a better alternative,"cause it seems to me that one can only go so far with the sanding solution before one runs out of wood...
 
virtual.ray:

Use the Minwax Tung Oil, as I described above, it keeps the fretboard supple, tough and serves to protect it. The *light* sanding doesn't necessarily remove the wood, but when mixed with the oil the dust will be spread around and fill in minor gaps and such. Remember, you are not sanding the shit out of it, just a light circular rubbing that will smooth out the wearpoints. it is CRUCIAL that you use no less than 300 grit, and that the area you are *sanding* is lubed with the tung oil. This procedure could take upwards of an hour, keep repeating until you are satisfied with the result. Then use those nylon wraps ;)

Depending on how bad the fretboard is chewed up, and how hard you are sanding, under normal circumstances it should take upwards of 50 years to sand through your fretboard :)

As for Pastorious, he is the father of fretless electric, and pulling the frets to make a bass a fretless is a whole different hockey game. You would have to use boat epoxy to make up for the wood filler or whatever you used to fill in the fret slots. When it's constructed as a fretless, treat the fretboard as antique wood/furniture. Oils are much healthier for the wood, and allow it to breath properly. Plus the fact that *most* fretless' fretboards are just a piece of (insert dark wood type here) that has been oiled and sanded over and over again until the oil has penetrated all the wood. It's a lot less messy too...
 
Thanks guys, I think I'll get one within the next weeks! However I don't want to spend my whole savings, so could you recommend any of the cheaper fretless types like Yamaha?
and Fender roundwound strings?
thanks again, smirky
 
Smirky: I'm not sure if Yamaha makes a fretless, but for a cheaper one, try Samick, I know they make fretless, and they retail for about $500-$600 here in canada, so probably ~$400 in the US. Don't use round wound strings on a fretless, unless you don't mind tearing up your fretboard. you have three choices for strings: flatwound, they have a little bit of a *dead* sound; ground-wound, a little brighter, but they still scratch the shit out of your fretboard (not as bad as rounds though); and nylon wrap. Fender (as far as I know) are the only company that makes them. You may have to specially order them, as I have only ever found one store that carries them as regular stock. They are not much more expensive than regular quality bass strings, and they sound great without making a meal of your fret-board. Plus they are black, so they look cool too...

Enjoy!
 
oil and finish thoughts

Too much oil will ROT the wood.Its kind of like a houseplant.If it is constantly wet or dry, both are bad states.Alternating moisture and drying out is better.Most wood necks (after a very short time of use) absorb enough finger oil to keep them from drying and cracking and so needing so much oiling.
As to finish repair and filling fretslots.I was a Charvel/Jackson tech for a couple of years and we were taught the Dan Earlywine superglue techniques.Look at the Stewart-McDonald site for info and the special runny cyanoacrilate necessary to wick into cracks.
Tom
 
YO SMIRKY

i have a yamaha rb60 fretless that i got @ mars music for less than 200. although i play both guitar & bass, i've never owned a bass before & thought that if i was going to buy one that fretless was the way to go.
simply put- you CAN make a fretless sound fretted, but you CAN'T make a fretted bass sound fretless. there is just no comparison.
the yamaha has nice sound & is great for the price!
:D VIVA LA SUPER SLINKYS!!!!!
 
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